2017 Manor F1 Team - Mercedes

[ME4ME]

HAAS isn't stupid. If you look at this only with eyes as grabbing 40 million, then you have no idea how this works.
..
if it was that simple, ANYBODY would buy that outfit for crying out loud.

no, i'm sad to say, sauber killed manor by snatching that brazil spot. it's that unfair.
my disgust for kaltenborn grows even further.
..

it's over. there's no more way around it. several years of keeping it up, and kaltenwh*res outfit just steps on them pushing them below the mudline. dead and gone..

Dude why the bitterness? Also how is it Saubers' fault for actually beating them on track. Go blame FOM.

[PlatinumZealot]

I really don't understand the kaltenborn hate. And if it was was any other season sauber would have easily secured 10th spit. And no sauber were smart enough not to rely on causaulty to secure themselves for 2017. It was mr fitzpatrick for being tricked by Toto into running those mercedes drivers for little or nothing. Should have ran honda engines for free and stock up on those pay drivers.

[i70q7m7ghw]

no, i'm sad to say, sauber killed manor by snatching that brazil spot. it's that unfair.
my disgust for kaltenborn grows even further. sure, sauber was there when manor wasn't in brazil, but manor has done
supremely much better throughout the entire year EXCEPT for exactly that gp, and it completely gutted them.

so sad to see the absolute favourite underdog end up like that, especially as it seemed like they were picking themselves up again.

what a waste.

i think it was plain to see that manor was over and done when Wehrlein signed with Sauber. why on earth would they when manor would still be around. additionally, even if sauber was the prefered choise, it means that with pascal gone, aswell as ocon, 2 mercedes drivers, you can guarantee the engine discount is out of the window too.

that means the cost goes up by several tens of millions next year.
Haryanto's sponsor also stepped away from him so there's really less and less to offer manor, and less for manor to provide.

it's over. there's no more way around it. several years of keeping it up, and kaltenwh*res outfit just steps on them pushing them below the mudline. dead and gone.

What a load of tripe.

[Scuderia1967]

I really don't understand the kaltenborn hate. And if it was was any other season sauber would have easily secured 10th spit. And no sauber were smart enough not to rely on causaulty to secure themselves for 2017. It was mr fitzpatrick for being tricked by Toto into running those mercedes drivers for little or nothing. Should have ran honda engines for free and stock up on those pay drivers.

How would they do that, when McLaren vetoed Honda from delivering its engine to a second team?
As for the people blaming Sauber for Manor's downfall, let me remind you all what Dave Ryan said not long ago:
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/manor ... er-851630/

[Manoah2u]

Well, the Mercedes engines that catapulted Mclaren back to the front after hideous peugeot engines and were after all nothing but 'Mercedes' branded Ilmor engines,
so yeah, it really was rather Mclaren - Ilmor.

But i don't see that happening - wasn't Illien actually working together with RedBull and Renault to 'fix' the problems there?
Perhaps that knowledge would come in handy, but i personally see Illien rather working with RB to build their own independent TAG engines.

Also, i can't see how a Dennis at Manor could in any way result in a ilmor-mercedes combo. Manor gets 'customer' mercedes engines, and they are still the best engines
of the field that really dont need anything. If any, Honda would be in biggest need of that.

Ron Dennis was the one bringing Honda into Mclaren again. IIRC, Whitmarsh apart from dealing with contractual mistakes with drivers, supposedly also endangered Honda's
return to F1, and that was reason for Ron to jump in and clean up. I thus could easily see Dennis bringing in Honda in Manor, not only because as of 2018 Honda is supposed to
start bringing customer engines. Manor is a safe bet, they're far away from Mclaren's potential. And with Ron Dennis at the helm @ Manor, and still in partial ownership of Mclaren,
things are easily manageable and in their own benefit. Imagine all of Honda knowledge under a 'single' roof.......

As for the engine discount - why buy discounted Mercedes engines and be oblidged to house a lame driver and be the 'big teams' lap dog, when you have free Honda engines at the Mclaren Mothership, and get to make a deal with Honda for buying Honda engines that cost less then a discounted Mercedes engine, and then get all the intel and information and feedback from Manor and be a driving laborotory and testing facility for the mothership, AND decide your own drivers, perhaps even a paydriver if you want to, but probably house Honda's test driver.

If I was Dennis, and i'd 'get' Manor into my portfolio, i'd have no doubt of immediately putting Honda engines in there. not a single doubt.

as for the jokel rating this down stating its incorrect, how about you come forward and state why its incorrect.

[Gridlock]

Haas regretted not buying in because there's a bunch of random stuff you get for being in Column B or whatever that he didn't get, free space on the DHL 747s, 20 airline tickets per race, that sort of thing.

[Shrieker]

Perpetually underfunded team causing casualties.

Good riddance I say. This is rich man's club whether you believe it or not; don't come with pennies in your pockets.

[Jolle]

The only reason Manor was resurrected in the first place was to get hold of the FOM money from '14 in the first place. It was a nice proposition. Invest a minimal amount in the team, sell the seats for a decent discount of the PU's or hard cash and try to get even more FOM money to beat Sauber and/or Renault. This team even hasn't got its own factory or long term strategy.

Let's hope the license gets bought by a real racing team instead of a short term investment.

[Manoah2u]

It does remind me now of HRT's ultimate days somehow. oddly enough, HRT and MRT are just 1 letter apart by now.

[f1316]

Let's hope someone can come in and save the team though - even if counting on the 10th place money was a risky and ultimately flawed strategy - because we have precious few seats in F1 and these were the last two left to get someone new/promising into (NB I still think someone like Guittierez, showing well against Grosjean in second part of the season, or Nasr with his drive in Brazil, are a shame to lose from F1 just yet).

There had been rumours that Ferrari could pay to have Giovanazzi in one of the cars (and with Werhlein in Ferrari powered Sauber that's not as crazy as it sounds), which would have been good; is there any chance Marchionne might want to save it to kick start his much-promised Alfa project? Doesn't seem a great fit since he seemed to want existing Alfa people onboard and that would mean basing the team in Italy, but could you start this way, using existing resource and design (surely the 2017 car is well progressed?) to learn before rebranding?

Long shot but just a thought.

[Gridlock]

If the premier league or NFL were missing 6 entrants, people would probably raise a bit of a fuss.

[Shakeman]

Perpetually underfunded team causing casualties.

Good riddance I say. This is rich man's club whether you believe it or not; don't come with pennies in your pockets.

Quite right, it's only fair F1 reflects the dominant economic ideology, neoliberalism, where the rich get richer and the poorer fail. It would be far too socialist if the prize money was distributed fairer.

[Fifty]

Gutierrez comes with telemex money. But the telemex money has a stipulation. The car he drives for has to be a Ferrari or use a Ferrari engine.
So if they take Gutierrez for a driver, the only way his sponsor money comes is if manor uses a Ferrari engine.

Nasr has family money...lots....but I doubt they will spend it like Strolls...

So it's a guessing game if they do stay on for the '17 season who they will have drive.
Anyone Mercedes says to really! Lol.

[Manoah2u]

i still wouldn't be surprised to see Sauber end up running Mercedes engines in 2017 after signing Wehrlein. if i'm correct, the engine mounting points are mandated to be the same, so it's only adapting the engine cover a bit and packaging, which i can't imagine being astonishingly different either.

so if sauber gets merc engines, ferrari loses a customer, and manor could get their hands on ferrari engines. wasn't manor actually running ferrari engines before when they were Marussia?

[ME4ME]

i still wouldn't be surprised to see Sauber end up running Mercedes engines in 2017 after signing Wehrlein. if i'm correct, the engine mounting points are mandated to be the same, so it's only adapting the engine cover a bit and packaging, which i can't imagine being astonishingly different either.

so if sauber gets merc engines, ferrari loses a customer, and manor could get their hands on ferrari engines. wasn't manor actually running ferrari engines before when they were Marussia?

Really? That's ridiculous