2023 pecking order predictions

[skoop]

THIS IS 2023 PECKING ORDER PREDICTION THREAD!

it does not specify the pecking order of what real ,drivers ,cars ,or anything for that matter

Seems like a lawyer entered the conversation

[jordanb]

THIS IS 2023 PECKING ORDER PREDICTION THREAD!

it does not specify the pecking order of what real ,drivers ,cars ,or anything for that matter

Correct. What exactly is George's red flag in Brazil qualifying and the events around it add to the "2023 Pecking Order" topic?

[Bill]

THIS IS 2023 PECKING ORDER PREDICTION THREAD!

it does not specify the pecking order of what real ,drivers ,cars ,or anything for that matter

Correct. What exactly is George's red flag in Brazil qualifying and the events around it add to the "2023 Pecking Order" topic?

you need to read back people where talking about rivalry in 2023 using 2022 as reference point ,implying that it will continue that how last year was bought in conversation.

[Stu]

It does, however, specify that it is for the 2023 season; therefore anything previous to that is historical (not a prediction) and pre-2023. This makes it off-topic…

[Sisyphus_1]

Lots of faith in Mercedes from many posters.
.....

...If they do it they deserve to be crowned kings of the milkyway galaxy, but it's doubtful.

I'm going to go with:
1. RB
2. SF
3. MB
4.Alpine
5. AM
6. Mclaren

Yet you have faith in AM to overcome as much (or more) of a deficit to McLaren

In the end the RB performance is the result of the first year of development. I don't see how Mercedes with their very strong team, sufficient pictures of the RB with all details to analyze and a second year of development with a wind tunnel time advantage would not be able to catch up. Not saying they will, but they definitely could (should?).

Given their history it is an easy argument to make in their favour....buuuuuut....they got these years regs wrong (by their standards) which means they are in a knowledge deficit to RB and SF.

As RB and SF had great packages from race 1, they only need to refine.

[Big Tea]

Lots of faith in Mercedes from many posters.
.....

...If they do it they deserve to be crowned kings of the milkyway galaxy, but it's doubtful.

I'm going to go with:
1. RB
2. SF
3. MB
4.Alpine
5. AM
6. Mclaren

Yet you have faith in AM to overcome as much (or more) of a deficit to McLaren

In the end the RB performance is the result of the first year of development. I don't see how Mercedes with their very strong team, sufficient pictures of the RB with all details to analyze and a second year of development with a wind tunnel time advantage would not be able to catch up. Not saying they will, but they definitely could (should?).

Given their history it is an easy argument to make in their favour....buuuuuut....they got these years regs wrong (by their standards) which means they are in a knowledge deficit to RB and SF.

As RB and SF had great packages from race 1, they only need to refine.

Alternately, if RBR got their package right 'straight out of the box' there is not going to be as much easy pickings as one that missed by a mile. Providing of course they know where the problem lies.

It is possible they still do not have a handle on 'the problem' because it did seem to vary from race to race.

[AR3-GP]

Lots of faith in Mercedes from many posters.
.....

...If they do it they deserve to be crowned kings of the milkyway galaxy, but it's doubtful.

I'm going to go with:
1. RB
2. SF
3. MB
4.Alpine
5. AM
6. Mclaren

Yet you have faith in AM to overcome as much (or more) of a deficit to McLaren

The slower teams have much lower hanging fruit than the bigger teams.

AM may well leap into the head of the midfield but breaking the top 3 won't be as simple. That's where you start to need the best of the best in terms of engineers and resources.

It's no wonder why teams like Alfa Romeo, AM, alpine, Mclaren, Williams bounce around in the rankings of the midfield, but they never actually breach the top 3. The former is much easier than the latter.

[PlatinumZealot]

The technical regs can go one of two ways.

The raised floor ruling can snip RedBull's advantage of using higher rake coupled with articulate suspension and awesome vortex sealing....

Or...

It could pay even more dividends for RedBull's mastery of sealing higher ride-height floors!!

The pecking order is a very tough call this year.

I'm getting a sense that McLaren will finally fight in the top ranks for some reason..

[chrisc90]

The technical regs can go one of two ways.

The raised floor ruling can snip RedBull's advantage of using higher rake coupled with articulate suspension and awesome vortex sealing....

Or...

It could pay even more dividends for RedBull's mastery of sealing higher ride-height floors!!

The pecking order is a very tough call this year.

I'm getting a sense that McLaren will finally fight in the top ranks for some reason..

Would running higher initially not lessen the effects of the 2023 rule changes? If the floor is raised higher at the rear, then the RB was already running with rake and pretty high at the rear compared to others.

[diffuser]

The technical regs can go one of two ways.

The raised floor ruling can snip RedBull's advantage of using higher rake coupled with articulate suspension and awesome vortex sealing....

Or...

It could pay even more dividends for RedBull's mastery of sealing higher ride-height floors!!

The pecking order is a very tough call this year.

I'm getting a sense that McLaren will finally fight in the top ranks for some reason..

Would running higher initially not lessen the effects of the 2023 rule changes? If the floor is raised higher at the rear, then the RB was already running with rake and pretty high at the rear compared to others.

There is no doubt that running the car closer to the ground generates more DF. No team ran higher ride height in 2022 to increase DF. It was usually done to prevent the car or drivers from disintegrating from the porpoising. When they were running flat out in a corner, all the cars were as close to the ground as possible with little to no rake.

[chrisc90]

The technical regs can go one of two ways.

The raised floor ruling can snip RedBull's advantage of using higher rake coupled with articulate suspension and awesome vortex sealing....

Or...

It could pay even more dividends for RedBull's mastery of sealing higher ride-height floors!!

The pecking order is a very tough call this year.

I'm getting a sense that McLaren will finally fight in the top ranks for some reason..

Would running higher initially not lessen the effects of the 2023 rule changes? If the floor is raised higher at the rear, then the RB was already running with rake and pretty high at the rear compared to others.

There is no doubt that running the car closer to the ground generates more DF. No team ran higher ride height in 2022 to increase DF. It was usually done to prevent the car or drivers from disintegrating from the porpoising. When they were running flat out in a corner, all the cars were as close to the ground as possible with little to no rake.

What about the static ride height though? Where the measurements for parc ferme are taken? Surely if you can have a higher static ride height to pass the tests, but your car then runs close to the ground when driven then surely its an advantage?

[diffuser]

Would running higher initially not lessen the effects of the 2023 rule changes? If the floor is raised higher at the rear, then the RB was already running with rake and pretty high at the rear compared to others.

There is no doubt that running the car closer to the ground generates more DF. No team ran higher ride height in 2022 to increase DF. It was usually done to prevent the car or drivers from disintegrating from the porpoising. When they were running flat out in a corner, all the cars were as close to the ground as possible with little to no rake.

What about the static ride height though? Where the measurements for parc ferme are taken? Surely if you can have a higher static ride height to pass the tests, but your car then runs close to the ground when driven then surely its an advantage?

From what I understand, how far down the outer floor edge can come down is measured from the plank. Whatever the height that the floor edge had to be above the plank in 2022, they added 15mm for 2023. So if you want to get closer to the ground, you need pull up the plank.

[Chuckjr]

Maybe someone here can help me understand why since the new regs require a rear lift the Merc supposedly is advantaged when Merc have said repeatedly they need their car planted on the ground to get the most out of their concept. Why is Merc the most advantaged when RB in fact runs a high static height already? All cars are basically on the ground in the corners.

Honest question.

[mendis]

Maybe someone here can help me understand why since the new regs require a rear lift the Merc supposedly is advantaged when Merc have said repeatedly they need their car planted on the ground to get the most out of their concept. Why is Merc the most advantaged when RB in fact runs a high static height already? All cars are basically on the ground in the corners.

Honest question.

To avoid porpoising, Mercedes has to run higher. While the best performance of their car is running lower, but then it starts it's disco at that state. So by having forced these regulations, other teams also now have raised floor edges and diffuser opening now, by which they lose downforce and potentially go on par with Mercedes, who anyway have to raise to keep sanity of the car and drivers.

[diffuser]

Maybe someone here can help me understand why since the new regs require a rear lift the Merc supposedly is advantaged when Merc have said repeatedly they need their car planted on the ground to get the most out of their concept. Why is Merc the most advantaged when RB in fact runs a high static height already? All cars are basically on the ground in the corners.

Honest question.

During the season this a bigger issue to overcome but they seemed to have gotten car under control by the end of the year. So those learnings were fed into the new car design. It all comes down to what the find in the wind tunnel.