2022 Spanish Grand Prix - Catalunya, May 20 - 22

[ENGINE TUNER]

You guys are mad, he had the right to go around the outside, Lewis fan here but kmag did nothing wrong

Yes knag has the right to go around the outside but the rules require an overtaking driver to do so safely, that was not a safe move by kmag and he caused a collision, should have been penalized.

[ema00]

it's clear that Kevin drove into lewis' car without reason, he had a lot of space on the outside but hit lewis that was almost on the kerb at the time of impact

[TimW]

Just watched the onboards. Lewis just had some understeer which Magnussen did not anticipate. Both could have been less on the limit to avoid this. Sensible decision from the stewards.

BTW Lewis had some massive understeer in turn three. Sainz did a great job at avoiding contact there. Maybe that should have been a warning for Kevin.

[PlatinumZealot]

Dont need to change steering angle to achieve understeer. Thats why its called understeer. You can quite clearly see Lewis's car move about a foot/12" away from the line he was taking around the corner

Thats what im seeing on this onboard to me it looks ham was in trouble in that corner and magnussen actually kept him on track

Next time, please read your comment at least once before posting it, to make sure it's worthy of posting. Thanks!

Kevin turned in when he should have stayed on the outside. Gotta leave space for cars understeerning unexpectedly! This was a typical KMag pincer move that backfired

[PlatinumZealot]

Any word on RedBull cooling the fuel in an attempt to get an unfair advantage? That's a serious offense if true. And it could explain why the RedBulls didn't have that fire cracker start that they used to have.

[organic]

Any word on RedBull cooling the fuel in an attempt to get an unfair advantage? That's a serious offense if true. And it could explain why the RedBulls didn't have that fire cracker start that they used to have.

https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... barcelona/

In Miami, Aston Martin was hit. Two weeks later, it almost hit Red Bull in Barcelona. The fuel only reached the prescribed temperature before the pit lane was closed. Ferrari compounded the problem for everyone.

We still remember the preparations for the start at the Miami GP. Sebastian Vettel and Lance Stroll's starting positions remained empty. Instead, both cars were in the garage and both engines were running at a standstill. Aston Martin almost didn't start the race. When the engines were started, they were eight degrees below the prescribed limit. One car reached the required 18 degrees ten minutes before the start, the other three minutes. Only then were the green cars allowed to roll to the pit exit.

In Barcelona, people wondered why the two Red Bulls were so late on the grid. While the competition was doing their practice laps for the grid, the engines were already running in the Red Bull garage. Max Verstappen and Sergio Perez did not take to the track until eight seconds before the pit lane closed. The team explained that the delay occurred to check the DRS mechanism on the cars. This had already caused problems for Max Verstappen in qualifying.

Return to the old fuel rule

Upon inquiry with the FIA, the team explained that the fuel temperature in the two Red Bulls did not comply with the prescribed value when they opened the pit lane 40 minutes before the start. However, when the two cars left the garage it was. Otherwise, the technical delegate would have had to report to the stewards. The FIA inspectors can see the fuel temperature of all cars in real time on their screens. The inspection starts when the pit lane opens.

The limit has changed again since the Miami GP. In the first five races, it had been set at a fixed value, most recently 18 degrees, in consultation with all teams, regardless of the weather, due to teething problems with the standard fuel pump in the collecting tank.

But after one team vetoed the decision in Barcelona, the FIA had to revert to the old procedure. The rules stipulate a minimum temperature that is ten degrees below the outside temperature measured two hours before the start. At that time, it was 35 degrees. This meant that the sprint could not be cooled below 25 degrees.

The team that had lobbied for a return to the old system is said to be Ferrari. According to information from the competitors' camp, this is not without reason: Mercedes and Honda experience problems with their engines during heat races if the fuel temperature rises too much. This can cause damage and cost performance the more the gasoline heats up during the race. The Ferrari engines don't seem to have a problem with this.

That's why it's in the interest of the teams with Mercedes and Honda engines to cool the fuel down as much as possible beforehand. Because with a lower starting value, it stays cooler throughout the race. From that point of view, the 18 degrees that still applied across the board in Miami are the easier task than the 25 degrees in sun-drenched Barcelona.

The teams do not agree on when fuel that is too cool is illegal. The rules state: "When the car is in use". In other words, when the car is in use. Aston Martin equates this moment with leaving the garage. Ferrari considers the fact that the car is in use to be fulfilled as soon as the engines are started.

On that assumption, both the Aston Martin in Miami and the Red Bull in Barcelona would not have been in compliance with the rules. The FIA takes Aston Martin's point of view. The decisive factor is when the car leaves the garage. And everything was in order at Red Bull. Ferrari team boss Mattia Binotto didn't want to open a can of worms: "We trust the FIA's measurements."

[ringo]

Whoops merc stepped out mag tried to react

Mag turned in too early. Look as the gif starts Mag wheels putting in more lock.

[maxxer]

Whoops merc stepped out mag tried to react

Mag turned in too early. Look as the gif starts Mag wheels putting in more lock.

yes he was tight but the merc was moving anyway im leaving this forum , im too tired of these race threads with people who are just fan based. Have a good one Ringo you do have good comments always!

[PlatinumZealot]

Also Hamilton car would have lost rear downforce as Magsussen's front wheel would. basically block half of the car's air flow. In other words, Magnussen caused this to himself.

[Zynerji]

You guys are mad, he had the right to go around the outside, Lewis fan here but kmag did nothing wrong

Yes knag has the right to go around the outside but the rules require an overtaking driver to do so safely, that was not a safe move by kmag and he caused a collision, should have been penalized.

Uh, KMag isn't the one that lost control of his car tho. As professionals, it is the person that makes the mistake of car control that should be penalized. We've seen plenty of brake lock-ups that have caused damage and gotten penalized. This is no different.

[ringo]

Is there anything else to discuss?
It was a racing incident. Magnussen had 3/4 of the track but wantes to turn in too early to ensure he got out of the corner side by side.
Hamilton simply had an understeering racing line which he was fully in control of as we see when he is following cars to overtake or position himself.

[ENGINE TUNER]

You guys are mad, he had the right to go around the outside, Lewis fan here but kmag did nothing wrong

Yes knag has the right to go around the outside but the rules require an overtaking driver to do so safely, that was not a safe move by kmag and he caused a collision, should have been penalized.

Uh, KMag isn't the one that lost control of his car tho. As professionals, it is the person that makes the mistake of car control that should be penalized. We've seen plenty of brake lock-ups that have caused damage and gotten penalized. This is no different.

Neither driver lost control of their car, Hamilton's car understeered a bit as Sainz moved in front of him, cars understeer thru that corner when not following another and Kmag should have left a safety cushion, he did not. Furthermore, it was not just a tiny rub, it was acfull on hit and Kmag would have caused the collision regardless of the minute understeer or not. Kmag effectively drove into the side of Hamilton just like Verstappen did in Silverstone last year.

[dialtone]

I went on and calculated an average lap for the whole race for HAM, SAI and PER just to see how they did through it, it includes every lap from 1 to 66, spins, pit stops, slow down laps at the end and so on.

My conclusion is that Hamilton was running a LOT more downforce and top speed paid a big penalty, or the car is very draggy, but considering he managed his tyres well I go with high DF, however it's not like PER had bad tyre wear so I think the DF generated by the RedBull is also very good but it comes with less drag.

[langedweil]

Just to clarify, if leclerc did not have engine trouble how likely is it that he would have won. Or would it have been very close towards the end?

I’d say Leclerc would have won the race with about 90% certainty. He had great pace and most importantly Ferrari managed to fix the issue with tire degradation that plagued them the previous two Grands Prix.

Well, he was doing pretty well (and long) on the reds, but we did not see him on the Medium .. I believe racepace on med's appeared favorable for Max in FP.
But, we'll won't know right?
I kinda feel the RB on yellow would have been slightly faster, and imho Lec & Ver would have had to put up a squirmish again. Anyway, just my thought ..

[Sevach]

Just to clarify, if leclerc did not have engine trouble how likely is it that he would have won. Or would it have been very close towards the end?

I’d say Leclerc would have won the race with about 90% certainty. He had great pace and most importantly Ferrari managed to fix the issue with tire degradation that plagued them the previous two Grands Prix.

Well, he was doing pretty well (and long) on the reds, but we did not see him on the Medium .. I believe racepace on med's appeared favorable for Max in FP.
But, we'll won't know right?
I kinda feel the RB on yellow would have been slightly faster, and imho Lec & Ver would have had to put up a squirmish again. Anyway, just my thought ..

He was easily going away from Russell (2nd place at the time), he was also faster than Hamilton(who pitted for mediums at the same exact time) and setting fastest times in the short time he had mediums on, despite the fact he didn't need to.
He had things well in control imo.