Ferrari Power Unit Hardware & Software

[factory_p]

As for 3D-printing, I'd assume one of the strong points is the capacity to create cooling channels in the piston where the jets squirt some oil, without the need of some friction welding or the use of a circlip to close these channels. That means creating cooling channels without creating a weak point in your structure. But that's easier said than done, so hats off Ferrari if they got it reliable.

I don't agree. I think the steel piston will cope with higher temperatures, needing less cooling.

So then they will try to keep as much heat in the combustion chamber as possible, so the 3d printing may make a framework under the crown which holds a lot of air pockets and thus provides insulation.

The problem I would worry about is hotspots on the piston crown causing detonation since - as Tommy Cookers pointed out - the thermal conductivity is so much worse than aluminium alloys. In these extra-lean burning conditions already prone to detonation, I wouldn't want such hotspots.

As for keeping heat in the chamber, you are going in the direction of the long fantasized adiabatic engines... Unfortunately it hasn't been proved really successful yet.

[63l8qrrfy6]

As for 3D-printing, I'd assume one of the strong points is the capacity to create cooling channels in the piston where the jets squirt some oil, without the need of some friction welding or the use of a circlip to close these channels. That means creating cooling channels without creating a weak point in your structure. But that's easier said than done, so hats off Ferrari if they got it reliable.

I don't agree. I think the steel piston will cope with higher temperatures, needing less cooling.

So then they will try to keep as much heat in the combustion chamber as possible, so the 3d printing may make a framework under the crown which holds a lot of air pockets and thus provides insulation.

I think he is actually spot on. Keep it mind that to preserve the same piston mass the stresses in the steel piston will increase 3 fold as I have explained before:
https://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewt ... 90#p690984

That and the increased temperature do not really give you that much over aluminium - which is probably why not everyone has gone straight for steel pistons.

The points about the manufacturing difficulties are also accurate. There is a small advantage with a steel piston though - the pin can be run straight into the bore without any bushing and still have better load bearing capability. With aluminium, the interfered insert will distort the piston so final machining has to be done after it's been fitted, then finally the bushing can be profiled.

Additionally, the top ring can be moved higher to reduce crevice volume and the compression height can be decreased too which allows either longer rods or a shorter block.

[MarlboroF1]

Hello,
I have a quick question.
Haas homologated the new Ferrari engine in Spa. So they had no restrictions for the oil tank.
Is it possible that Ferrari can now use the same spec in Monza because the new engine is already homologated?

[wuzak]

Hello,
I have a quick question.
Haas homologated the new Ferrari engine in Spa. So they had no restrictions for the oil tank.
Is it possible that Ferrari can now use the same spec in Monza because the new engine is already homologated?

No. Reports are that Mercedes' customer teams have to run their next PU at the lower oil burning limit.

So Ferrari will have to run at the lower limit. Though I think Haas probably already have anyway.

[PlatinumZealot]

As for 3D-printing, I'd assume one of the strong points is the capacity to create cooling channels in the piston where the jets squirt some oil, without the need of some friction welding or the use of a circlip to close these channels. That means creating cooling channels without creating a weak point in your structure. But that's easier said than done, so hats off Ferrari if they got it reliable.

I don't agree. I think the steel piston will cope with higher temperatures, needing less cooling.

So then they will try to keep as much heat in the combustion chamber as possible, so the 3d printing may make a framework under the crown which holds a lot of air pockets and thus provides insulation.

I think he is actually spot on. Keep it mind that to preserve the same piston mass the stresses in the steel piston will increase 3 fold as I have explained before:
https://www.f1technical.net/forum/viewt ... 90#p690984

That and the increased temperature do not really give you that much over aluminium - which is probably why not everyone has gone straight for steel pistons.

The points about the manufacturing difficulties are also accurate. There is a small advantage with a steel piston though - the pin can be run straight into the bore without any bushing and still have better load bearing capability. With aluminium, the interfered insert will distort the piston so final machining has to be done after it's been fitted, then finally the bushing can be profiled.

Additionally, the top ring can be moved higher to reduce crevice volume and the compression height can be decreased too which allows either longer rods or a shorter block.

In theory. We know how the naturally aspirated F1 pistons look, right. The rings were pretty much as high as they can get, but the majority of us have never seen this hybrid engine pistons before... It's possible that the ring is already high up on the aluminum one. You don't want the ring too high either.

Another advantage of steel piston is that you can use really fancy alloys to resist thermal expansion. Also the emissivity is much higher.

[63l8qrrfy6]

In theory. We know how the naturally aspirated F1 pistons look, right. The rings were pretty much as high as they can get, but the majority of us have never seen this hybrid engine pistons before... It's possible that the ring is already high up on the aluminum one. You don't want the ring too high either.

Another advantage of steel piston is that you can use really fancy alloys to resist thermal expansion. Also the emissivity is much higher.

Top ring height is limited by groove wear (and wear initiated fatigue) which is driven by temperature and pressure. Both of these have gone up significantly on the turbo engines so unless they are doing something radically different, the rings must have been lowered.

Unlike the rings, the piston aluminium substrate is not strong enough to allow high hardness coatings.

In automotive applications it is fairly common to cast in ni-resist grooves but these are prone to debond failures so I don't think they are used in F1.

[J.A.W.]

Here's an example of a current Italian high-performance S.I. steel piston..
http://www.cycleworld.com/2016/01/14/st ... y-feature/

Or could it be that a composite Fe/Al piston is preferred, such as used in this current hi-po DI/TBI, 2T mill?

[CriXus]

https://twitter.com/tgruener/status/903181092072677376

[PlatinumZealot]

Here's an example of a current Italian high-performance S.I. steel piston..
http://www.cycleworld.com/2016/01/14/st ... y-feature/

Or could it be that a composite Fe/Al piston is preferred, such as used in this current hi-po DI/TBI, 2T mill?

http://www.sleddermag.com/wp-content/up ... jpg?80fd7e

Yes.. that webpage.. lovely. Infact Imma save the page this time. Anyway, this very same photo is why I question the need to 3d print inside the piston. It is already so thin!

3

[MrPotatoHead]

Here's an example of a current Italian high-performance S.I. steel piston..
http://www.cycleworld.com/2016/01/14/st ... y-feature/

Or could it be that a composite Fe/Al piston is preferred, such as used in this current hi-po DI/TBI, 2T mill?

http://www.sleddermag.com/wp-content/up ... jpg?80fd7e

Yes.. that webpage.. lovely. Infact Imma save the page this time. Anyway, this very same photo is why I question the need to 3d print inside the piston. It is already so thin!

http://www.cycleworld.com/sites/cyclewo ... ok=6SH7001 3

One of the biggest benefits of 3D printing of metals is the ability to mix materials in ways that are otherwise impossible.
For example you can lay up steel on top of an aluminum base material anywhere you like - using the right technique that is.
So perhaps they are using not for internal reasons but for material buildup reasons.

[taperoo2k]

Here's an example of a current Italian high-performance S.I. steel piston..
http://www.cycleworld.com/2016/01/14/st ... y-feature/

Or could it be that a composite Fe/Al piston is preferred, such as used in this current hi-po DI/TBI, 2T mill?

http://www.sleddermag.com/wp-content/up ... jpg?80fd7e

Yes.. that webpage.. lovely. Infact Imma save the page this time. Anyway, this very same photo is why I question the need to 3d print inside the piston. It is already so thin!

http://www.cycleworld.com/sites/cyclewo ... ok=6SH7001 3

One of the biggest benefits of 3D printing of metals is the ability to mix materials in ways that are otherwise impossible.
For example you can lay up steel on top of an aluminum base material anywhere you like - using the right technique that is.
So perhaps they are using not for internal reasons but for material buildup reasons.

3D printed pistons offer Ferrari the ability to precisely design a Piston with the performance and weight characteristics they want with the ability of 3D printers (of the laser kind) to precisely control how each layer of a piston is printed. I would hazard a guess and say it probably also means they can prototype a new piston design much more quickly than they can with the casting process. Though Engine blocks will likely have to be cast for the foreseeable future.

If Ferrari are using 3D pistons and they do deliver big performance gains ? Might explain why Ferrari appear not that bothered about the FIA changing the rules on Oil consumption/burning.

[wuzak]

Much is made about Ferrari using engines at Spa and here which comply to the higher oil burn limit.

One wonders if that without the auxiliary tank that Ferrari may not have the mechanism to burn that oil?

[PlatinumZealot]

They are using the same spec engine in monza so they are burning just as much oil as they used to.

No one outside ferrari's engine team amd the FIA knows how much oil is consumed. Much less how much is consumed per 100km. Is this even an instantaneous value or an average over the race?

Does the fact that all races bar Monaco are ~300km and the wording says consumption per 100km and not consumption per race means that the FIA can somehow read the instantaneous oil consumption?

Air flow meter readings times oxygen sensor readings minus fuel flow meter readings might give an idea of how much carbon came from the oil at any instant. So this is a viable method of finding the oil consumption. But notice oil density and carbon chain length present alot of loop holes...

Otherwise only way to directly tell the oil consumption is to measure the drop in oil tank level while the engine is running at select acclerations and rpms over the race. This way you have sort of a direct volume reading. You can see how a second oil tank or a funky shaped oil tank can misrepresent.

Another way is flow meters on the oil tank inlet and outlet lines.

Anyone have any more ideas how the oil consumption can be measured?

[63l8qrrfy6]

Did FIA not provide a method for measuring oil consumption ?
How on earth are they going to enforce the rule then ?

[wuzak]

Did FIA not provide a method for measuring oil consumption ?
How on earth are they going to enforce the rule then ?

I think it is a simple check of the amount of oil before the race and the amount after.