Mercedes AMG F1 Team 2012

[Ganxxta]

Reminds me of the 2005 Bridgestones and Ferraris "ovens" to get the tires on temperature

[GrizzleBoy]

The TDs are always going on about the difference between surface temperature and core temperature of the tyres, with the idea being that you want a high core temperature as that provides the right conditions for the tyre to deform under load - e.g. cornering - and that deformation allows more contact, which allows more grip.

It may be that Mercedes are only able to reach optimal core temperature when using their tyres blankets, and under race conditions (when they cannot use the blankets) they are ineffective at generating the optimal core temp.

This scenario would exhibit exactly the behaviour that we seem to observe: fast qualifying, slow race.

Not sure about that tbh.

If that was the case, they'd have little temperature left in the tyres once they've finished their outlap to actually do any qualifying, no?

It could be the total opposite and their new system forces them to run aggressive setups to compensate that overheat the tyres and kill them quickly.

[Maelstrom]

During testing everybody was saying that Mercedes was suffering high degradation and Merc said it wasn't a problem and degradation wasn't an issue. Makes me sort of mad at how negligent they are.

Or maybe Merc was simply lying, because it's no one's dang business but their own and the FIA's.

"Hey Brawn, can you tell us everything that's wrong with the car before the season has even begun? Your rivals would love that. Please?"

If this is the case then they have failed to sort out an issue that was troubling them last year. The fact that the first test they were just testing tyres makes it even worse.

[elf341]

If that was the case, they'd have little temperature left in the tyres once they've finished their outlap to actually do any qualifying, no?

I don't think this is an obvious assumption at all. I guess it all comes down to the temperature gradient between the optimal temperature and that which the W03 can naturally generate, and the thermal conductivity of the tyre compound.

Pirelli have said before that their optimal temperature is around 100 deg C, and we know the old Bridgestones used to have a working window of between 90 and 110 deg C (source). So given the natural ability of an F1 car to heat up the surface temperature, I wouldn't be surprised if it would in fact take a small handful of laps before such a tyre would eventually fall outside the operating window.

[Ganxxta]

Here we go, first shareholders are requesting to leave F1 (german):
http://www.neckar-chronik.de/Home/nachr ... 69328.html

It was just a mater of time and I think if they continue their pointless form this year, then even Zetsche can't keep them in F1 and Merc is away next year.

[Ganxxta]

Well according to Brawn Mercedes FAILED in the first 2 races -.-

Wir lagen an den zwei entgegengesetzten Enden des Fensters: In Melbourne überhitzten die Reifen – am Freitag hatten wir das noch im Griff, dann entwickelten wir das Setup in eine Richtung, die sich bei wärmeren Bedingungen nicht als hilfreich erwies."

In Malaysia arbeiteten wir im Training an einer Fahrzeug-Abstimmung, die solche Probleme verhindern sollte. Regen und eine weitaus niedrigere Streckentemperatur im Rennen schafften Voraussetzungen, mit denen andere Teams besser umgehen konnten als wir mit unserer auf extreme Hitze eingestellten Abstimmung

We were in the opposite ends of the Temperature window: in Melbourne the tires overheated, we tried a setup direction that wasn't helpfull for the race. In Malaysia we worked on a setup to overcome those problems, rain and low temperatures weren't helpful for our setup for extreme hot conditions.

So in the first race they overheated the tires and couldn't solve it with the setup changes and in Malaysia they used a setup for extreme hot conditions and couldn't get the tires on temperature in the race...

Nice job, I wonder how every other team could manage to get the tires to work

Source

[Maelstrom]

Yeah... seems like the car as a very narrow window of getting the tyres to work. Though Merc probably was a tad unlucky because of the rain.

[Ferraripilot]

Here we go, first shareholders are requesting to leave F1 (german):
http://www.neckar-chronik.de/Home/nachr ... 69328.html

It was just a mater of time and I think if they continue their pointless form this year, then even Zetsche can't keep them in F1 and Merc is away next year.

Posturing. Don't buy into it.

[raymondu999]

What gain would shareholders get from posturing as such?

[yener]

The AMG team is under pressure. Brawn explaining how the Fduct works and pointing to the "small" overheating problem of the tyre.

I think AMG is F#cked.

Think the 3rd race is the only chance to prove how strong they are.

[GrizzleBoy]

The AMG team is under pressure. Brawn explaining how the Fduct works and pointing to the "small" overheating problem of the tyre.

I think AMG is F#cked.

Think the 3rd race is the only chance to prove how strong they are.

Who did he explain it to?

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

So in the first race they overheated the tires and couldn't solve it with the setup changes and in Malaysia they used a setup for extreme hot conditions and couldn't get the tires on temperature in the race...

Nice job, I wonder how every other team could manage to get the tires to work

Perhaps Mercedes gambled and overcompensated due to their Oz travails? Ever think of that?

[Ferraripilot]

What gain would shareholders get from posturing as such?

I work with companies who have major shareholders and understand their politics to be the same regardless of where you are, except for Chinese businesses and corporations where things are just a little strange at times. The purpose of one of the members or a couple members to posture an opinion regarding something is often a political gesture not really against the situation, but in favor of something else they are for. Posturing puts the spotlight on them for other issues which I highly doubt, considering the massive recent backing Daimler has put into this F1 team, have anything to do with F1 at all. Things with members of any board are rarely what they seem.

[WhiteBlue]

Here we go, first shareholders are requesting to leave F1 (german):
http://www.neckar-chronik.de/Home/nachr ... 69328.html

It was just a mater of time and I think if they continue their pointless form this year, then even Zetsche can't keep them in F1 and Merc is away next year.

If you read the whole article you understand that F1 was a very small issue. Shareholders and workers have always attacked the spending there. That isn't a new thing. Mercedes GP must challenge the top teams for race wins in order to earn the back the investment by brand exposure. They are closer to it this year than ever before. I don't believe Merc will question the F1 budget from that point of view. If they pull the plug on F1 it will be due to Ecclestone's commercial decisions and the failure of the teams to agree budget caps.

[WhiteBlue]

Well according to Brawn Mercedes FAILED in the first 2 races -.-

So in the first race they overheated the tires and couldn't solve it with the setup changes and in Malaysia they used a setup for extreme hot conditions and couldn't get the tires on temperature in the race...

Nice job, I wonder how every other team could manage to get the tires to work

Source

McLaren obviously have the best tyre simulator and are particularly good at getting the setup right for the tyres. Mercedes are still catching up in that discipline.

The good news is that the car is not fundamentally flawed. It is a setup issue that they will get on top of.