Red Bull RB10 Renault

[Per]

It's not new, they had something like this on the RB9. Matt Somers speculated it could be something like a mass damper: http://somersf1.blogspot.nl/2013/11/the ... rstay.html

I don't know if this theory is correct (you can make the splitter resonate at a desired frequency anyway, you don't need a flimsy buckling stay to achieve that) but it's definitely the most elaborate article I have read about this.

[aleks_ader]

That splitter "stay" flex is crucial for successful RB high rake set up. The flexing allow team to maximize the rake and at same time allow minimize clearance toward the ground. So there are no big unnecessarily compromises decisions about gaps between ground and the floor. That configuration also helps make diffuser less vulnerable for "crosswinds", because whole aero platform could be lower, more tilted and ergo probably more stable in yaw motion of the car. That allow steady downforce throw bumpy sections (most brutal are the chicanes) of the track. So increased drivebillity increase drivers feel and confidence in the car to push easier to the limit. Beauty of all F1 cars (especially RB) is that all individual detail which each play own role and act as in whole unit in harmony.

[Tim.Wright]

Also interesting vents in the "pod" to the left of the stay in that picture, although they might in fact be fins of a heatsink from whatever device seems to have a laser warning label on it mounted to that "pod" of course... are those laser ride-height sensors?

That is transponder.

Its more likely a ride height sensor and a slip angle sensor housed together. I don't know about the laser sensors but the slip sensors have a maximum height above which they don't work which is why they need to be hung under the chassis. Well over 20k a piece for one of those toys.

[bonjon1979]

Still talking about this story... roll: Riccardo was on a 20 laps run like Button... but his laptimes were very interesting, not the fact he overtook Button in turn11.

I'm not sure what was interesting about them. Was that the stint where consistently 1.39-1.40. Which would be pretty ordinary if he started with 35 kg on board. They'd be spectacular with 100 kg on board.

We don't seem to have even remotely accurate breakdown of the stint times this year so you can't really read anything from a single run. If there were lots of runs like this, or a run like this at the start of a race sim then you could start to draw conclusions. As it is, I think it's a pretty poor indicator of the inherent pace of the car.

I'm comparing RIC's 20lap run with some 19-20lap runs other drivers did as the last stint of their race. Ric's lap times are not just ordinary compared to them. Yes maybe some of them were 'cruising' to save fuel but I dont think that was Magnussen's case for example. The latter did a 19 lap last run atleast once, with the soft tires like RIC and his lap times did evolve the same way his other stints evolved so I dont think he was saving fuel.

If a car can do 1.34 with very little fuel, they can do a series of laps in the 38/39s. You can't compare the end of a race sim when fuel is being conserved, with a one off stint. I don't think teams will be too concerned about rics run.

[Richard]

A quick reminder that the car threads are meant to focus on the actual features of the actual car.

Discussion of lap times & tyres belong in the respective race and test threads. The fact that Button said the RB10 looks nice, or Marko said it is good in curves is PR fodder to fill column inches.

For the avoidance of doubt, these threads are for posts about actual things on the actual car - ie what is it or how does it work.

[froggy]

No shots of the demo run on Monday?

[PlatinumZealot]

pure RB10 sound:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDvGXmaJgP0

Thanks.

The brake by wire you can hear it mid corner chirping the tyres suddenly.
I can hear the blow-off valves whistling too.

[PlatinumZealot]

http://i.imgur.com/UaC8N0R.jpg
There's something interesting going on with the stay, not least because it is clearly incapable of accommodating any significant vertical compressive load. It can only buckle, so what is its purpose?

You answered it yourself. Exactly! it can only buckle. This saves the chassis in the case the T-tray gets hit by large force from underneath. You definitely don't want it piercing through the chassis and injuring the driver either.

[basti313]

pure RB10 sound:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDvGXmaJgP0

Thanks.

The brake by wire you can hear it mid corner chirping the tyres suddenly.
I can hear the blow-off valves whistling too.

Why do you address the tire chirping to the brake by wire system? I would address it to normal mid corner understeer.
And the blow-off valves (if present) are not allowed to release the air to the atmosphere by the regs. So i doubt you can hear them.

[jz11]

http://i.imgur.com/UaC8N0R.jpg

There's something interesting going on with the stay, not least because it is clearly incapable of accommodating any significant vertical compressive load. It can only buckle, so what is its purpose?

edit: cut out something to make the quote shorter

I'm not sure if I understood the "tone" of your post correctly, that there might be something fishy going on there, but I think there isn't, and here is why:

IMHO that elements purpose is solely to hold the front end of the floor up, and not keep it fixed at certain distance to the drivers tub (AFAIR there was even a regulation allowing certain amount of flex upwards?), basically it's a piece of "string", designed not to stretch, but at the same time be able to compress and let the front end of the floor absorb a hit on a curb or similar

[Owen.C93]

The floor must be flat unfortunately. McLaren got caught out with building to the limits of tolerances so RBR wont have a chance of getting a stressed floor past the scrutineers.

[PlatinumZealot]

pure RB10 sound:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDvGXmaJgP0

Thanks.

The brake by wire you can hear it mid corner chirping the tyres suddenly.
I can hear the blow-off valves whistling too.

Why do you address the tire chirping to the brake by wire system? I would address it to normal mid corner understeer.
And the blow-off valves (if present) are not allowed to release the air to the atmosphere by the regs. So i doubt you can hear them.

Yeah i know it must be plumbed back somewhere near the turbine. There is still the possibility that you would still hear it.

[Just_a_fan]

IMHO that elements purpose is solely to hold the front end of the floor up, and not keep it fixed at certain distance to the drivers tub (AFAIR there was even a regulation allowing certain amount of flex upwards?), basically it's a piece of "string", designed not to stretch, but at the same time be able to compress and let the front end of the floor absorb a hit on a curb or similar

The stay is supposed to prevent the floor flexing upwards. It's supposed to be a compression member, not a tension member.

[PhillipM]

The stay is supposed to prevent the floor flexing upwards. It's supposed to be a compression member, not a tension member.

Okay, so looking at it that way, what if the tea tray has a very low stiffness so it's very flexible, but it's actually preloaded against the stay by the amount required for the FIA test?

That way, the stay can be very thin as it's in tension, the stay hits the floor/kerb and as soon as the FIA test force is exceeded it flexes right up, the stay being so thin helps because it buckles out of the way.

[Per]

How do you want to preload the tea tray properly if it's very flexible? It would be visibly bent...

I still don't understand why they have the stay. It looks too flimsy to carry any compressive force higher than a couple of Newtons. It must be that the tea tray itself is stiff enough to pass the FIA tests. But then why include a vertical stay at all instead of just leaving it out? What is the real function of this stay? I am still puzzled.

To thicken the plot, here's the article that describes the T-tray deflection test:

3.17.5 Bodywork may deflect no more than 5mm vertically when a 2000N load is applied vertically to it at three different points which lie on the car centre line and 100mm either side of it. Each of these loads will be applied in an upward direction at a point 380mm rearward of the front wheel centre line using a 50mm diameter ram in the two outer locations and a 70mm diameter ram on the car centre line.

Stays or structures between the front of the bodywork lying on the reference plane and the survival cell may be present for this test, provided they are completely rigid and have no system or mechanism which allows non-linear deflection during any part of the test.

Furthermore, the bodywork being tested in this area may not include any component which is capable of allowing more than the permitted amount of deflection under the test load (including any linear deflection above the test load), such components could include, but are not limited to:
a) Joints, bearings pivots or any other form of articulation.
b) Dampers, hydraulics or any form of time dependent component or structure.
c) Buckling members or any component or design which may have any non-linear characteristics.
d) Any parts which may systematically or routinely exhibit permanent deformation.

I don't want to start polemics with this question, I seek a rational answer: how is this buckling thing (as shown in MattSomers' blog) NOT illegal?