McLaren MP4-28 Mercedes

[Pup]

The current problems at mclaren obviously aren't solved at all by targetting one area.

That's not obvious at all to me; but then, I'm stupid.

[beelsebob]

The current problems at mclaren obviously aren't solved at all by targetting one area.

That's not obvious at all to me; but then, I'm stupid.

Nope, I don't see that as obvious at all either. It's absolutely possible that one single thing is stopping the entire concept of the car from working.

[KATO]

I'm gona be looking at those front wings this next race. I read they feel optimistic about having found the problems now let's hope there solutions work. I hope atleast one of the Drivers is at he MTC simulator working with the team running the car in the simulator so the engineers can find a solution... I know Button tweeted he's in California but idk.. I'm sure they don't really need the drivers tho I mean this stuff is probably the job of the test driver anyways.. But ill be looking at those front wings next race-..

[McMrocks]

But i haven't read any interview in which someone from McLaren complains about the frontwing. They brought a new one already for Oz (the one from the last test). It looks simple compared to others but simple means not that it is rubbish. Maybe they bring a frontwing with minor changes because of the track layout but i don't think we will see something completely new.

But this is just speculation

[turbof1]

The current problems at mclaren obviously aren't solved at all by targetting one area.

That's not obvious at all to me; but then, I'm stupid.

Nope, I don't see that as obvious at all either. It's absolutely possible that one single thing is stopping the entire concept of the car from working.

If the diffuser is stalling at the back, you have to take account that every bit directed to that has its influence, on the diffuser AND the other bits; I heavily tend to say somewhere the sum of all of it isn't matching the cfd and windtunnel numbers, judging on how long they are taking to get closer to what they want and also looking at the way they display the problem as something that will take several updates and more data. If it was even the tiniest aero bit that was solely the problem, no matter how difficult to find, they would have found it by now.

[wesley123]

I think someone from the 2007 Honda F1 team would love to tell you otherwise

[beelsebob]

If the diffuser is stalling at the back, you have to take account that every bit directed to that has its influence, on the diffuser AND the other bits; I heavily tend to say somewhere the sum of all of it isn't matching the cfd and windtunnel numbers, judging on how long they are taking to get closer to what they want and also looking at the way they display the problem as something that will take several updates and more data. If it was even the tiniest aero bit that was solely the problem, no matter how difficult to find, they would have found it by now.

And that's exactly why I believe that it was a relatively simple problem. They showed dramatically improved pace (probably 3rd overall) at Malaysia, and stated that they now understood the problem and would have it solved for China. Whether that is true or not we wait to see, but the evidence just now seems to point to them understanding and half fixing the problem in only 1 week. That to me says it was one single simple tweak defeating the entire concept, not that the concept was flawed and that everything needed changed to make anything work at all well.

[turbof1]

Malaysia was a different circuit all together, way less bumpy then Melbourne, which was believed to worsen the mclaren situation. They also brought several updates, both planned and experimental. The way it sounds they brought quite some changes the. And I don't think they were 3th fastest. Ferrari looked faster, but with Alonso out we'll never know.

We'll see in China how far McLaren will be standing, and with type of updates they bring.

[Javert]

Well, actually he just named everything on the car that changed from last year, and said they were problem areas.

I didn't want to say MP4-28 was total rubbish.
Sidepod design is very aggressive and has the potential to be the best

Unfortunately there seems to be an enormous loss of horsepower due to exhausts
that hampers the car on the straights,
making MP4-28 a car that almost everybody can pass and they can't pass anyone.
This is a big problem in a race.
In Q the efficiency of their DRS hides it, with fresh tires and DRS they can get enough speed

Don't know if it's due to exhaust position or due to exhaust diameter or due to electronics

The diffuser they raced is not too bad in terms of downforce.
But I think it pays a price in efficiency
They tried another diffuser in OZ, which was meant to increase efficiency
but obtained low downforce and reverted back to the one they used in testing

Solving these two aspects is fundamental for their season.

Front wing .. If they found the right design then I think it will be a straightforward downforce gain

[raymondu999]

If you could deduce all that - makes me wonder why McLaren is using Goss/Oatley/Lowe and not you.

[wesley123]

I heard it was because Whitmarsh didn't like him.

[Coefficient]

I don't think Mclaren will go mad with updates at China, it's not their style. Small interative changes that can be properly ratified and converted into performance from race to race with a big update in the middle of the year is how I see it panning out. In China I believe we will see a new floor and diffusor being tested and maybe a few bits and pieces of other stuff but I can't see a 28B rolling out of the garage in Shanghai personally because I feel the car is sound, just needs a massage to find the speed.

[turbof1]

I don't think Mclaren will go mad with updates at China, it's not their style. Small interative changes that can be properly ratified and converted into performance from race to race with a big update in the middle of the year is how I see it panning out. In China I believe we will see a new floor and diffusor being tested and maybe a few bits and pieces of other stuff but I can't see a 28B rolling out of the garage in Shanghai personally because I feel the car is sound, just needs a massage to find the speed.

The situation is different then usual: from 2010 to 2012 they were at the front group with their car, but this year they are behind. A change of tactics and going agressive with larger updates might be a serious option.
If they want to win the title this year, it is not enough to catch up with the fastest car; they'll need to have a car that can beat it.
Maybe not yet in China, but the race after that: highly probable.

[bhall]

[...]
If they want to win the title this year, it is not enough to catch up with the fastest car; they'll need to have a car that can beat it.
Maybe not yet in China, but the race after that: highly probable.

According to...?

[turbof1]

Me? Not telling that I am right, but they already said that they rushed upgrades on the timeline ("experimental updates" in Malaysia). Logically speaking, if their normal pace of effectively updating the car is the same as red bull, who clearly proved they can consistently bring updates that work inmediately, they will stay behind red bull. They need to bring updates at a faster rate then them, for catching up in pace only. Surpassing them you need to increase the pace of updating even more.

China might be more about smaller updates to get the car to work optimal. Throwing in big updates makes that more difficult, but after that they certainly need to be finding bigger chunks of performance through updates. Atleast that is my view on it (again I am not claiming that I can't be wrong).