2025 McLaren F1 Team

[mwillems]

Yes, there is no fact in this, but in my opinion Max would walk to the championship in the Mclaren.

[Darth-Piekus]

Until I see him driving a different car than Red Bull I personally do not buy the whole narrative.

[Emag]

I dont see where this false narrative comes from that the car should be 3 tenths faster than the rest. No driver has done perfect laps in all 3 rounds. You could argue that they werent perfect but still they did a better job than the rest and the difference over one lap is so miniscule that one mistake can send you down many places.

It's not exactly a narrative, it's all there in the best sectors.

People also have this misconception that driving a good sector 1 will always end up giving you worse performance on the rest of the lap. That is not always the case. It's not exactly about tires going off either, it's usually about temps. If you're on a track that doesn't give you the chance to cool off, then yes, going too hard in sector 1 will compromise the rest of the lap.

On China for example, the front left in particular is hit really hard, with temps soaring after S1. And the FL doesn't even have time to cool off because you have another fast corner in T8 and then another soon after at T12, with no real straights between them to give the tire some chance to cool off. So there, you could say that overdoing it in T1-T2-T3 will probably f* up the front left for the rest of the lap.

Suzuka is not like that. In fact, it's a beautifully designed track, because it overworks the front left up until after Degner 2. Then the car has time to cool off and it's up to the front right from the hairpin, to the spoon, until the casio chicane.

Long story short, the best sector times for today are indicative of the car's performance. If any of the drivers pieced it together, they would have been on pole.

[Avocado]

[venkyhere]

Assuming he could drive the Mclaren. So far only Hamilton and Alonso have been consistent in different cars. Im not ready to put him above our drivers unless he is consistent in a car that is not a Red Bull.

Until I see him driving a different car than Red Bull I personally do not buy the whole narrative.

True, man. Very true.
What does this idiot (below) know ?

[mwillems]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Gnwfox1W0AA8l-g.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GnwdbiWWYAAawPC.jpg

And you can see how Lando is trying to be progressive with the brakes into the corner whereas max is using the V shape in the corner that Lando struggles with a little. This is what was being spoken about at the last race.

Given that the Mclaren (According to the team and Lando) prefers not to brake in the corners, it's odd that he took it this way, since this profile obviously is fast and that the Mclaren likes that way of attacking a corner.

[Waz]

Yes, there is no fact in this, but in my opinion Max would walk to the championship in the Mclaren.

This is the problem with Lando's #metoo narrative of the car also being difficult to drive.

If it were really the case, we wouldn't see both drivers delivering such close lap times each session and be consistently at the front.

[Darth-Piekus]

The car of Mclaren is definitely not easy to drive. Norris had to change his driving style to match the twitchiness of the car. Make no mistake the car is fast but it's also picky and you can see it from time to time. Personally I don't like what the social media are doing and unfortunately some fans and pundits also are parroting them without putting any filtering. Mclaren was never dominant but 1 to 2 tenths at best (almost equal in one lap pace to Red Bull) and definitely the speed of the car doesn't cover mistakes to the point that other drivers or teams can't win. Today was a day where our drivers did not obtained 100% of the car unlike the 4 times champion and that gave him the pole position unlike in the previous 3 races. I didn't see anyone talking then about masterclass driving then or greatest of all time. What about Hamilton's performance on Sprint Qualifying and Sprint Race? I didn't see praises of brilliance and masterclass. Just the usual that Hamilton won because the others did not bring their car up to speed. Not that Hamilton did a better job that day. What about the first 3 qualifications and races where Norris and Piastri performed like champions and yet it was just the car. I fail to understand why these double standards exist where one driver does one good thing every 10 races and gets praised beyond any limit.

Just for information we are doing a friendly discussion and I'm not underestimating any driver or want to stir any drama. I just don't like seeing double standards if you understand what I mean.

[101FlyingDutchman]

The car of Mclaren is definitely not easy to drive. Norris had to change his driving style to match the twitchiness of the car. Make no mistake the car is fast but it's also picky and you can see it from time to time. Personally I don't like what the social media are doing and unfortunately some fans and pundits also are parroting them without putting any filtering. Mclaren was never dominant but 1 to 2 tenths at best (almost equal in one lap pace to Red Bull) and definitely the speed of the car doesn't cover mistakes to the point that other drivers or teams can't win. Today was a day where our drivers did not obtained 100% of the car unlike the 4 times champion and that gave him the pole position unlike in the previous 3 races. I didn't see anyone talking then about masterclass driving then or greatest of all time. What about Hamilton's performance on Sprint Qualifying and Sprint Race? I didn't see praises of brilliance and masterclass. Just the usual that Hamilton won because the others did not bring their car up to speed. Not that Hamilton did a better job that day. What about the first 3 qualifications and races where Norris and Piastri performed like champions and yet it was just the car. I fail to understand why these double standards exist where one driver does one good thing every 10 races and gets praised beyond any limit.

Just for information we are doing a friendly discussion and I'm not underestimating any driver or want to stir any drama. I just don't like seeing double standards if you understand what I mean.

Probably your best post ever on this forum

[Cs98]

Until I see him driving a different car than Red Bull I personally do not buy the whole narrative.

Friendly reminder, Oscar and Lando have driven for exactly one team put together, Max has driven for two. Not that any of it matters. How many teams you drive for is a matter of circumstance, not greatness.

[Darth-Piekus]

Until I see him driving a different car than Red Bull I personally do not buy the whole narrative.

Friendly reminder, Oscar and Lando have driven for exactly one team put together, Max has driven for two. Not that any of it matters. How many teams you drive for is a matter of circumstance, not greatness.

Torro Rosso and Red Bull are the same car so nothing really changed and to my eyes a great driver can adapt to a different car and still be great. Fact remains that I would like to pass judgement when I see Max perform just as well in different cars. Hamilton, Alonso, Schumacher, Kimi, Prost and Lauda did it and they have been consistently great till their late 40s. Until that happens I prefer to filter social media or the pundits that parrot them.

[mwillems]

The car of Mclaren is definitely not easy to drive. Norris had to change his driving style to match the twitchiness of the car. Make no mistake the car is fast but it's also picky and you can see it from time to time. Personally I don't like what the social media are doing and unfortunately some fans and pundits also are parroting them without putting any filtering. Mclaren was never dominant but 1 to 2 tenths at best (almost equal in one lap pace to Red Bull) and definitely the speed of the car doesn't cover mistakes to the point that other drivers or teams can't win. Today was a day where our drivers did not obtained 100% of the car unlike the 4 times champion and that gave him the pole position unlike in the previous 3 races. I didn't see anyone talking then about masterclass driving then or greatest of all time. What about Hamilton's performance on Sprint Qualifying and Sprint Race? I didn't see praises of brilliance and masterclass. Just the usual that Hamilton won because the others did not bring their car up to speed. Not that Hamilton did a better job that day. What about the first 3 qualifications and races where Norris and Piastri performed like champions and yet it was just the car. I fail to understand why these double standards exist where one driver does one good thing every 10 races and gets praised beyond any limit.

Just for information we are doing a friendly discussion and I'm not underestimating any driver or want to stir any drama. I just don't like seeing double standards if you understand what I mean.

Because you've got very talented drivers in Perez, Lawson and Tsunoda and they can't handle the RB or even get close. Same as Albon and others before. It's really clear that you've got to be brilliant to tame the RB but that the speed is there. The fact that Max got the pole today is because he is brilliant. The guy has already made a case for saying he might be the most talented F1 driver ever and he hasn't finished yet.

I've got some of those back coloured scatter charts somewhere that showed laptimes over a race. The consistency over a race with which he can bang in lap after lap at the same high level is on another level to either of our guys. It's not a narrative or anything rude, it's just fact.

He's got a dog of a car that, if you can't drive at least 99.9% of a high level of ability, then it will drag its legs and be a mid to lower table car. Max get's pole and he's always somewhere near the front because anything less than brilliant and that car will not care who is sitting in it, it will drop you right back down the grid. Even more impressive, he's doing that super high level of driving required to make that car fast over a race period without any major issues.

Whilst it's always nice to back your team, Lando is not on the level of the best drivers like Hamilton was in his prime, Senna, Prost, Schumacher, Max and others. Oscar has time to see, but those guys were special and I'm not sure either of our boys will make that level, but they can still win championships.

[billamend]

https://www.the-race.com/formula-1/mcla ... do-norris/

We know that with Lando there's one aspect of the car that we need to improve to give him a little bit more of a natural flow when having to deliver the first lap. I think this has been now very well identified, and we plan to do some further work in the coming races to see if we can get the car to more naturally do what he expects and thinks should be possible from the car. I think it has to do with the driver's input to the car, and the response of the car to this input. At the moment, I think it's a little too sensitive.

I think Oscar, in relation to this specific area of the car, seems to be more comfortable. Oscar, he has some other aspects in which he needs to get slightly more comfortable. For instance, for him, sector one today and corner two in particular, was a little bit of a hit and miss. Unfortunately, he missed it in the second attempt of Q3 because the rest of the lap was just amazing.

I have to say that the two drivers, if anything at the moment, when really trying to nail the car at the limit, have slightly different requirements in terms of what they expect naturally from the car and what they get back from the behaviour of the car. So from both sides of the garage, we have some opportunities to work on.

[mwillems]

I was just about to post that. It all but confirms the issue being trail braking, for Lando.

It really is a tale of two corners between the drivers.

Feels like Oscar's issue is that he's not entirely happy with how the rear is behaving mid corner and at exit. It seems limited to the mid speed corners at this track for Oscar with Lando having issues on the low speed corners.

It's not hard to see that there are ways this car can be driven happily through each corner that would put the car 2-3 tenths ahead of Norris' pole if there was a driver who could adapt his style to the corners.

This is pretty slam dunk.

[proteus]

Until I see him driving a different car than Red Bull I personally do not buy the whole narrative.

Friendly reminder, Oscar and Lando have driven for exactly one team put together, Max has driven for two. Not that any of it matters. How many teams you drive for is a matter of circumstance, not greatness.

Torro Rosso and Red Bull are the same car so nothing really changed and to my eyes a great driver can adapt to a different car and still be great. Fact remains that I would like to pass judgement when I see Max perform just as well in different cars. Hamilton, Alonso, Schumacher, Kimi, Prost and Lauda did it and they have been consistently great till their late 40s. Until that happens I prefer to filter social media or the pundits that parrot them.

On the other hand i would call it loyalty. If you get the top money, top equipment and top treatment, why on earth would you want to switch teams? Max was a RedBull investment right from the start. There is a limited time for a racing carrer. In that time you have to achieve maximum results. You dont have time to seek for challenges and throw away seasons to make it work. In the end only the tally of wins, podiums, and WDCs count. Nobody really asks or cares with how many teams this was achieved.

And from majority of the drivers you have listed, most of them switched teams to get the best possible car on the grid. Not because they wanted to try something new and to prove they can win in different cars. They went there with a great hope to get an advantage and better machinery at their disposal. Some timed it perfectly - like Hamilton and Schumacher. Some did it near perfect, like Senna, Raikonnen and Prost, and some failed miserably inbetween like Alonso, which made the most bad decisions in his career, throwing literally away seasons and potential wins while driving god awfull machinery far at the back.