2021 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 10 - 12

[Zynerji]

Let's take a moment to send our thoughts and prayers to those of us who fail at kindergarden physics.

Please correct it with an unrough update then, first grade superstar.

As I hope everyone else on a technical forum knows force is mass times acceleration. Unlike weight which is a vector, mass is a scalar so they are not the same thing. Acceleration is rate of change of velocity so they are not the same, not even roughly!

In physics weight is a force so then what you are describing is power which is force times velocity.

But perhaps you meant to write mass rather than weight in which case you would be talking about impulse which is mass times velocity.

Very disappointing.

I think that's exactly why I used the word "roughly". I know F=m×a, but in the context I was talking about weight, so I broadjumped.

See, you knew what I meant, so why is it so disappointing?

[PlatinumZealot]

Will Buxton is NOT a fan of Max Verstappen. He gives his opinion on the crash.

He's wrong right at the beginning when he says that Hamilton didn't give Verstappen room in the braking zone. He quite obviously did do so. After that it's all just...his grasp of blue flags is poor - in that situation, the blue flag is just a warning to the drivers that there are cars close to them. It's not a "you must let them through" as it's not a lapping situation. He considers Hamilton the aggressor and that Hamilton is making a move on Verstappen in to T1 when Max is entirely behind Lewis on the approach. So he's got the dynamic wrong before he's even started to analyse what's going on later in the event.

Poor assessment by someone who ought to understand the situation better than that.

I have never noticed a blue flags for person exiting the pitlane before. In fact it's normal to begin immediately racing from the pitlane as long as the whit line isn't crossed. Bizarre from Buxton.

[Hoffman900]

He's wrong right at the beginning when he says that Hamilton didn't give Verstappen room in the braking zone. He quite obviously did do so. After that it's all just...his grasp of blue flags is poor - in that situation, the blue flag is just a warning to the drivers that there are cars close to them. It's not a "you must let them through" as it's not a lapping situation. He considers Hamilton the aggressor and that Hamilton is making a move on Verstappen in to T1 when Max is entirely behind Lewis on the approach. So he's got the dynamic wrong before he's even started to analyse what's going on later in the event.

Poor assessment by someone who ought to understand the situation better than that.

It feels like he's reaching for a way to make it Hamiltons fault.

Indeed so. It's like DiResta's cringe-worthy attempts during the broadcast.

Will Bruxton, who I’m neutral on, also has never been a driver. Damon Hill and Johnny Herbert were pretty in the “Max messed up and potentially on purpose” camp.

I like Max as a talent, but anything beyond driving and he comes across as a poorly balanced person. Yuki got roasted for less in terms of radio etiquette. I can’t think of a single employer who would put up with his outbursts either.

[nimoraca]

Great analysis of the incident:


It literally seams that Max, whenever on the inside, feels entitled to the entire race track and "forces" Hamilton to back out of it, but when situations are reversed, he feels he has the right to some space and has no notion of backing out. The only reason they haven't crashed out 5-6 times this year is because Hamilton backing out of it when on the outside.

[RZS10]

Buxton starts off with a factually incorrect statement and then applies some really weird completely backwards logic.

There's easily a car's width + a bit, even more if you count the white line as part of the track.
This is just Lewis' car copied and moved to the right.

[straightline]

Great analysis of the incident:


It literally seams that Max, whenever on the inside, feels entitled to the entire race track and "forces" Hamilton to back out of it, but when situations are reversed, he feels he has the right to some space and has no notion of backing out. The only reason they haven't crashed out 5-6 times this year is because Hamilton backing out of it when on the outside.

Hamilton is to blame, that he is too fair a racer.
Maybe he will learn from the crash and from now on push Verstappen straight onto the gravel. Max would have done it to him - in this case gravel is the run-off zone

[Mogster]

Max only got alongside by carrying too much speed into the corner. I find Buxton quite annoying on D2S.

[Zynerji]

Max only got alongside by carrying too much speed into the corner. I find Buxton quite annoying on D2S.

How was he carrying "too much speed" if he still made the corner?

[f1jcw]

Max only got alongside by carrying too much speed into the corner. I find Buxton quite annoying on D2S.

How was he carrying "too much speed" if he still made the corner?

He never fully did, he was half off track. Thats not making the corner.

[e30ernest]

Hamilton is to blame, that he is too fair a racer.
Maybe he will learn from the crash and from now on push Verstappen straight onto the gravel. Max would have done it to him - in this case gravel is the run-off zone

Yeah I found that conclusion from him to be rather odd. If Lewis did what he said Lewis should have done (which is do what Max did to him on lap 1), I'm pretty sure Lewis would get handed a penalty there based on the penalties handed out in the previous races.

[Zynerji]

Max only got alongside by carrying too much speed into the corner. I find Buxton quite annoying on D2S.

How was he carrying "too much speed" if he still made the corner?

He never fully did, he was half off track. Thats not making the corner.

So, he didn't turn right into turn one, and make it around? The accident was at the turn 2 entry?

[Gillian]

There have also been various takes on the incident from international media outlets.

In the United Kingdom, the BBC labelled the collision "frightening", with their race report stating that Hamilton "held the inside line" whilst Verstappen "refused to yield on the outside". Their description of the clash, though, seemed to avoid placing any blame: "Verstappen had more than half a car's length by Hamilton, but was squeezed off the track and as his Red Bull bounced against the kerbs, a rotating rear wheel launched him into the air and pitched it over Hamilton's car before thumping down on the air box which sits just above the driver's head."

The BBC noted the role played by the Halo device in protecting Hamilton from injury. Similarly, Spanish outlet Marca had concerns about safety given the multiple run-ins that have occurred between Verstappen and Hamilton this season. They wrote: "It seems that every time they cross each other on the track (it happened twice yesterday), they are going to beat each other up pretty badly. Great for the show, but for the sport itself or their physical safety, we will see the consequences."

Meanwhile, in the French media, L'Equipe placed the blame on the egos of both drivers, writing: "On Sunday at Monza, Verstappen and Hamilton could both have taken turns at a braking or cornering point to give up the lead. It would seem that their egos, which make them champions, no longer allow them to do so."

Such a remark suggests that the battle between Hamilton and Verstappen has reached a new level, and is potentially becoming iconic. This is something picked up by some Italian media outlets. Gazzetta dello Sport carried an image of the collision on their front page and wrote: "The duel between Verstappen and Hamilton has become powerful. A fight that may go down in history like the one between Alain Prost and Ayrton Senna. Just like the picture of Verstappen on top of Hamilton's car has already entered the history books. The F1 world is currently watching a battle that has been dreamt of for years."

[f1jcw]

How was he carrying "too much speed" if he still made the corner?

He never fully did, he was half off track. Thats not making the corner.

So, he didn't turn right into turn one, and make it around? The accident was at the turn 2 entry?

He went half off track and over the sausage kerbs

[DiogoBrand]

I honestly was never a fan of Max because of his dirty driving, but when two cars are side by side at turn 1, and then at turn 2 the driver on the outside doesn't leave enough space for the driver on the inside to make the corner without going over a sausage kerb, I really don't see how you can blame the one on the inside.

Hamilton knew he was on cold tyres and Max would therefore be faster and go by. He did what he thought he had to do to not let that happen.

[DiogoBrand]

He went half off track and over the sausage kerbs

So by your logic it's Max's fault for going off track when the driver alongside him hasn't left enough space?