2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[SmallSoldier]

I'm excited to see George in the Merc. He's well groomed, but you can see the cockyness behind that in his interviews.

We will see how he handles a direct and even comparison with the GOAT. It will make him or break him.

It’s one to watch for sure… Although, this season he might get a bit of a pass with it been his first season in Mercedes, but if he can keep it close and even ahead in a few races, it would be a passing grade

[Ryar]

I'm excited to see George in the Merc. He's well groomed, but you can see the cockyness behind that in his interviews.

We will see how he handles a direct and even comparison with the GOAT. It will make him or break him.

It’s one to watch for sure… Although, this season he might get a bit of a pass with it been his first season in Mercedes, but if he can keep it close and even ahead in a few races, it would be a passing grade

Good thing for George is, the cars are going to be absolute unknown and it's starting from zero for both drivers. Usually Lewis is slow to start a new season and that is the time for all sorts of acclimatization issues to be sorted for George. By now, George must have spent loads of time in Brackley with his engineers and chief mechanic to form fundamental relationship. I guess he would have spent considerable time in Mercedes sim to get adjusted to the procedures. Preseason Testing should be an opportunity to simply put his factory learning to practice and get basic things sorted. I am sure he is intelligent enough to make good use of time available to be as prepared to go on track. If all that homework is done right, he should be in good stead to compete right from the beginning.

[dans79]

The number one thing George will have to prove, is that he can handle the week in week out pressure and stress of driving a car that will most like be at the sharp end of the grid.

[proteus]

Huh? What are you talking about?
You went off on four different tangents there. Why does everything have to be driver versus driver? Sigh.

I'm talking about how George Russell will gel with Mr. Musconi and if Musconi's conservative style will suit him well.

To be fair PZ, I’m not sure how anyone was meant to guess at your second paragraph there from you previous comment about VB’s race engineer.
Do we know who will be working with George or Lewis yet? I doubt it. Do we know how George likes his car to be set up and how that compares with Lewis? I doubt it. When are we likely to find the first of these out? The first race. When are we likely to find the second of these out? Never (beyond platitudes of “they like a similar set-up” we will be left with wing settings, as usual.

There is also a question what team management wants. Do they want an eight driver title for Lewis, or George as the new champion? My guess would be Lewis and his eight championship. Especially with the budget cap, teams might be forced into prioritising one driver over the other, due to the lack of funds available troughout the season. Even more so if other drivers become a threat for the title.

[Ryar]

The number one thing George will have to prove, is that he can handle the week in week out pressure and stress of driving a car that will most like be at the sharp end of the grid.

We have seen abundant examples of young drivers taking to the sharp end of the grid like duck to the pond. Someone like George has won his junior championships, which obviously gives him the mindset to fight at the front. Lewis, Vettel, Ricciardo, Max and Leclerc have all shown young drivers can do it. I don't think it's such a big deal. These guys go one lap and one session at a time and quite naturally, there is no need to think of a whole season's worth of effort required. Every driver dreams of fighting at the front and when they get an equipment to do it, they would relish it. It's not a scary situation, but one that every driver would love to be in and gets the highest motivation to go for it.

[mwillems]

It was only one race of course, but Georges sole race in a Merc was very impressive.

You don't know until the moment comes, but I have the impression he will be very strong.

But he could be immensely fast, but if he is always 1 tenth behind then it can take its toll. And then there is Lewis' consistency. George will have the chance to go and lead the team eventually, if he can take the relentless pressure and still develop positively.

[Big Tea]

The number one thing George will have to prove, is that he can handle the week in week out pressure and stress of driving a car that will most like be at the sharp end of the grid.

And the media. It is one thing being 'the next big thing waiting for a chance' and being the guy that got the golden ticket, and may not be living up to expectations.

Non driving pressures will probably be worse for him than time in the car

[Ryar]

The number one thing George will have to prove, is that he can handle the week in week out pressure and stress of driving a car that will most like be at the sharp end of the grid.

And the media. It is one thing being 'the next big thing waiting for a chance' and being the guy that got the golden ticket, and may not be living up to expectations.

Non driving pressures will probably be worse for him than time in the car

Imagine if he manages to beat Lewis a few times early in the season. That confidence can take make him far more stronger. If Mercedes provides equal opportunity and brings the rules of engagement that existed in Nico's duration, then George simply need to move ahead of Lewis in turn 1 and the preferential strategy would be his. Pressure would be on Lewis to go in a bit of overdrive mode like in 2016. If there are other teams also involve in fight and in some races if couple of other drivers slot in between George and Lewis, then George can create bigger points gap. It may well be other way round too. But George has nothing to lose and can only gain.
There is no news of Lewis even going to factory and if George is already spending time in the factory with engineers and in Simulator, his preparations are probably already ahead of Lewis'.

[AeroDynamic]

I expect Lewis could even start off slower than George because of how '21 ended for him and how the experience of spending time with Engineers and prepping for a season for the 10th time with Mercedes is getting a bit old. On the other hand, George is like an excited puppy that can't wait to spend time with his new owner, and can't wait to drive a Mercedes and prepare for his first season in a top team. Lewis would have to spend more hours at the factory in the sim than George to make up for however far behind he is.

But then he's never been a big advocate of Sim work, but I think that goes against him

[Ryar]

I expect Lewis could even start off slower than George because of how '21 ended for him and how the experience of spending time with Engineers and prepping for a season for the 10th time with Mercedes is getting a bit old. On the other hand, George is like an excited puppy that can't wait to spend time with his new owner, and can't wait to drive a Mercedes and prepare for his first season in a top team. Lewis would have to spend more hours at the factory in the sim than George to make up for however far behind he is.

But then he's never been a big advocate of Sim work, but I think that goes against him

He let his guard down in 2016 by not focusing on the new clutch mechanism for which he paid an awful price and never had an opportunity to recover as Nico tightened the screws. If he has allowed the debacle of 2021 to affect him, loss would be his if he loses ground at the start of the season. If George comes out as good as he is expected to be, well even if he is even better than Bottas, then bye bye 2022 for Lewis. Nobody to blame.

[AeroDynamic]

I expect Lewis could even start off slower than George because of how '21 ended for him and how the experience of spending time with Engineers and prepping for a season for the 10th time with Mercedes is getting a bit old. On the other hand, George is like an excited puppy that can't wait to spend time with his new owner, and can't wait to drive a Mercedes and prepare for his first season in a top team. Lewis would have to spend more hours at the factory in the sim than George to make up for however far behind he is.

But then he's never been a big advocate of Sim work, but I think that goes against him

He let his guard down in 2016 by not focusing on the new clutch mechanism for which he paid an awful price and never had an opportunity to recover as Nico tightened the screws. If he has allowed the debacle of 2021 to affect him, loss would be his if he loses ground at the start of the season. If George comes out as good as he is expected to be, well even if he is even better than Bottas, then bye bye 2022 for Lewis. Nobody to blame.

what awful price is that? relative to the engine component failures and subsequent grid penalties, along with the in-race engine failure in the final phase? I thought without those he had Nico covered all over again –

Why would there be somebody to blame?

Even if George is a bit better and faster than Bottas, and a little faster than Lewis even, doesn't mean its 'bye bye' for Lewis. Just look at Verstappen for example, he was faster than Daniel Ricciardo often enough, but he still couldn't put together a season to beat him until Daniel's car was blowing up every other race into their 3rd season together.

[Ryar]

I expect Lewis could even start off slower than George because of how '21 ended for him and how the experience of spending time with Engineers and prepping for a season for the 10th time with Mercedes is getting a bit old. On the other hand, George is like an excited puppy that can't wait to spend time with his new owner, and can't wait to drive a Mercedes and prepare for his first season in a top team. Lewis would have to spend more hours at the factory in the sim than George to make up for however far behind he is.

But then he's never been a big advocate of Sim work, but I think that goes against him

He let his guard down in 2016 by not focusing on the new clutch mechanism for which he paid an awful price and never had an opportunity to recover as Nico tightened the screws. If he has allowed the debacle of 2021 to affect him, loss would be his if he loses ground at the start of the season. If George comes out as good as he is expected to be, well even if he is even better than Bottas, then bye bye 2022 for Lewis. Nobody to blame.

what awful price is that? relative to the engine component failures and subsequent grid penalties, along with the in-race engine failure in the final phase? I thought without those he had Nico covered all over again –

Why would there be somebody to blame?

Even if George is a bit better and faster than Bottas, and a little faster than Lewis even, doesn't mean its 'bye bye' for Lewis. Just look at Verstappen for example, he was faster than Daniel Ricciardo often enough, but he still couldn't put together a season to beat him until Daniel's car was blowing up every other race into their 3rd season together.

Fact is, every time Daniel's car broke down in 2018, he was behind Max! Yeah, a Fact and Max beat him fair and square. But then, what is Max and Daniel doing in this discussion?
The awful price that Lewis paid in 2016 was that, he lost starts in Australia and Bahrain. Especilally in Bahrain, where after his poor start, he became a target for a reckless Bottas (in a willaims) that caused car damage to Lewis. That damage needed replacement, which failed again in qualifying in China. In China race, as he started from behind, he had a collision and damaged his wing adding further agony. The famous Spain collision, where he once again had a poor start and crashed into Nico. That was the awful price that I am talking about from which he never recovered. Had he done his homework well in testing, he could have avoided those start f*** ups, which he sorted well after mid season. Until then, he believed it was the problem in equipment, but more serious work later helped him overcome it. That is the kind of lapse in focus to understand subtle nuances that can put him back in a season full of unknowns on the car.

[AeroDynamic]

He let his guard down in 2016 by not focusing on the new clutch mechanism for which he paid an awful price and never had an opportunity to recover as Nico tightened the screws. If he has allowed the debacle of 2021 to affect him, loss would be his if he loses ground at the start of the season. If George comes out as good as he is expected to be, well even if he is even better than Bottas, then bye bye 2022 for Lewis. Nobody to blame.

what awful price is that? relative to the engine component failures and subsequent grid penalties, along with the in-race engine failure in the final phase? I thought without those he had Nico covered all over again –

Why would there be somebody to blame?

Even if George is a bit better and faster than Bottas, and a little faster than Lewis even, doesn't mean its 'bye bye' for Lewis. Just look at Verstappen for example, he was faster than Daniel Ricciardo often enough, but he still couldn't put together a season to beat him until Daniel's car was blowing up every other race into their 3rd season together.

Fact is, every time Daniel's car broke down in 2018, he was behind Max! Yeah, a Fact and Max beat him fair and square. But then, what is Max and Daniel doing in this discussion?
The awful price that Lewis paid in 2016 was that, he lost starts in Australia and Bahrain. Especilally in Bahrain, where after his poor start, he became a target for a reckless Bottas (in a willaims) that caused car damage to Lewis. That damage needed replacement, which failed again in qualifying in China. In China race, as he started from behind, he had a collision and damaged his wing adding further agony. The famous Spain collision, where he once again had a poor start and crashed into Nico. That was the awful price that I am talking about from which he never recovered. Had he done his homework well in testing, he could have avoided those start f*** ups, which he sorted well after mid season. Until then, he believed it was the problem in equipment, but more serious work later helped him overcome it. That is the kind of lapse in focus to understand subtle nuances that can put him back in a season full of unknowns on the car.

I don't think that's factually accurate at all - he had more DNF's due to Mechanical than Max did in the first half the '18 season, but was still leading him by the summer break. So, after he signed a new team, I don't know what happened but Max wasn't beating him (fair or otherwise) in 3 seasons. If Mercedes have a competitive Package at the front, arguably, Lewis may not need the edge in pace, as Ricciardo proved in 3 seasons against Max.

So you blame his start for Bottas' reckless mistake? Okay, with that logic, I guess it wasn't Bottas' fault what he did to Max's championship because Max/RBR got the set up and prep wrong for Hungary. I'n my view, both of these drivers were unlucky. The Spain collision has nothing to do with starts, but everything to do with the way they were racing each other, with Nico ultimately doing what Verstappen was doing in Baku '18. You don't need to have the best start to win races; may I remind you, he did win more races than Nico did that season despite all the grid penalties and engine loss in malayasia, and in spite this 'awful price' of poor starts as an argument you are trying to sew together.

Reliability decided '16 not prep.

[AeroDynamic]

Fact is, every time Daniel's car broke down in 2018, he was behind Max! Yeah, a Fact and Max beat him fair and square. But then, what is Max and Daniel doing in this discussion?
The awful price that Lewis paid in 2016 was that, he lost starts in Australia and Bahrain. Especilally in Bahrain, where after his poor start, he became a target for a reckless Bottas (in a willaims) that caused car damage to Lewis. That damage needed replacement, which failed again in qualifying in China. In China race, as he started from behind, he had a collision and damaged his wing adding further agony. The famous Spain collision, where he once again had a poor start and crashed into Nico. That was the awful price that I am talking about from which he never recovered. Had he done his homework well in testing, he could have avoided those start f*** ups, which he sorted well after mid season. Until then, he believed it was the problem in equipment, but more serious work later helped him overcome it. That is the kind of lapse in focus to understand subtle nuances that can put him back in a season full of unknowns on the car.

I don't think that's factually accurate at all - he had more DNF's due to Mechanical than Max did in the first half the '18 season, but was still leading him by the summer break. So, after he signed a new team, I don't know what happened but Max wasn't beating him (fair or otherwise) in 3 seasons. If Mercedes have a competitive Package at the front, arguably, Lewis may not need the edge in pace, as Ricciardo proved in 3 seasons against Max.

I have never seen someone denying something without doing a bit of research. Lets look at facts of 2018 season.
Bahrain - Ricciardo Retired, was ahead of Max.
Azerbaijan - Ricciardo ran into Max.
Austria - Ricciardo retired from 5th place while Max was leading the race and won it.
Germany - Ricciardo retired from 6th while Max was leading the race and finished 4th.
Belgium - Max started 7th and Ricciardo started 8th. At the start, Ricciardo was hit from behind, rear wing damage and retired. Max remained ahead, also got a front wing damage, but still finished 3rd.
Italy - Max started from 5th and Ricciardo 15th. Ricciardo retired from 10th place, while Max was 2nd. Max finished 5th.
USA - Ric started 5th and Max 15th. Ricc retired from 4th while Max was behind him. Max finished 2nd.
Mexico - Ric on pole and Max started 2nd. Ric gets a bad starts and Max leads. Ricciardo retired from 2nd after having recovered from a poor start that put him 5th.

Ricciardo's DNFs had no bearing on Max finished ahead, as he was anyway ahead. Hence, Max beat Ric fair and square.

So you blame his start for Bottas' reckless mistake? Okay, with that logic, I guess it wasn't Bottas' fault what he did to Max's championship because Max/RBR got the set up and prep wrong for Hungary. I'n my view, both of these drivers were unlucky. The Spain collision has nothing to do with starts, but everything to do with the way they were racing each other, with Nico ultimately doing what Verstappen was doing in Baku '18. You don't need to have the best start to win races; may I remind you, he did win more races than Nico did that season despite all the grid penalties and engine loss in malayasia, and in spite this 'awful price' of poor starts as an argument you are trying to sew together.

Reliability decided '16 not prep.

There is no parallel to Lewis's Bahrain and Max's Hungary. The point is, Lewis's failed start made him a target for Bottas. Had he managed a good start, he would have stayed ahead. You can go on covering his lack of effort in sorting starts.

You said, 'every time Ricciardo's car broke down in '18, he was behind Max!' well, thank you for doing the research to disprove that what you said was false, not fact. The very first race you cite, he retired ahead of Max, not behind. Again, like I said, Up to the Summer break (by Belgium GP) Ricciardo led Max in the championship; every single race, despite the fact that Ricciardo had suffered more reliability failures than Verstappen himself had done up the summer break. Even the Baku incident, that you infer was Ricciardo's fault, I don't think many see it that way. After the summer break, well, things changed massively; both in Ricciardo's contracts, relationship to RBR, and his reliability, clearly. So its no surprise that Ricciardo suddenly found himself nowhere after that, wouldn't necessarily call it fair myself.

There is a parallel; you're blaming Hamilton for the contact from Bottas, which isn't in fact his fault, and had no bearing on his season. If your start puts you in a more vulnerable position, to be in contact, doesn't mean its your fault if another driver makes a mistake. I really find it astounding that we are blaming this race start and contact from Bottas as an awful price, as you put it, for his championship loss in '16. You can't control what other drivers are doing, you are only driving your own car. Unless you cause the contact, you are not to blame. If your engines are failing, that is the biggest price you can pay in any championship, as another driver would know if the rain didn't bail him out in Russia last year for example.

[lio007]

Oh...is this really the 2022 Mercedes Team thread?
Can we get back on topic?