Mercedes W13

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter do not belong here.
ENGINE TUNER
ENGINE TUNER
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Re: Mercedes W13

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djones wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 11:32
I must say, fair play to Mercedes for releasing all of this footage. Especially when you have the likes of Redbull not even showing the proper car at an alleged launch event.
Fair play or foolish play? I don't like it, I prefer the RBR way in this matter.

ENGINE TUNER
ENGINE TUNER
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Re: Mercedes W13

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ajprice wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 11:59
Mercedes floor surface

Looks like some sort of sea monster that lurks in the depths waiting for unsuspecting Nimo to swim by.
Last edited by ENGINE TUNER on 19 Feb 2022, 13:48, edited 1 time in total.

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AeroDynamic
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Re: Mercedes W13

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@4:35 Hamilton's feedback on the new car under the new regs / philosophy (based on the simulator)


@1:31 and 10:08 - Georges feedback on driving the real car


I don't think they could have a massively new car with the cost cap. that's not efficient.. unless they prepared a mule prototype car before the cost cap kicked in? might explain the reappearance of the wavy floor?

if this car is not the real McCoy, assuming the cost cap is not part of the equation in using it, then I guess as a strategy it would potentially distract teams to copy / waste time on something that they aren't really pursuing fully?
Last edited by AeroDynamic on 19 Feb 2022, 14:22, edited 2 times in total.

mclaren_mircea
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Re: Mercedes W13

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Neuron wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 13:41
DarthPlagueisTheVise wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 13:35
I am honestly puzzled as to why merc are releasing so much footage of the new car. They could have just done the launch with the show car and then do a shakedown like RB
Two options:

1. They are veeeery confident
2. Final car will be totally different
It would be a disaster with the budget cap to make a 2019 winter testing. It will affect the resources for developing the 2022 car those for the 2023 car if they waste time and resources to bring a B-version in 2022. The car has to be dominant and switch earlier than Red Bull on the next year car.

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siskue2005
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Re: Mercedes W13

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Great analysis by ex Mercedes f1 aerodynamists

cooken
cooken
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Re: Mercedes W13

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Doesn't all this on track running fall under the filming day rules? Hence would they be required to release all the footage, or at least some of it, to the public?

Still very possible (likely) that a lot of the aero features are several design iterations old, or just very early conceptual things they want to get correlation with before committing further developments.

pantherxxx
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Re: Mercedes W13

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siskue2005 wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 14:05


Great analysis by ex Mercedes f1 aerodynamists
21:18: "Now after reading the rules I genuinely don't understand how is this legal."

That's exactly what I think about this floor.

Just_a_fan
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Re: Mercedes W13

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FWandE wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 11:05
Just_a_fan wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 10:28
How long before Red Bull protest those mirror strakes? :lol:
I wonder whether those strakes are considered to be part of the sidepod bodywork and not an added aero element.

I just watched the B sport video, not surprisingly an expert gives a much better and correct explanation :shock:
Is that the guy that thinks the small lump on the inside of the head restraints is an aero device (it isn't, it's for the drivers to lean their head against), and the metal bar creating the lifting point below the roll hoop is an aero rake (it isn't)? That expert?
If you are more fortunate than others, build a larger table not a taller fence.

Just_a_fan
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Re: Mercedes W13

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Stu wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 12:43
ajprice wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 11:59
Mercedes floor surface

I’m not sure that we are seeing the final product here, there looks to be something draped over the floor in front of the pressure measuring tubes.
It could be the start of ‘the phoney war’ for 2022; getting other teams to waste their (restricted) CFD runs on investigation of how it works.
Depending on how you read the rules around double curvature in the floor, there is the potential for it not to be legal. There is no floor edge wing either, and that has the potential to be very powerful.
The teams all run their designs by the FIA so they're likely to be sure it's legal.
If you are more fortunate than others, build a larger table not a taller fence.

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: Mercedes W13

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HungarianRacer wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 12:30
siskue2005 wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 11:17
ajprice wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 11:04
The B Sport video explains the mirror support strakes, looks like they're legal there.
Yes, it looks like the mirror support and wavy floor is within rules and easy to copy according to ex F1 aerodynamics
Question is, how useful will that be for other teams? For this Merc, it seems to work well in concert with the relatively tall, concave, outward-cambered sidepod wall, a random, relatively shallow turning vane around that area wouldn't be that useful for teams with completely different sidepod shapes I'd imagine...
Mercedes also have a relatively sharp rear shoulder on the sidepod below that strake. The whole shape of the sidepod will be predicated on the way the strake functions. Teams would likely need to copy the sidepod design to really benefit.

Also the outer strake of the floor mouth is basically a bargeboard, with the outer channel of the mouth having a much lower top edge to maximise the height of the fin. This all will work with the wavy floor edge to extract air and create downforce like the edge of the floor did last year.

Not things that can be simply copied, I would guess.
If you are more fortunate than others, build a larger table not a taller fence.

f1jcw
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Re: Mercedes W13

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cooken wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 14:14
Doesn't all this on track running fall under the filming day rules? Hence would they be required to release all the footage, or at least some of it, to the public?
Then what about redbulls running

cooken
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Re: Mercedes W13

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f1jcw wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 15:15
cooken wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 14:14
Doesn't all this on track running fall under the filming day rules? Hence would they be required to release all the footage, or at least some of it, to the public?
Then what about redbulls running
Indeed.

JPBD1990
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Re: Mercedes W13

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pantherxxx wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 14:41
siskue2005 wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 14:05


Great analysis by ex Mercedes f1 aerodynamists
21:18: "Now after reading the rules I genuinely don't understand how is this legal."

That's exactly what I think about this floor.
Kyle.engineers comments that the front and rear wings are among the most cranked we’ve seen so far. Given they’re relatively ‘inefficient’ aero surfaces compared to, for example, the underfloor and diffuser, does this suggest they’ve struggled to extract the downforce there and need it from the wings instead?

Or are they just doing a ‘downforce at all costs’ type approach…

F1doc
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Re: Mercedes W13

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JPBD1990 wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 15:27
Kyle.engineers comments that the front and rear wings are among the most cranked we’ve seen so far. Given they’re relatively ‘inefficient’ aero surfaces compared to, for example, the underfloor and diffuser, does this suggest they’ve struggled to extract the downforce there and need it from the wings instead?

Or are they just doing a ‘downforce at all costs’ type approach…
With the new regs, the more downforce available probably allows for the most leeway with set up; easier to trim some off than not have enough.

mrluke
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Re: Mercedes W13

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cooken wrote:
19 Feb 2022, 14:14
Doesn't all this on track running fall under the filming day rules? Hence would they be required to release all the footage, or at least some of it, to the public?

Still very possible (likely) that a lot of the aero features are several design iterations old, or just very early conceptual things they want to get correlation with before committing further developments.
My understanding of the "filming days" is for the teams own marketing, why do you think there is an obligation to release the footage to the public?