Mercedes W13

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter do not belong here.
mkay
mkay
16
Joined: 21 May 2010, 21:30

Re: Mercedes W13

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zubster wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 11:41
The car is looking a lot more settled today. Also ride height is higher.
True, but the car is so stiffly sprung, though.

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Giando
93
Joined: 10 Jan 2012, 17:56
Location: Milan (Italy)

Re: Mercedes W13

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Oh, by the way...

Image

:D

ashishkel
ashishkel
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Joined: 11 Mar 2022, 12:04

Re: Mercedes W13

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F1Krof wrote:
Nose running as high as legally allowed I guess.
But not high as RB?

Sent from my PCT-AL10 using Tapatalk


Marty_Y
Marty_Y
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Joined: 31 Mar 2021, 23:37

Re: Mercedes W13

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More on the cooling, I quoted some interesting paragraphs but the whole thing is worth reading, it's not very long.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merc ... y/8894802/

Mercedes F1 car borrows "a few tricks" from rocket technology
Formula 1 chief technical officer Pat Symonds says that a "few little tricks" in cooling have allowed Mercedes to pursue its dramatic new aerodynamic package with its W13.

By:
Adam Cooper
Mar 11, 2022, 9:42 AM
Symonds said that technology derived from the aerospace industry has helped Mercedes to package an ultra-efficient cooling system that in turn has enabled it to create the narrow sidepod arrangement unveiled on the first day of the Bahrain test.

Symonds admitted that when his team of engineers wrote the rules and created a full-size model of the 2022 car they anticipated a requirement for larger radiator inlets.

"I guess it was just a little bit more radical than we thought," he said.

"As we developed the aerodynamics of this set of regulations, obviously, we looked at lots of things, not just downforce producing, but we had to look at brake cooling, had to look at tyre heating. And particularly, we had to look at engine cooling.

"And we were using a bigger inlet than that [on the W13] to get the cooling. I think on the Mercedes, they have a few little tricks in there that help them in this respect.

"So for example the intercooler, is a very, very neat device, it's a water/air intercooler, which of course Mercedes have had for a little while, but I think this is a little bit different.

"And that's why they can really shrink wrap this car a little bit more than most of the others can."

Expanding on what Mercedes had done, he added: "The intercooler that I was talking about, I think, comes from Reaction Engines in Oxfordshire, the people who are doing this sort of air breathing rocket motor, and the sort of spin-off from that has been this really extremely efficient heat exchanger technology.

"And I think that's part of the reason why they've been able to produce the car the way they have."

Symonds stressed that all teams have honed their packaging to make sidepods as small as possible.

"I think one of the trends we're seeing, and it's not particular to these new regulations, but we're seeing that it's very, very difficult to start to package everything into the side pods.

"People think what's in the side pods, surely it's only the radiators, the heat exchangers?

"But of course, there's a lot more, there's a lot of electronics in there. I think some people are moving that electronics into that keel area."

The sidepods and cooling concept aside, Symonds suggested that nothing else on the W13 had caught his eye.

"I think the rest of it looks dare I say reasonably conventional, if there's such a thing as conventional. The front wing treatment, very much what we expected to see.

"Rear wing yes, a little bit of change in camber in that again, which a lot of people have adopted for this very, very clear sort of path to the lower rear wing, the sort of beam wing at the back, which a lot of people are trying to do now."

smilodon
smilodon
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Joined: 10 Mar 2022, 21:24

Re: Mercedes W13

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I want to see how this is going to work when they have to follow other car.... They can't simulate on tests with one car...

mzso
mzso
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Joined: 05 Apr 2014, 14:52

Re: Mercedes W13

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Just_a_fan wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 12:03
Hmmm, I would think that sort of thing is commercially sensitive information that Mercedes and Reaction Engines might not like broadcast. If FOM have privileged access to such information, they probably shouldn't be throwing it out in interviews.

Aside from that, if it's true that they're using that sort of technology then that's pretty damn cool! (excuse the pun)
They don't, they're not the FIA. Ross Brawn just highlighted that they're not privy to technical details.
He is as free to speculate as everyone else.

shamyakovic
shamyakovic
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Joined: 26 Dec 2013, 22:40

Re: Mercedes W13

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mzso wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 13:08
Just_a_fan wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 12:03
Hmmm, I would think that sort of thing is commercially sensitive information that Mercedes and Reaction Engines might not like broadcast. If FOM have privileged access to such information, they probably shouldn't be throwing it out in interviews.

Aside from that, if it's true that they're using that sort of technology then that's pretty damn cool! (excuse the pun)
They don't, they're not the FIA. Ross Brawn just highlighted that they're not privy to technical details.
He is as free to speculate as everyone else.
He was not speculating was he?
He said that he knows this is what is going on

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AeroDynamic
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Joined: 28 Sep 2021, 12:25
Location: La règle du jeu

Re: Mercedes W13

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Its clear for me, Pat knows something. He talked about the intercooler in a way that you'd have to be familiar with it or are getting third hand information from someone who is. (Ahem, the FIA and FOM have been working very close together technically on this regulation! They are monitoring the teams designs aren't they!?)

mzso
mzso
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Joined: 05 Apr 2014, 14:52

Re: Mercedes W13

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shamyakovic wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 13:11
mzso wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 13:08
Just_a_fan wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 12:03
Hmmm, I would think that sort of thing is commercially sensitive information that Mercedes and Reaction Engines might not like broadcast. If FOM have privileged access to such information, they probably shouldn't be throwing it out in interviews.

Aside from that, if it's true that they're using that sort of technology then that's pretty damn cool! (excuse the pun)
They don't, they're not the FIA. Ross Brawn just highlighted that they're not privy to technical details.
He is as free to speculate as everyone else.
He was not speculating was he?
He said that he knows this is what is going on
He said "I think".

Sevach
Sevach
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Joined: 07 Jun 2012, 17:00

Re: Mercedes W13

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AeroDynamic wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 13:14
Its clear for me, Pat knows something. He talked about the intercooler in a way that you'd have to be familiar with it or are getting third hand information from someone who is. (Ahem, the FIA and FOM have been working very close together technically on this regulation! They are monitoring the teams designs aren't they!?)
He didn't sound like he was making guesses...

shamyakovic
shamyakovic
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Joined: 26 Dec 2013, 22:40

Re: Mercedes W13

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mzso wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 13:15
shamyakovic wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 13:11
mzso wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 13:08


They don't, they're not the FIA. Ross Brawn just highlighted that they're not privy to technical details.
He is as free to speculate as everyone else.
He was not speculating was he?
He said that he knows this is what is going on
He said "I think".
He was awfully specific for some thing he was speculating, that's to me is inside knowledge

mzso
mzso
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Joined: 05 Apr 2014, 14:52

Re: Mercedes W13

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shamyakovic wrote:
11 Mar 2022, 13:24
He was awfully specific for some thing he was speculating, that's to me is inside knowledge
Then you have a flimsy definition of insider knowledge.
He might simply have been familiar with Reaction Engines' technology.
Last edited by mzso on 12 Mar 2022, 01:40, edited 1 time in total.

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Shakeman
33
Joined: 21 Mar 2011, 13:31
Location: UK

Re: Mercedes W13

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Kyle Engineers on the new side-odd.

edit. Side-odd? Thanks autocorrect you might've just come up with the perfect description of the Merc sidepods.
Last edited by Shakeman on 11 Mar 2022, 14:11, edited 2 times in total.

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214270
18
Joined: 27 Apr 2019, 18:49

Re: Mercedes W13

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Anyone able to crystallise exactly what the issue is with Mercs mirrors? As I can make out the form itself isn’t unique, the fact that the mirrors appear to influence the winglets downstream isn’t unique either, AT seem to be doing it. So the only part Merc are on their own on, is that it’s mounted without any horizontal support connecting it directly to the chassis?

EDIT: Explained in the Kyle Vid.
Last edited by 214270 on 11 Mar 2022, 14:05, edited 1 time in total.
Team ANTI-HYPE. Prove it, then I’ll anoint you.

PhillipM
PhillipM
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Joined: 16 May 2011, 15:18
Location: Over the road from Boothy...

Re: Mercedes W13

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The reaction engines stuff is microtube, not the first time it's been used in F1, their trick is they made them far more durable than they used to be