This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
Yes, Spa happened. But I feel like it's incredibly lazy to dismiss Lewis's input because "he's never driven a bad car since 2009". I'm not sure I even understand what that means.
For example, I could imagine the opposite scenario. Russell so used to driving ****boxes, that he thinks the Merc is perfect because he's never driven anything better. Whereas Hamilton knows what a dominant car feels like, has an expectation, and can say when something just isn't good enough.
I think it means they had it so easy, never really had to work and put thought into getting the car to work better.
even if the car was crap, it was still pretty good.
they have un-learned to problem solve and work around problems.
The must now first re-educate themselves.
I think it means they had it so easy, never really had to work and put thought into getting the car to work better.
even if the car was crap, it was still pretty good.
they have un-learned to problem solve and work around problems.
The must now first re-educate themselves.
What utter garbage.
So are you suggesting they just don't know what they are doing?
It’s quite clear that they went wrong somewhere in their design for this years car. As happens sometimes in F1. Red Bull did in 2020 for example. But it didn’t mean they weren’t capable to problem solve, which is the same for Mercedes. Just because they have won 8 years in a row doesn’t mean they have had it easy. If anything, it proves their capability problem solve more than anything, since it has been far from as straight forward as you are suggesting.
It seems like Russell is getting up to speed and understanding the car better. Probably having driven those poor Williams cars is helping him understanding finding out ways to get around the car's lack of pace. This is new to Hamilton as he last drove such a poor car back in 2009. Given the circumstances, it may make more sense to take feedback from Russell to develop the car to move forward.
Really? They should value the feedback from a guy that was stuck in a backmarker for three years over a guy who has been leading a team that has won 8 consecutive championships. Wow yeah great idea.
It seems like Russell is getting up to speed and understanding the car better. Probably having driven those poor Williams cars is helping him understanding finding out ways to get around the car's lack of pace. This is new to Hamilton as he last drove such a poor car back in 2009. Given the circumstances, it may make more sense to take feedback from Russell to develop the car to move forward.
Lewis was faster than george all weekend untill they made a setup change between fp3 and quali.
Which was apparently further in the direction they went between fp2 and 3, which worked.
But the further change didnt work and made the car nervous.
Dont see how that has anything to do with george getting on top of the car better
(George) did perform better than Lewis, who struggled to get car set up correctly, so (George,) had a better setup thus got "on top" of the car better...
Plain and simple really. Why you are in denial is unclear?
Good day all. I not an engineer or anyone with technical knowledge. however I think Merc is being cautious with their engine. I think they have power but not running full beans until they get a better understanding of how new fuel and ICE behaves under race conditions. Also they want to know how the porpoising will affect power unit, tgearbox and other related components.
Or the fuel optimization isn’t where it needs to be. Petronas, what have you done?
Are McLaren, Aston Martin and Williams actually using Petronas fuel and lubricants as well?
I think Gulf is too small to be a credible F1 supplier and Armamco just entered F1 as a team team partner. Williams has no Petrol related sponsor as far as I know.
A few years ago they came out with a directive that all customer engines must use the same fuel as the main team so yeah they all use Petronas.
Wolff confirmed to Sky Germany: “We tried something on Lewis’ car that did not work. He had zero grip on the rear axle. Time to wake up for us.”
Hamilton added in an interview with Formula 1.com: “It was something in the set-up that was looking good in FP3. Tried to progress in a similar direction and maybe we went too far.
“The car was just undrivable – so nervous.”
Pretty clear that they made good changes for fp3.
So as you would you say 'lets try and a bit more of that and see if its better again'
In this instance it obviously wasnt.
Without goin to a certain place, you never learn if that place is good or not.
It seems like Russell is getting up to speed and understanding the car better. Probably having driven those poor Williams cars is helping him understanding finding out ways to get around the car's lack of pace. This is new to Hamilton as he last drove such a poor car back in 2009. Given the circumstances, it may make more sense to take feedback from Russell to develop the car to move forward.
Really? They should value the feedback from a guy that was stuck in a backmarker for three years over a guy who has been leading a team that has won 8 consecutive championships. Wow yeah great idea.
absolutely. A tramp knows more about surviving the streets than an accountant.
So are you suggesting they just don't know what they are doing?
It’s quite clear that they went wrong somewhere in their design for this years car. As happens sometimes in F1. Red Bull did in 2020 for example. But it didn’t mean they weren’t capable to problem solve, which is the same for Mercedes. Just because they have won 8 years in a row doesn’t mean they have had it easy. If anything, it proves their capability problem solve more than anything, since it has been far from as straight forward as you are suggesting.
it was a walk in the park.
2021 was the first time that they had a real challenge and Lewis lost out.
Yeah with the help of Masi, otherwise Lewis was 8 times WDC.'
Even with a real challenge they won both the championship (however they didn't know how to beat the FIA race director)
It seems like Russell is getting up to speed and understanding the car better. Probably having driven those poor Williams cars is helping him understanding finding out ways to get around the car's lack of pace. This is new to Hamilton as he last drove such a poor car back in 2009. Given the circumstances, it may make more sense to take feedback from Russell to develop the car to move forward.
Lewis was faster than george all weekend untill they made a setup change between fp3 and quali.
Which was apparently further in the direction they went between fp2 and 3, which worked.
But the further change didnt work and made the car nervous.
Dont see how that has anything to do with george getting on top of the car better
(George) did perform better than Lewis, who struggled to get car set up correctly, so (George,) had a better setup thus got "on top" of the car better...
Plain and simple really. Why you are in denial is unclear?
You can't convince us Lewis is rubbish OK.
I am surprised the Mods don't see your obvious goading.
Lewis was faster than george all weekend untill they made a setup change between fp3 and quali.
Which was apparently further in the direction they went between fp2 and 3, which worked.
But the further change didnt work and made the car nervous.
Dont see how that has anything to do with george getting on top of the car better
(George) did perform better than Lewis, who struggled to get car set up correctly, so (George,) had a better setup thus got "on top" of the car better...
Plain and simple really. Why you are in denial is unclear?
You can't convince us Lewis is rubbish OK.
I am surprised the Mods don't see your obvious goading.
I have reported this kind of trolling multiple times, but no action just closing the report and allowing this to continue.
So are you suggesting they just don't know what they are doing?
It’s quite clear that they went wrong somewhere in their design for this years car. As happens sometimes in F1. Red Bull did in 2020 for example. But it didn’t mean they weren’t capable to problem solve, which is the same for Mercedes. Just because they have won 8 years in a row doesn’t mean they have had it easy. If anything, it proves their capability problem solve more than anything, since it has been far from as straight forward as you are suggesting.
it was a walk in the park.
2021 was the first time that they had a real challenge and Lewis lost out.
No, it wasn’t. And even if it would have been, they weren’t given their winning cars for free, they built them. I would think that requires a fair bit of problem solving abilities. 2017 is a good example. 2019 as well. If anything, it would show other teams lack of problem solving abilities not being able to catch up.
Yeah they lost in 2021, and there are countless of threads on this forum dissecting the main reason for it. If you missed Abu Dhabi and the aftermath, start there. Secondly, RB had the better car for most of the season, until Mercedes did some problem solving to end up with the quickest car in the end.
But it seems from your posts that you are not really interested to have any sort of serious discussion about it all. You are mainly here to agitate people and spread toxicity.
So are you suggesting they just don't know what they are doing?
It’s quite clear that they went wrong somewhere in their design for this years car. As happens sometimes in F1. Red Bull did in 2020 for example. But it didn’t mean they weren’t capable to problem solve, which is the same for Mercedes. Just because they have won 8 years in a row doesn’t mean they have had it easy. If anything, it proves their capability problem solve more than anything, since it has been far from as straight forward as you are suggesting.
it was a walk in the park.
2021 was the first time that they had a real challenge and Lewis lost out.
Yeah lost out...right.
Had a better start on mediums, even Checo couldn't hold him back and Verstappen was schooled that day.
But of course, here you are, trying to "convince" us with your bs.
Go to your friends to the RB thread.
Lewis was faster than george all weekend untill they made a setup change between fp3 and quali.
Which was apparently further in the direction they went between fp2 and 3, which worked.
But the further change didnt work and made the car nervous.
Dont see how that has anything to do with george getting on top of the car better
(George) did perform better than Lewis, who struggled to get car set up correctly, so (George,) had a better setup thus got "on top" of the car better...
Plain and simple really. Why you are in denial is unclear?
You can't convince us Lewis is rubbish OK.
I am surprised the Mods don't see your obvious goading.
Generally speaking about Mercedes chassis troubles, I'm of the opinion that Mercedes have never been the top chassis builders. '14 to '16, there was no competition so they had it all easy. I've also read that they used to 'shelve' aero upgrades because they weren't even needed. '17 and '18, Ferrari came up with better chassis, and Mercedes ran with their 'downforce at all cost' philosophy, and their PU supported them. In the end, Ferrari shot themselves in the foot and Mercedes walked away with the titles.
'21 was the first real test for them, as they had to work around the rule change (I won't go into the 'fairness' of the rule change), and they came up short, with RedBull clearly coming up with the better car and were able to close the huge advantage that Mercedes enjoyed in '20.
Now with the new rules, they're struggling like never before, and its seems to be amplified by the lack of their PU advantage. For example, if you swap current PUs for Mercedes, Ferrari and RedBull with their respective '14 PUs, this same Mercedes car, porpoising or not, will run circles around RedBull and Ferrari.
Mercedes might fix their problems in the next 2 races and might be at the sharp end of the grid in no time, and I'll have to eat up my words, but I think it'll take them longer.
Now with the new rules, they're struggling like never before, and its seems to be amplified by the lack of their PU advantage. For example, if you swap current PUs for Mercedes, Ferrari and RedBull with their respective '14 PUs, this same Mercedes car, porpoising or not, will run circles around RedBull and Ferrari.
Could you post some data for this, or is it just assumptions?
What utter garbage.NicoS wrote: ↑26 Mar 2022, 22:18I think it means they had it so easy, never really had to work and put thought into getting the car to work better.AR3-GP wrote: ↑26 Mar 2022, 22:13
