2022 Alpine F1 Team

[DChemTech]

They lose in terms of reputation. Perhaps in terms of junior drivers thinking again before signing to them. And while drivers are a dime in a dozen, top drivers are not. Alpine is perhaps the only bigger outfit now that does not have a younger real talent lined up. Ferrari, MB, RB and McL are set in that respect, but I would not share Alpine/Ocon in that list. Piastri might have filled that gap (although that is something one can only judge after some time; plenty talents have dissapointed once they reached F1, perhaps Ocon included).

But yes, Piastri himself has more to lose. Which indicates he likely had a deal ready elsewhere. Or he is just so phenomenally pissed of by the situation that he'd rather gamble on a deal elsewhere, then take this opportunity given the way it was announced.

Other than that, we can onpy speculate for now. There may be another contract on the table. Certainly Alpine got wind of dealings with McL (as they stated they would not just let piastri go the afternoon before --- hit the fan); perhaps they thouhht this way they could force his hand (if so - very poor way). Perhaps it was just an overzealous social media worker preparing an announcement for later use, but accidentally posting it instead. Who knows...

[Big Tea]

They lose in terms of reputation. Perhaps in terms of junior drivers thinking again before signing to them. And while drivers are a dime in a dozen, top drivers are not. Alpine is perhaps the only bigger outfit now that does not have a younger real talent lined up. Ferrari, MB, RB and McL are set in that respect, but I would not share Alpine/Ocon in that list. Piastri might have filled that gap (although that is something one can only judge after some time; plenty talents have dissapointed once they reached F1, perhaps Ocon included).

But yes, Piastri himself has more to lose. Which indicates he likely had a deal ready elsewhere. Or he is just so phenomenally pissed of by the situation that he'd rather gamble on a deal elsewhere, then take this opportunity given the way it was announced.

Other than that, we can onpy speculate for now. There may be another contract on the table. Certainly Alpine got wind of dealings with McL (as they stated they would not just let piastri go the afternoon before --- hit the fan); perhaps they thouhht this way they could force his hand (if so - very poor way). Perhaps it was just an overzealous social media worker preparing an announcement for later use, but accidentally posting it instead. Who knows...

I wonder if this accounts for OP terse post?
I did not know he had askes to be released the day before, so he must have sought legal advice (possibly from Mclaren)
and been told he was a free agent, so figurately 'gave them the vic'. More understandable now.

[DChemTech]

They lose in terms of reputation. Perhaps in terms of junior drivers thinking again before signing to them. And while drivers are a dime in a dozen, top drivers are not. Alpine is perhaps the only bigger outfit now that does not have a younger real talent lined up. Ferrari, MB, RB and McL are set in that respect, but I would not share Alpine/Ocon in that list. Piastri might have filled that gap (although that is something one can only judge after some time; plenty talents have dissapointed once they reached F1, perhaps Ocon included).

But yes, Piastri himself has more to lose. Which indicates he likely had a deal ready elsewhere. Or he is just so phenomenally pissed of by the situation that he'd rather gamble on a deal elsewhere, then take this opportunity given the way it was announced.

Other than that, we can onpy speculate for now. There may be another contract on the table. Certainly Alpine got wind of dealings with McL (as they stated they would not just let piastri go the afternoon before --- hit the fan); perhaps they thouhht this way they could force his hand (if so - very poor way). Perhaps it was just an overzealous social media worker preparing an announcement for later use, but accidentally posting it instead. Who knows...

I wonder if this accounts for OP terse post?
I did not know he had askes to be released the day before, so he must have sought legal advice (possibly from Mclaren)
and been told he was a free agent, so figurately 'gave them the vic'. More understandable now.

Not sure if he asked to be released. According to motorsport.com (who can be sensationalist, certainly the dutch site), Otmar stressed that Alpine has invested much in Piastri and has a contract that binds him for 2023, and in some options 2024. This was said in response to paddock rumours about Piastri signing a deal with McL, but still rumours; it doesn't mention a concrete release-ask or definitive signing elsewhere., And Otmar also stated not to be aware of any deal between Oscar and McLaren

[Peter Ian Staker]

In retrospect signing Ocon to such a long deal was a mistake.
Wouldn't be trying to juggle Alonso and Piastri around if they didn't lock up Ocon for so long.

Ringo… mate… 31.07. is gone… what contract does Alpine have with Piastri?

Who knows?
I doubt Alpine would announce him if his contract categorically and beyond a shadow of a doubt stated that he was completely free to go post 31/7.

Why it was a mistake? Ocon is performing very well. So looking back on this decision from Alpine it was definitely not a mistake.

Ferrari has Leclerc.
Mercedes has Russel (not a race winner).
RedBull has Verstappen.
McLaren has Norris (not a race winner).
Alpine has Ocon (race winner).

Of course everybody would say that Ocon is not Norris/Russel/Leclerc Material. But I think if you put him in the same car with these guys he would not be that far away.

Don't get me wrong, he is a fine driver but if he was anything beyond that he would be at Mercedes right now instead of Russell.
It's insane to me that Alpine had an experienced high level driver in Alonso and a highly rated prospect in Piastri on it's plate and decided to lock up Ocon long term on one seat and concoct an insane succession plan for the other one.

[peewon]

In retrospect signing Ocon to such a long deal was a mistake.
Wouldn't be trying to juggle Alonso and Piastri around if they didn't lock up Ocon for so long.


Who knows?
I doubt Alpine would announce him if his contract categorically and beyond a shadow of a doubt stated that he was completely free to go post 31/7.

Why it was a mistake? Ocon is performing very well. So looking back on this decision from Alpine it was definitely not a mistake.

Ferrari has Leclerc.
Mercedes has Russel (not a race winner).
RedBull has Verstappen.
McLaren has Norris (not a race winner).
Alpine has Ocon (race winner).

Of course everybody would say that Ocon is not Norris/Russel/Leclerc Material. But I think if you put him in the same car with these guys he would not be that far away.

Don't get me wrong, he is a fine driver but if he was anything beyond that he would be at Mercedes right now instead of Russell.
It's insane to me that Alpine had an experienced high level driver in Alonso and a highly rated prospect in Piastri on it's plate and decided to lock up Ocon long term on one seat and concoct an insane succession plan for the other one.

Renault/Alpine is extremely political in nature with state ownership. They were rumored to be considering pulling out all together before Luca de Meo came onboard. Still theres some doubt as to whether their publicly stated commitment to winning in F1 is backed by financial support from the parent group. Giving Rossi the benefit of the doubt, we can chalk Ocon's contract down to the fact that he is French and its not a failure of talent evaluation. Why they went 3 years is less explainable.

[diffuser]

I just hope for Piastri isn’t being used by Alonso/Webber/Briatore in their possible feud with Rossi/Otmar or else this well could be a career that will never happen.

I doubt Alonso has anything to do with Piastri.

[JordanMugen]

It would be major incompetence if he is allowed to leave.

It would. Alpine should have confirmed Piastri as their race driver for 2023 months ago.

If they lose him, it's cause they should have written a better contract.

I don't mind if Alpine lose Piastri, it seem it is Alpine who mind!

[SmallSoldier]

People underestimate Ocon.
He performs. He doesnt crash or make mistakes. He runs the strategy and gets his points.

I hear you all on Piastris urge to get a seat. But how does he win if he does get a seat from Alpine now?
Okay he was waiting till 2025 or whatever. But its 2022 and he got a seat now. So why decline a seat?
It's the first time i have ever seen this. How does he win by declining a good seat?
And how does Alpine lose when as i say before drivers are a dime a dozen?
Even Shumacher can go to Alpine. So mant choices. Guanyu, Shumacher, Riciardo, Latifi, Gasly, Hulkenberg, Grosjean, Vandorne, and I am sure there are some really good young guys that i dont know.
Alpine doesnt lose anything. They just have a very high demand seat they can sell to the highest bidder.

He is saying No to Alpine because probably he already has a contracted signed with someone else… He signed that contract before he knew that there was going to be an open seat at the team in 2023 (in reality, not even Alpine thought they were going to have an available seat until a couple days ago).

How does Alpine lose? From a having driver perspective, they don’t lose anything… But if Piastri is as good as the hype behind him, he could be the next Max, Lewis, Charles (insert great driver and future champion here)… And Alpine will keep themselves if they lost the opportunity to have a generational talent in their team… That’s the actual loss.

[diffuser]

In retrospect signing Ocon to such a long deal was a mistake.
Wouldn't be trying to juggle Alonso and Piastri around if they didn't lock up Ocon for so long.


Who knows?
I doubt Alpine would announce him if his contract categorically and beyond a shadow of a doubt stated that he was completely free to go post 31/7.

Why it was a mistake? Ocon is performing very well. So looking back on this decision from Alpine it was definitely not a mistake.

Ferrari has Leclerc.
Mercedes has Russel (not a race winner).
RedBull has Verstappen.
McLaren has Norris (not a race winner).
Alpine has Ocon (race winner).

Of course everybody would say that Ocon is not Norris/Russel/Leclerc Material. But I think if you put him in the same car with these guys he would not be that far away.

Don't get me wrong, he is a fine driver but if he was anything beyond that he would be at Mercedes right now instead of Russell.
It's insane to me that Alpine had an experienced high level driver in Alonso and a highly rated prospect in Piastri on it's plate and decided to lock up Ocon long term on one seat and concoct an insane succession plan for the other one.

He has been with Alpine cause they found him and signed him first, not cause he's no good. He is a unknown quantity with very high abilities and aspirations. Only time will tell how good he is. Diamond in the rough if you will. Sometimes diamonds are flawed. You only find out when you cut it.

[ringo]

People underestimate Ocon.
He performs. He doesnt crash or make mistakes. He runs the strategy and gets his points.

I hear you all on Piastris urge to get a seat. But how does he win if he does get a seat from Alpine now?
Okay he was waiting till 2025 or whatever. But its 2022 and he got a seat now. So why decline a seat?
It's the first time i have ever seen this. How does he win by declining a good seat?
And how does Alpine lose when as i say before drivers are a dime a dozen?
Even Shumacher can go to Alpine. So mant choices. Guanyu, Shumacher, Riciardo, Latifi, Gasly, Hulkenberg, Grosjean, Vandorne, and I am sure there are some really good young guys that i dont know.
Alpine doesnt lose anything. They just have a very high demand seat they can sell to the highest bidder.

He is saying No to Alpine because probably he already has a contracted signed with someone else… He signed that contract before he knew that there was going to be an open seat at the team in 2023 (in reality, not even Alpine thought they were going to have an available seat until a couple days ago).

How does Alpine lose? From a having driver perspective, they don’t lose anything… But if Piastri is as good as the hype behind him, he could be the next Max, Lewis, Charles (insert great driver and future champion here)… And Alpine will keep themselves if they lost the opportunity to have a generational talent in their team… That’s the actual loss.

They dont lose. He is not as good as Alonso and can only do what the car is capable of.
And of he was the next driving god, he would only drive for alpine before getting snatched by a top team within a year.

[DChemTech]

People underestimate Ocon.
He performs. He doesnt crash or make mistakes. He runs the strategy and gets his points.

I hear you all on Piastris urge to get a seat. But how does he win if he does get a seat from Alpine now?
Okay he was waiting till 2025 or whatever. But its 2022 and he got a seat now. So why decline a seat?
It's the first time i have ever seen this. How does he win by declining a good seat?
And how does Alpine lose when as i say before drivers are a dime a dozen?
Even Shumacher can go to Alpine. So mant choices. Guanyu, Shumacher, Riciardo, Latifi, Gasly, Hulkenberg, Grosjean, Vandorne, and I am sure there are some really good young guys that i dont know.
Alpine doesnt lose anything. They just have a very high demand seat they can sell to the highest bidder.

He is saying No to Alpine because probably he already has a contracted signed with someone else… He signed that contract before he knew that there was going to be an open seat at the team in 2023 (in reality, not even Alpine thought they were going to have an available seat until a couple days ago).

How does Alpine lose? From a having driver perspective, they don’t lose anything… But if Piastri is as good as the hype behind him, he could be the next Max, Lewis, Charles (insert great driver and future champion here)… And Alpine will keep themselves if they lost the opportunity to have a generational talent in their team… That’s the actual loss.

They dont lose. He is not as good as Alonso and can only do what the car is capable of.
And of he was the next driving god, he would only drive for alpine before getting snatched by a top team within a year.

As I said above in response to your post (but forgot to quote you, sorry), we can only tell after some time how good he is in F1. There have been drivers before that got in as big talents that did dissapoint. Fact is, he was in the Alpine talent pool, probably for a reason, they invested substantially in him to get and keep him there, and in contrast to other larger teams they do not yet have a big talent on board. Although no guarantee, this could have been their chance to get one. So yes, they lose out.

[Jolle]

He is saying No to Alpine because probably he already has a contracted signed with someone else… He signed that contract before he knew that there was going to be an open seat at the team in 2023 (in reality, not even Alpine thought they were going to have an available seat until a couple days ago).

How does Alpine lose? From a having driver perspective, they don’t lose anything… But if Piastri is as good as the hype behind him, he could be the next Max, Lewis, Charles (insert great driver and future champion here)… And Alpine will keep themselves if they lost the opportunity to have a generational talent in their team… That’s the actual loss.

They dont lose. He is not as good as Alonso and can only do what the car is capable of.
And of he was the next driving god, he would only drive for alpine before getting snatched by a top team within a year.

As I said above in response to your post (but forgot to quote you, sorry), we can only tell after some time how good he is in F1. There have been drivers before that got in as big talents that did dissapoint. Fact is, he was in the Alpine talent pool, probably for a reason, they invested substantially in him to get and keep him there, and in contrast to other larger teams they do not yet have a big talent on board. Although no guarantee, this could have been their chance to get one. So yes, they lose out.

There is a funny thing going on on the grid at the moment. Young driver programs seem to be not what they expect to be and there isn’t a well anymore of talent drivers lining up challenging the drivers in the big teams. Mercedes is the only team that has two drivers out of their own program (and so far only had drivers that were linked already to the brand from an early age). RedBull had to revert to an old Ferrari junior, Ferrari and McLaren to a RedBull protégées and Renault to a discarded Mercedes talent. Ferrari, Mercedes, McLaren and RedBull are “safe” with their talent for the next 5-ish years at least, Renault isn’t and Piastri would fit that bill. At least he had the junior career that would put him on that path.

[bucker]

I think that problem today started with Max. He is exceptional driver, with 15 yrs old was already in the car. In the second season he was in top team winning a race. Kids today they just don't want to wait. They want to be out of school, directly to F1 and top team.
Alpine suppported Piastri his whole career and because of that he won lower championships and has a potential now to become F1 driver. It is also a bit rude of him to not give something back for example at least one season as their driver, especially because Alpine has now trouble finding a good driver for next season.

[F1since1980]

Why it was a mistake? Ocon is performing very well. So looking back on this decision from Alpine it was definitely not a mistake.

Ferrari has Leclerc.
Mercedes has Russel (not a race winner).
RedBull has Verstappen.
McLaren has Norris (not a race winner).
Alpine has Ocon (race winner).

Of course everybody would say that Ocon is not Norris/Russel/Leclerc Material. But I think if you put him in the same car with these guys he would not be that far away.

Don't get me wrong, he is a fine driver but if he was anything beyond that he would be at Mercedes right now instead of Russell.
It's insane to me that Alpine had an experienced high level driver in Alonso and a highly rated prospect in Piastri on it's plate and decided to lock up Ocon long term on one seat and concoct an insane succession plan for the other one.

Renault/Alpine is extremely political in nature with state ownership. They were rumored to be considering pulling out all together before Luca de Meo came onboard. Still theres some doubt as to whether their publicly stated commitment to winning in F1 is backed by financial support from the parent group. Giving Rossi the benefit of the doubt, we can chalk Ocon's contract down to the fact that he is French and its not a failure of talent evaluation. Why they went 3 years is less explainable.

This video was probably already posted but I thought I would share - Rossi makes some good points about Ocon - not a flashy - showman driver but gets the points in the end and that's what is expected from him... I think we cane all agree that he has been doing just that. To me he needs to improve his qualifying speed.

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/vide ... 36038.html

Giving Alonso a 1 year + 1 year option (and possibly another based upon performance) was probably the right approach from an overall TEAM FIRST view. That makes sense to me given his age. That is what I would have done as a team principle/CEO as well, but I would have pressed him on signing it or rejecting it before a specific date. My view is that no 41 year old driver no matter who he is, is above the Team - you can't build a long term project when father time is not on your side. I loved Alonso as a driver and the history this team has with him, but you can't let your emotions cloud your judgement.
Obviously, Alonso was put off by this and you can understand his point of view of wanting to stay in F1 for at least another 3 years and he had every right to get that from another team who was willing to give it to him - plus Stroll needed another headline- just like Renault needed one when Danny left... But the way it unfolded and was played out in the media was unfair to the Alpine and the Alpine team family that supported Alonso throughout his career (2WC). Not cool!!!

Given the various business venters Alonso has outside of F1 - maybe he should have tried to buy a stake in Alpine and tie up the relationship long term and maybe Renault would have been open to that. Toto was been quite successful at getting Willams and Mercedes F1 team ownership... Alonso is pretty much a global brand in itself and from a long term marketing point of view, it would have been a dream for all involved - not to mention if Renault exits - what a payday for Alonso! But can you drive and also be an owner? Jaques Villeneuve was in BAR... Who knows, Stroll is a really sharp businessman and maybe that is on the cards over at AM.

Oscar's issue in my opinion will be dealt with legally and I cannot imagine that Alpine does not get some serious monetary compensation for all the investment they put into this kid over the years - otherwise the kid got a free ride on Alpine's dime and Mclaren (?) is laughing all the way to bank on this one - which I can't see happening. This is still a sports "business" and in business it's not a charity! I would not be surprised if Alpine sues Mark Webber and Oscar and company for breach of contract and acting in bad faith and seek some serious monetary judgement to recoup its expenses over the years. This is not a case of a driver deciding to not go to a team he just signed with and instead jump ship at the last minute and join a rival, there has been some significant investment and expense here. In the end the lawyers get richer...

It seems it's been a challenging year for French Australian relationships... first the huge submarine contract debacle and now this, it makes for good media...

[Enstone]

Ok so what are the options for 2023 ?

Gasly or Ricciardo ?
Piastri who's gonna be legally obliged to assume is contract ?