2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[chrisc90]

Yeah that what I also watched on F1 TV! Why I think Russell would have been able to defend from Max though?

Well slipstream! At least for the restart Russell could have used Hamilton’s slipstream to at least keep Max behind him for the first lap! Hamilton had no one in front of him to gain a slipstream so that’s why Max got him half way down the straight.

Anyway, i think the great opportunity would have been to pit Hamilton for softs and get him out back into P1 ahead of Russell…then use Russell as a buffer for a few laps!

I guess thats the key question. How long would Russell of been able to hold Max off?

Charles(or sainz?) had one attempt into T1 on the restart then he seemed to drop off quite a bit.

Ultimately, I think one of the Merc drivers should have gone to Softs, at the decision of the team, Im not sure why they didnt tell Russell to build a gap and attempt to get Lewis out infront of Max. (same as Bottas did in 2021 jeddah where he dropped way more back than 10 lengths to double stack the cars) Which im sure there would have been enough time. That way Russell stays out and covers Lewis on the slower tyre and try not to let Max past. Instead the team strategy opted to keep both cars out on the slower tyre, just like we have seen in other races where they want to favour track position. It does make you question why everyone bar Perez and Hamilton opted to switch to the soft tyre. Clearly that was the best tyre to have in the final 10 laps or so of racing.

[mendis]

Yeah that what I also watched on F1 TV! Why I think Russell would have been able to defend from Max though?

Well slipstream! At least for the restart Russell could have used Hamilton’s slipstream to at least keep Max behind him for the first lap! Hamilton had no one in front of him to gain a slipstream so that’s why Max got him half way down the straight.

Anyway, i think the great opportunity would have been to pit Hamilton for softs and get him out back into P1 ahead of Russell…then use Russell as a buffer for a few laps!

I guess thats the key question. How long would Russell of been able to hold Max off?

Charles(or sainz?) had one attempt into T1 on the restart then he seemed to drop off quite a bit.

Ultimately, I think one of the Merc drivers should have gone to Softs, at the decision of the team, Im not sure why they didnt tell Russell to build a gap and attempt to get Lewis out infront of Max. (same as Bottas did in 2021 jeddah where he dropped way more back than 10 lengths to double stack the cars) Which im sure there would have been enough time. That way Russell stays out and covers Lewis on the slower tyre and try not to let Max past. Instead the team strategy opted to keep both cars out on the slower tyre, just like we have seen in other races where they want to favour track position. It does make you question why everyone bar Perez and Hamilton opted to switch to the soft tyre. Clearly that was the best tyre to have in the final 10 laps or so of racing.

In the hindsight there were a lot of ways to look at leaving George behind Lewis to cover Max. It was in the moment though when brains fade under pressure. Regardless of how it is tried to be played, on the basis of performance data, it's very clear that it was a matter of time that Max would have cleared both of them and they would have also lost the position to Charles. Regarding the slipstreaming, this year's cars are prone to have very little advantage from slipstreaming.

[ringo]

We also have to factor that George had the benefit of seeing what everyone else was doing before opting for softs. Lewis did not have that benefit, he just did what the team had planned. And being at the front you dont have time to react and second guess the team. You just have to trust their decision. Russel was able to second guess after the fact. It was more like him being opportunistic because he saw the cards everyone else played. Sorta like playing rock paper sciccors where you move after everyone else has.

I do think George is the finished article however. He is very good and i think his time at williams made him as prepared as ever to step into the mercedes car and perform. I dont see him getting much better than he is now, and in fact i think he would be a better challenger to Max than Leclerc is. George can defend well and takes his chances and is consistent.
If Lewis leaves mercedes is in good hands.
I am hoping the mercedes is at least within 2 tenths of RB19 next year, as Hamilton should be able to beat Max on the track as he did before in 2021. I really think he is only one who can make Max lose his cool and get desperate.

[Just_a_fan]

I guess thats the key question. How long would Russell of been able to hold Max off?

"Russell have been".

[chrisc90]

We also have to factor that George had the benefit of seeing what everyone else was doing before opting for softs. Lewis did not have that benefit, he just did what the team had planned. And being at the front you dont have time to react and second guess the team. You just have to trust their decision. Russel was able to second guess after the fact. It was more like him being opportunistic because he saw the cards everyone else played. Sorta like playing rock paper sciccors where you move after everyone else has.

I do think George is the finished article however. He is very good and i think his time at williams made him as prepared as ever to step into the mercedes car and perform. I dont see him getting much better than he is now, and in fact i think he would be a better challenger to Max than Leclerc is. George can defend well and takes his chances and is consistent.
If Lewis leaves mercedes is in good hands.
I am hoping the mercedes is at least within 2 tenths of RB19 next year, as Hamilton should be able to beat Max on the track as he did before in 2021. I really think he is only one who can make Max lose his cool and get desperate.

Still, the team should have looked and seen the window they could have pitted Lewis, if that was their aim to protect him for the win at the start of the day.

The RB19 vs the W14......such a big question from that point. Mercedes have a LOT to catch up on, still even to this year, and I think its unlikely they will ever get close to the pace the RB has this season. Of course, there is revised floors for next year (which I personally think is a bit premature given the TD039 and the ride height tweaks if there is big oscillations. I feel teams should have had some time to adapt to the TD039 like we have seen in the last 3 races. Has there been a problem since the directive was issued....nope. Hence why I feel making changes to floors to go hand in hand with that directive is a bit soon - different topic though)
With that, and a revised floor, there is the question of who is going to 'lose out' or 'benefit' the most from that rule change. One would think that it would be those teams who run their car/floor closest to the floor - so that could be a burden for the W14 as we know Mercedes have managed to run their floor edge pretty close to the floor once they have sorted the porpoising out.

2tenths is still quite a bit to overcome, but as we have seen the odd time this year - the W13 has the pace to match the lap times of the leaders.

I dont think Max or Lewis will ever see eye to eye on the track - of course there is the mutual respect - but you just have to look at some of the media interviews to see that that respect stops as soon as they are not racing. Probably more the 'problem' lies with Lewis as there has been a couple interviews where he has been asked about Max and hasnt really given a answer (the questions to the drivers what they thought of Max is a prime example there). Whether Max/Lewis would typically be bothered by each other in seasons to come is another question and would probably depend on how the title was looking points wise - as it has been said Lewis is a bit cagey when his back is against the wall. I think there would be some awesome racing if those two ever had similar cars between them - and hopefully it would be clean racing - like we have seen this year when Max has battled closely with rivals.

George is still missing that little bit of sparkle if you ask me from what i've seen this season - the diamonds are there and set - the sun isnt out to make them sparkle like they should yet. We've seen some careless lunges from him which were optimistic on the best of days and race wise he's just trundled along doing his thing. I dont think i've seen any 'brilliance' from him yet on race day - aside from the tyre call for softs which I thought was good race awareness.

[CHT]

Yeah that what I also watched on F1 TV! Why I think Russell would have been able to defend from Max though?

Well slipstream! At least for the restart Russell could have used Hamilton’s slipstream to at least keep Max behind him for the first lap! Hamilton had no one in front of him to gain a slipstream so that’s why Max got him half way down the straight.

Anyway, i think the great opportunity would have been to pit Hamilton for softs and get him out back into P1 ahead of Russell…then use Russell as a buffer for a few laps!

I guess thats the key question. How long would Russell of been able to hold Max off?

Charles(or sainz?) had one attempt into T1 on the restart then he seemed to drop off quite a bit.

Ultimately, I think one of the Merc drivers should have gone to Softs, at the decision of the team, Im not sure why they didnt tell Russell to build a gap and attempt to get Lewis out infront of Max. (same as Bottas did in 2021 jeddah where he dropped way more back than 10 lengths to double stack the cars) Which im sure there would have been enough time. That way Russell stays out and covers Lewis on the slower tyre and try not to let Max past. Instead the team strategy opted to keep both cars out on the slower tyre, just like we have seen in other races where they want to favour track position. It does make you question why everyone bar Perez and Hamilton opted to switch to the soft tyre. Clearly that was the best tyre to have in the final 10 laps or so of racing.

I find it rather perplexing for people to say that if GR didn't pit, LH may have won the race.

Facts: LH lost 3 places from P1 to P4 for not pitting.
Fan Expectation: GR with the same tyre is to keep that 2nd place and finish the race with the Merc 1-2

Perhaps GR is a better driver now?

[mendis]

I guess thats the key question. How long would Russell of been able to hold Max off?

"Russell have been".

Are the classes free?

[wickedz50]

We also have to factor that George had the benefit of seeing what everyone else was doing before opting for softs. Lewis did not have that benefit, he just did what the team had planned. And being at the front you dont have time to react and second guess the team. You just have to trust their decision. Russel was able to second guess after the fact. It was more like him being opportunistic because he saw the cards everyone else played. Sorta like playing rock paper sciccors where you move after everyone else has.

I do think George is the finished article however. He is very good and i think his time at williams made him as prepared as ever to step into the mercedes car and perform. I dont see him getting much better than he is now, and in fact i think he would be a better challenger to Max than Leclerc is. George can defend well and takes his chances and is consistent.
If Lewis leaves mercedes is in good hands.
I am hoping the mercedes is at least within 2 tenths of RB19 next year, as Hamilton should be able to beat Max on the track as he did before in 2021. I really think he is only one who can make Max lose his cool and get desperate.

Last year the RB was most of the time within 2 tenths of the Merc. We all saw how that played out with Lewis losing the title. The Merc within 2 tenths of the RB is not going to cut it.

lol seriously? If it wasn't for Masi Lewis would have won. To end the year Lewis basically went on a 4 race winning streak in which Max and RBR had no answer for, even with the repeated resorting to dirty driving. Only Masi"s actions in AD helped Max secure the title.
Lewis vs Max part deux is likely coming next year. Ferrari showed they can't do it. They can't even support the right driver properly. Merc with Russell and Hamilton will be 10 times harder for Max to overcome.

(Lewis vs Max part deux is likely coming next year)- Agree that Merc is the only team to challenge RBR in areas of team strategy and execution. However the big area is the car chasis and the aero department where RBR have nailed it will be very difficult. For the engine it will be most likely be neutral.
Will Merc team come out and tell the fans what they got wrong in 2022 with the car chasis and aero? Are they now working in the right direction to have a challenging car for 2023?
F1 fans will definalety want a down to the wire championship like 2021.
I still smell some political stuff behind the curtains. There is something not right with the way the FIA is going and doing things.

[Just_a_fan]

I guess thats the key question. How long would Russell of been able to hold Max off?

"Russell have been".

Are the classes free?

Free at the point of use, yes.

[basti313]

Last year the RB was most of the time within 2 tenths of the Merc. We all saw how that played out with Lewis losing the title. The Merc within 2 tenths of the RB is not going to cut it.

lol seriously? If it wasn't for Masi Lewis would have won. To end the year Lewis basically went on a 4 race winning streak in which Max and RBR had no answer for, even with the repeated resorting to dirty driving. Only Masi"s actions in AD helped Max secure the title.
Lewis vs Max part deux is likely coming next year. Ferrari showed they can't do it. They can't even support the right driver properly. Merc with Russell and Hamilton will be 10 times harder for Max to overcome.

(Lewis vs Max part deux is likely coming next year)- Agree that Merc is the only team to challenge RBR in areas of team strategy and execution. However the big area is the car chasis and the aero department where RBR have nailed it will be very difficult. For the engine it will be most likely be neutral.
Will Merc team come out and tell the fans what they got wrong in 2022 with the car chasis and aero? Are they now working in the right direction to have a challenging car for 2023?
F1 fans will definalety want a down to the wire championship like 2021.
I still smell some political stuff behind the curtains. There is something not right with the way the FIA is going and doing things.

I can not see this yet. In a budget free time they could have outdeveloped everyone else with money. Now, I can not see how you can simply turn over a wrong concept to a winning concept. They are now competing with Ferrari because of the bad in season development that is normal at Ferrari. But beginning of next season, they either get their concept working or they are again far behind Ferrari.

For strategy:
The current issue is that they do not really get the track position stuff right. RedBull realized this. From the point of believing in track position, Merc is currently as bad as Ferrari. I can not see how the strategy teams of both are fit to fight...

[ringo]

We also have to factor that George had the benefit of seeing what everyone else was doing before opting for softs. Lewis did not have that benefit, he just did what the team had planned. And being at the front you dont have time to react and second guess the team. You just have to trust their decision. Russel was able to second guess after the fact. It was more like him being opportunistic because he saw the cards everyone else played. Sorta like playing rock paper sciccors where you move after everyone else has.

I do think George is the finished article however. He is very good and i think his time at williams made him as prepared as ever to step into the mercedes car and perform. I dont see him getting much better than he is now, and in fact i think he would be a better challenger to Max than Leclerc is. George can defend well and takes his chances and is consistent.
If Lewis leaves mercedes is in good hands.
I am hoping the mercedes is at least within 2 tenths of RB19 next year, as Hamilton should be able to beat Max on the track as he did before in 2021. I really think he is only one who can make Max lose his cool and get desperate.

Last year the RB was most of the time within 2 tenths of the Merc. We all saw how that played out with Lewis losing the title. The Merc within 2 tenths of the RB is not going to cut it.

The rb16b was as is the rb18 this year only that its more obvious with the 18. It was the better race car than the w12. I wont argue that with posters in this thread. But it was the most consistent race car and had better charscteristics. There really was no deficit last year. In the same way i noticed this year's car as the better race car than the ferrari from the get go, it only took time for the difference in quality to be obvious. RB cars have a very wide operating window and they are also excellent on traction, braking and overall balance.
I think LH and Bottas had to contend with balance and tyre temps more last year. ie the w12 had more imperfections despite its straight line speed. Im fully in agreement with Newey and Marko on the rb16b being the better race car last year.
Why i say 2 tenths is to recognize mb issue with tyre warmup. That gap could dissappear in race with LH tyre saving abilities or general setup by the team. Or the gap doesnt dissapear, but its close enough for good racing and entertainment.

[GCXX]

I think the RB16b was the better racecar until Mercedes brought the Silverstone Upgrade.

[ringo]

Last year the RB was most of the time within 2 tenths of the Merc. We all saw how that played out with Lewis losing the title. The Merc within 2 tenths of the RB is not going to cut it.

lol seriously? If it wasn't for Masi Lewis would have won. To end the year Lewis basically went on a 4 race winning streak in which Max and RBR had no answer for, even with the repeated resorting to dirty driving. Only Masi"s actions in AD helped Max secure the title.
Lewis vs Max part deux is likely coming next year. Ferrari showed they can't do it. They can't even support the right driver properly. Merc with Russell and Hamilton will be 10 times harder for Max to overcome.

(Lewis vs Max part deux is likely coming next year)- Agree that Merc is the only team to challenge RBR in areas of team strategy and execution. However the big area is the car chasis and the aero department where RBR have nailed it will be very difficult. For the engine it will be most likely be neutral.
Will Merc team come out and tell the fans what they got wrong in 2022 with the car chasis and aero? Are they now working in the right direction to have a challenging car for 2023?
F1 fans will definalety want a down to the wire championship like 2021.
I still smell some political stuff behind the curtains. There is something not right with the way the FIA is going and doing things.

If merc challenge redbull the engines wont be equal. Both will push the engines to the limit and the honda may just win out in the long run. The mercedes PU seem fine now in 2022 but i think thats because it is not being pushed hard enough. The Honda unit may have the advantage in reliability next year.

[PlatinumZealot]

Merecedes should turn up the engines for the last races. I still believe in that win!

[saviour stivala]

Hope never dies when pushed by a feeling of desire.