Mercedes Power Unit Hardware & Software

[AR3-GP]

Very naive question from someone with zero engine knowledge- can performance gains of any real significance come from the fluids aside from fuel and engine oil?

Improving the friction modifying and thermal conductance properties of a gearbox oil can reduce friction in the gearbox and/or allow a smaller, lighter gearbox cooler, which also has less air resistance.

Improved coolant can allow higher operating temperature and smaller radiator. This has several positive knock-on effects for performance. Higher operating temperature allows for a smaller water cooler which weighs less, and has less air resistance. Higher operating temperature seems to make the combustion cycle more efficient as well. Something to do with the energy that is lost due to the temp difference between the working gases, and the engine block.

In years past, it was claimed that some were experimenting with burning coolant for combustion....but that's for another thread

Do you think that’s what they are referring to when articles say that mercedes will have better fuel ,and they also say work has been done to the gearbox for W14

I think the "new fuel" rumor that was reported was nonsense. Fuel is frozen.

The work on the gearbox is likely moreso related to the location of the gearbox, attachment points of the control arms, and the rear suspension mechanisms and geometry. Not the oil.

Furthermore, while I expressed that in theory coolants and gearbox oils can offer a development playground, realistically the current specifications of coolants and gearbox oils are highly developed and there is very little if not anything left to optimize in these lubricants. I don't expect appreciable gains from one season to the next at this late stage.

That's quite unlike a brand new fuel which would like see big improvement if teams were granted another homologation date. However they are not. It's frozen.

[Mansell89]

Yeah, I think both fuel and engine oil is frozen but all other fluids can be developed iirc.

Very naive question from someone with zero engine knowledge- can performance gains of any real significance come from the fluids aside from fuel and engine oil?

Improving the friction modifying and thermal conductance properties of a gearbox oil can reduce friction in the gearbox and/or allow a smaller, lighter gearbox cooler, which also has less air resistance.

Improved coolant can allow higher operating temperature and smaller radiator. This has several positive knock-on effects for performance. Higher operating temperature allows for a smaller water cooler which weighs less, and has less air resistance. Higher operating temperature seems to make the combustion cycle more efficient as well. Something to do with the energy that is lost due to the temp difference between the working gases, and the engine block.

In years past, it was claimed that some were experimenting with burning coolant for combustion....but that's for another thread

Thank you!

[Venturiation]

When i hear all these rumours about engine upgrades

Is it possible that most teams homologated a more powerful engine and they are running it now in lower power before using the reliability upgrades?

[AR3-GP]

When i hear all these rumours about engine upgrades

Is it possible that most teams homologated a more powerful engine and they are running it now in lower power before using the reliability upgrades?

a "more powerful engine" only exist in theory. The engine has to be used for 7GPs plus some practice and qualy sessions.

[toraabe]

So.. What does this mean then? https://formula1news.co.uk/lewis-hamilt ... ower-unit/

[AR3-GP]

So.. What does this mean then? https://formula1news.co.uk/lewis-hamilt ... ower-unit/

It's difficult to know what it means. Mercedes can't break the rules, so if they've managed to change their fuel composition then the other manufacturers will have agreed to it.

Anyway, the source which is quoted in the article, "racingnews365", does not have any article on their website from which to attribute. So I don't know where it has come from. It would not be the first time that we see sloppy or false journalism.

[saviour stivala]

Where it came from:- Author Paolo Filisetti. Go-Author Luke Murphy. Article on rnews 365 com. The article and so the three involved are grossly misleading their readers/followers. They, the three combined are a total disgrace to formula one followers.

[saviour stivala]

The 6 Jan RN365 report/article re the intended for 2023 Mercedes F1 car. The part where the 'Engine developments' are concerned, have been 'intended' written journalistic misinformation/deception. This is so as all that has been pushed-out was Mercedes/Petronas engine combustion developments on the new for 2022 fuel formulation which was homologated and so frozen as of 1st March 2022, The article dishonestly gives the impression that this combustion development have been for the 2023 season. (The authors Quoting Hywel Thomas:- 'a massive efforts has been made to optimize combustion in collaboration with Petronas, also improving consumption efficiency, thanks to the new fuel formulation'). According to finer technical points from Thomas, they concentrated on running/pushing the engine harder on the new homologated fuel configuration knowing that although the new fuel calorific value was lower, the knock resistant was higher. The first of the two homologation freeze was 1st March 2022, the freeze included the ICE, TURBO, MGU-H, EXHAUST SYSTEM, THE FUEL SPECIFICATION AS WELL AS THE OIL SPECIFICATION.

[AR3-GP]

The 6 Jan RN365 report/article re the intended for 2023 Mercedes F1 car. The part where the 'Engine developments' are concerned, have been 'intended' written journalistic misinformation/deception. This is so as all that has been pushed-out was Mercedes/Petronas engine combustion developments on the new for 2022 fuel formulation which was homologated and so frozen as of 1st March 2022, The article dishonestly gives the impression that this combustion development have been for the 2023 season. (The authors Quoting Hywel Thomas:- 'a massive efforts has been made to optimize combustion in collaboration with Petronas, also improving consumption efficiency, thanks to the new fuel formulation'). According to finer technical points from Thomas, they concentrated on running/pushing the engine harder on the new homologated fuel configuration knowing that although the new fuel calorific value was lower, the knock resistant was higher. The first of the two homologation freeze was 1st March 2022, the freeze included the ICE, TURBO, MGU-H, EXHAUST SYSTEM, THE FUEL SPECIFICATION AS WELL AS THE OIL SPECIFICATION.

This is what I recall as well at the time. There was an article posted there which has explained the significance of the in-season development at Brixworth before the March and Sep homologation deadlines.

A few journalist mangled this and it started getting parroted here as upgrades for 2023. Not sure what the motive is or if it's just incompetence from people who really should know better

We even had someone post here that Mercedes was going to use a new ERS-K this year because they didn't run it last year . That engine knock was causing porpoising.

The spread of unphysical misinformation is inappropriate. This is supposed to be a technical forum.

[saviour stivala]

''Not sure what the motive is or if it's just incompetence from people who really should know better". In my opinion it's best described as 'weaponized incompetence'. "A few journalist mangled this and it started getting parroted here as upgrades for 2023''. It got parroted here not from the original rn365 article 6 Jan but from the carry over of 17 Jan by Nick Golding of the by now acknowledged number one trash bin of formula one sites heading:- ''Lewis Hamilton handed major boost with 2023 power unit".

[Venturiation]

#Gazzetta MERCEDES: Mercedes's work would focus on reducing internal mechanical friction, with non-invasive machining on the crankshaft bearings, crankshaft & connecting rods. A new lubricant formulation by Petronas would improve combustion efficiency. The gain is around 16hp.


What is this ? Just reliability upgrade?
This is the same source that predicted perfectly the W13 spec b and the windtunnel info

[LM10]

#Gazzetta MERCEDES: Mercedes's work would focus on reducing internal mechanical friction, with non-invasive machining on the crankshaft bearings, crankshaft & connecting rods. A new lubricant formulation by Petronas would improve combustion efficiency. The gain is around 16hp.


What is this ? Just reliability upgrade?
This is the same source that predicted perfectly the W13 spec b and the windtunnel info

Work on the PU itself could be for reliability reasons, but no way are they allowed to change lubricant formulation, it’s homologated.

[saviour stivala]

The power unit had actually nine major parts that have been frozen from 2022. These nine parts are ICE, TURBO, H, K, ES, CE, EXHAUST SYSSTEM, FUEL AND ENGINE OIL. An interesting item which apparently will be frozen from this year, if I understand correctly is, and of which I couldn't find anything on, is SOFTWARE. Bruno Famin/Mat Harman of Alpine were saying that only one software iteration per season will be allowed.

[Venturiation]

#Gazzetta MERCEDES: Mercedes's work would focus on reducing internal mechanical friction, with non-invasive machining on the crankshaft bearings, crankshaft & connecting rods. A new lubricant formulation by Petronas would improve combustion efficiency. The gain is around 16hp.


What is this ? Just reliability upgrade?
This is the same source that predicted perfectly the W13 spec b and the windtunnel info

Work on the PU itself could be for reliability reasons, but no way are they allowed to change lubricant formulation, it’s homologated.

Even for reliability ? Let’s say they find that the fuel damages some parts of the engine, would they be allowed to make the parts more resistant or the fuel less damaging

[saviour stivala]

It has been reported that the four power unit manufacturers between them have requested more than seventy reliability upgrades during 2022 power unit freeze.