2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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mwillems
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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SmallSoldier wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 08:49
I wanted to do an analysis of how much impact the new upgrades have influenced McLaren’s performance this weekend, but last year’s qualifying session was very wet and the times / telemetry of that session wouldn’t allow us to make a fair comparison year on year… Nevertheless, we may have a few pieces of data that could help.

A couple of comments first:
- The biggest takeaway from qualifying for me was the parity between both drivers, something sorely missed last season… The fact that Piastri was so close to Lando’s time is not only very positive for the team in terms of result, but it also should boost Oscar’s confidence on himself, as well as the team’s confidence on him.
- For year against year comparison, we would have to use FP2, which is the most representative session (both run in the dry), of course engine modes, fuel loads and the fact that we have also a different tire construction this year will have an effect in the results.

FP2 - 2022 (white) vs FP2 - 2023 (orange):

https://i.imgur.com/RhlsrmP.jpg

Not what I would have expected in some aspects, starting with the lap times… The McLaren was faster in 2022 FP2 compared to 2023 FP2, looking at where that time is made/lost would indicate that Lando was pushing a bit harder during FP2 of last year compared to this one (let’s keep in mind that they were doing several correlation tests during FP2 this weekend)… Most of the time lost vs previous year is in turns 1 and 2 (which are flat out) and in the final corner.

But we can see from the telemetry that there is a clear reduction in drag (run from T4 to T5 - Wellington Straight) as well as the time gained in the Hangar Straight, which interestingly places the MCL60 faster when they reach Club (T14)… In addition, and more importantly, the MCL60 carries more speed through the slow corners at the Loop, Brooklands and a very good exit from Chapel.

Even when the times don’t show it, based on the drag reduction and higher minimum corner speed in tricky corners, the MCL60 is clearly ahead of its predecessor.

Since we don’t have good data from Qualifying, which is where it matters… Instead of comparing it to previous year, I thought a look at how they are doing versus their target competitors (Aston Martin, Mercedes and Ferrari… The group we all want them to belong to) might be a good alternative:

Mclaren vs Aston Martin:

https://i.imgur.com/4cVmSSl.jpg

The McLaren is a whooping 7 tenths faster than the Aston during qualifying, Lando did his final lap a little later than Alonso and there is definitely an impact from track evolution on the times, but we can still find out some traits:

A) The Mclaren carries more speed through the corners: Lando manages to gain most of the time against Alonso in the slow corners, in Village, Luffield, the exit of Chappel as well as in Club.
B) The McLaren still loses in the straights: I thought initially that the losses in the straights were due to a more efficient DRS from the Aston, but looking at the telemetry for their fastest laps without DRS, the Aston still has an edge, but even when drag is still involved I still believe that is more of a deployment strategy issue than just drag, since the delta presents itself closer to the 300km/h mark than 250km/h (where we should start to see the impact of drag), the fact that it shows itself around 290km/h may seem to indicate that there is more influence from deployment than there is from drag (without negating that there is still some more drag that needs to be shed.

Mclaren vs Ferrari:

https://i.imgur.com/27RXCZ5.jpg

Lando was capable to beat the Ferrari’s by 2 tenths, where did the time came from:

A) Mclaren still showing more minimum speed in key corners clawing back the time lost in the straights in T4, T5, the exit of Chapel and beating the Ferrari in Stowe and Club… It is the cornering and braking performance of the MCL60 that gave them an edge
B) As with Aston, the MCL60 loses most of it’s time in the straights, but interestingly the time lost there is less than a tenth on either straight.

McLaren vs Mercedes:

https://i.imgur.com/6PahRio.jpg

A little bit of a different picture, in this case there isn’t a clear advantage for McLaren in regards to slow speed (albeit in the beginning of the lap) and there is still more top speed from Mercedes compared to McLaren, although the delta is smaller compared to the others.

Lando beats Hamilton in the final sector, with an impressive exit out of Chapel and Stowe, gaining additional time at Club.

From the above, McLaren clearly still has a deficit in top speed vs their (hopefully new) direct rivals, but a mix of strong low corner speed and traction gives it the edge and helps it overcome it… Still a lot of work for the Team, but there is definitely improvement in key aspects of the car… In a few more races, with more time for the team to dial in the new setup and hopefully more representative qualifying sessions, we should be able to get a more clear picture.
Thanks for the great analysis!

What's nice to see is those low speed corners at the start and end (the slow speed not quite a chicane before the straight....) where we are also carrying more speed. It doesn't make a huge difference to the lap here as they are not quite slow or long enough, but it is very pleasing to see that we are quite competent there. We are dominant in the high speed corners and comparable if not a little faster in the mid speed.

You might be right on deployment, we'd need to watch the car on track and see when it harvests to understand, because it also does look like either drag or a little lack of power. But given how we can carry more speed in every corner, you wouldn't say that the car has bad efficiency, actually the downforce it generates vs the top speed is a very good trade off. Of course, we'd all like our cake AND to eat it but this balance of speed vs downforce looks fine. But we need to see if the car has enough power in this configuration to pass cars. Then again when it's this fast there's a lot less to pass :D

The only thing missing from this track is a lot of prolonged lateral load, something we struggled with before. Copse is probably the closest we get but not especially straining compared to some tracks. But the track has many different challenges and the car doesn't struggle in any of them. Either they have found a good setup quickly or the car still has time in it.
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Juzh
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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chrisc90 wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 12:34
Its interesting looking at the Nor - Ham telemetry. Does Mclaren run their own gearbox on the back of their car? Lewis' car runs about 400rpm more just about everywhere. The traces look pretty equal to be honest. Lewis clearly loses some tyres at the end of the lap which might be a indication of worse tyre performance. But the gearbox thing is surprising me.
As was answered, yes, they do, but it makes no difference in terms of acceleration. These 400 rpm are near as makes no difference irrelevant.

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Wouter
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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Formula 1 @F1
1 m
Just LISTEN to that noise! Festival vibes for the @MclarenF1
duo at the team's home race 😍

#BritishGP #F1 @LandoNorris @OscarPiastri =D> =D> =D>

The Power of Dreams!

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mclaren111
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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RaceFans:

“I’m not normally hopeful going into a Sunday, because of how this year has been and how things normally go or certain tracks come Sunday,” Norris said. “But I’ve got some reasons to believe and some hope after our pace today, and how we were on Friday, that we can have a good race tomorrow.”

But while Norris is sensible enough to admit McLaren’s pace is “probably not enough” to take the fight to the driver aiming for his sixth victory in a row, he believes McLaren have “enough to put up a fight for, hopefully, a top five”.

Feet on the ground... Top 5 would be great... :D

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bauc
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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Absolute of a stunning qualy yesterday by both NOR & PIA..... god dam it, for a split second I tought we were on POLE!

For the race, I'm hopeful we can finish P5/P6, as realistically I think the Ferrari at the moment is just a better race car.

GO MCLAREN!
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BMMR61
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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https://www.racefans.net/2023/07/09/mcl ... akthrough/
Stella was not talking up race pace saying that the improvements have not really been sufficient to impact that aspect. While I don’t have enough data to be sure I saw signs that seemed to me to point to decent race pace. Obviously temperature will be crucial - any updates on weather at Silverstone today?

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vorticism
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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Wouter wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 13:44
Music festival near the track this weekend?
𓄀

101FlyingDutchman
101FlyingDutchman
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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BMMR61 wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 14:27
https://www.racefans.net/2023/07/09/mcl ... akthrough/
Stella was not talking up race pace saying that the improvements have not really been sufficient to impact that aspect. While I don’t have enough data to be sure I saw signs that seemed to me to point to decent race pace. Obviously temperature will be crucial - any updates on weather at Silverstone today?
Yeah the hard tyre run by NOR was very decent. Med and hard are the race tyres. The soft is pants and falls off way too quickly. If they can build the gap in the slow corners before the straight and build enough of a gap in Maggots/Becketts complex, they’ve got a chance of keeping a DRS car behind at the end of hanger straight

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MrGapes
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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101FlyingDutchman wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 14:33
BMMR61 wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 14:27
https://www.racefans.net/2023/07/09/mcl ... akthrough/
Stella was not talking up race pace saying that the improvements have not really been sufficient to impact that aspect. While I don’t have enough data to be sure I saw signs that seemed to me to point to decent race pace. Obviously temperature will be crucial - any updates on weather at Silverstone today?
Yeah the hard tyre run by NOR was very decent. Med and hard are the race tyres. The soft is pants and falls off way too quickly. If they can build the gap in the slow corners before the straight and build enough of a gap in Maggots/Becketts complex, they’ve got a chance of keeping a DRS car behind at the end of hanger straight
Yep the only chance imo or as already suggested by Juzh is they need be atleast 1.5seconds clear before drs is enabled, then the rest depends on deg... this is quite a big ask.. but this is their best chance otherwise they will be overtaken easily. Need to remember Mclaren is at its worst at the heaviest fuel loads, the few laps will tell us alot.

ollandos
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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Darth-Piekus
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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All I am hoping is for both drivers to have a clean start. Now hear something funny. What if Verstappen botches his start then both Mclarens pass him and he has a small accident with the Ferrari's behind freeing us from any threat.

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mwillems
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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MrGapes wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 14:37
101FlyingDutchman wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 14:33
BMMR61 wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 14:27
https://www.racefans.net/2023/07/09/mcl ... akthrough/
Stella was not talking up race pace saying that the improvements have not really been sufficient to impact that aspect. While I don’t have enough data to be sure I saw signs that seemed to me to point to decent race pace. Obviously temperature will be crucial - any updates on weather at Silverstone today?
Yeah the hard tyre run by NOR was very decent. Med and hard are the race tyres. The soft is pants and falls off way too quickly. If they can build the gap in the slow corners before the straight and build enough of a gap in Maggots/Becketts complex, they’ve got a chance of keeping a DRS car behind at the end of hanger straight
Yep the only chance imo or as already suggested by Juzh is they need be atleast 1.5seconds clear before drs is enabled, then the rest depends on deg... this is quite a big ask.. but this is their best chance otherwise they will be overtaken easily. Need to remember Mclaren is at its worst at the heaviest fuel loads, the few laps will tell us alot.
This is a different car, some traits may remain but we don't fully know which, yet.
I'm not taking advice from a cartoon dog

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organic
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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Darth-Piekus wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 14:48
All I am hoping is for both drivers to have a clean start. Now hear something funny. What if Verstappen botches his start then both Mclarens pass him and he has a small accident with the Ferrari's behind freeing us from any threat.
That script reminds me of Monza 2021

101FlyingDutchman
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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ollandos wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 14:43
Smallsoldiers assessment was spot on. It really seems deployment and DRS related in terms of speed at end of the straights. The RB19 just keeps climbing up past 305kmh

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mclaren111
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Re: 2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

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Darth-Piekus wrote:
09 Jul 2023, 14:48
All I am hoping is for both drivers to have a clean start. Now hear something funny. What if Verstappen botches his start then both Mclarens pass him and he has a small accident with the Ferrari's behind freeing us from any threat.
=D> =D>