2022 budget cap violations

[Just_a_fan]

No. That was Bottas.

When did Bottas hit Verstappen? I think you'll find it was Norris that hit Verstappen...

Nice save

Thank you.

[Just_a_fan]

Didn’t bottas go bowling with the red bulls in Hungary? Wiped them both out.

Either way - pointless having the 2021 debate in terms of crashes/ what cost etc or who’s fault it was. No relevance here for the 2022 discussion.

He hit Norris and then Perez. Norris hit Verstappen. Bottas put his hand up and apologised for messing up so many people's races.

But yes, agreed, the crashes of '21 aren't relevant to the '22 cap debate (unless they happened late enough in the year to affect the 22 car's delivery, suppose. Did any?)

They are only relevant for measuring crash damage relative to 22.

Was '21 a very "crashy" year? Was it more "crashy" than any other year? I wonder if it's just down to who was involved that makes it stand out. It's a genuine question and one that, I fear, we wouldn't be able to answer easily.

[rbirules]

He hit Norris and then Perez. Norris hit Verstappen. Bottas put his hand up and apologised for messing up so many people's races.

But yes, agreed, the crashes of '21 aren't relevant to the '22 cap debate (unless they happened late enough in the year to affect the 22 car's delivery, suppose. Did any?)

They are only relevant for measuring crash damage relative to 22.

Was '21 a very "crashy" year? Was it more "crashy" than any other year? I wonder if it's just down to who was involved that makes it stand out. It's a genuine question and one that, I fear, we wouldn't be able to answer easily.

Using the charts provided on the previous page, there was $45.5M in crash damage in 2021 and only $34.1M in 2022.

The Hungary L1 T1 incidents involved a lot of cars in 2021. There was nothing like that, that I can recall, in 2022. Max's crash at Silverstone was a huge crash, I can't think of anything similar in 2022 (Leclerc crashing in France wasn't nearly as big of a crash). I don't recall how much damage Zhou's car got at the start of Silverstone other than being flipped into the fence, so maybe that comes close. Also had the huge Bottas and Russell crash in Imola in 2021.

[Just_a_fan]

They are only relevant for measuring crash damage relative to 22.

Was '21 a very "crashy" year? Was it more "crashy" than any other year? I wonder if it's just down to who was involved that makes it stand out. It's a genuine question and one that, I fear, we wouldn't be able to answer easily.

Using the charts provided on the previous page, there was $45.5M in crash damage in 2021 and only $34.1M in 2022.

The Hungary L1 T1 incidents involved a lot of cars in 2021. There was nothing like that, that I can recall, in 2022. Max's crash at Silverstone was a huge crash, I can't think of anything similar in 2022 (Leclerc crashing in France wasn't nearly as big of a crash). I don't recall how much damage Zhou's car got at the start of Silverstone other than being flipped into the fence, so maybe that comes close. Also had the huge Bottas and Russell crash in Imola in 2021.

ISTR the Bottas/Russell crash being described as being a million dollar crash by Toto, but I don't have a reference for that.

For 2022, I think Zhou's was the only real "biggy" and that did a fair amount of damage with the flip over the barrier. Otherwise, lots of the usual nose or a corner being snapped off.

Found this for 2022:

[AR3-GP]

The rumor now (according to Amus) is that it is 2 teams, not 3. Make of that what you will.

[chrisc90]

The rumor now (according to Amus) is that it is 2 teams, not 3. Make of that what you will.

Click-bait?

[AR3-GP]

It's also possible that these are only procedural in nature.

[AR3-GP]

Craig Slater of Sky Sports:

"I have contacted the FIA. They are quite adamant in their response.

They told me that the reports are factually wrong!"

[Wouter]

[organic]

They denied it last year after AMuS' report and prior to the release of all information iirc, so I won't pay attention to that denial

As for 2022 I believe Mick cost Haas millions in the early part of the season, writing off a chassis at Saudi for instance with a huge shunt.

[AR3-GP]

They denied it last year after AMuS' report and prior to the release of all information iirc, so I won't pay attention to that denial

As for 2022 I believe Mick cost Haas millions in the early part of the season, writing off a chassis at Saudi for instance with a huge shunt.

Haas don't have the means to go over the cap. It was only this year with the Moneygram deal that they are even getting near it.

Realistically any issue is coming from the top 6 teams. They are the only ones with the means to overspend.

[KeiKo403]

Zak just needs to hope it’s not McLaren who’s overspent given the ‘cheating’ comments from last year.

If (and it is only a hypothetical ’if’) RBR have gone over again can anyone see the FIA coming down really hard with the penalty to try and push them back closer the rest of the field? So not a points reduction but a more significant reduction in WT time and CFD runs a much larger fine a-la $100m fine and a reduction in budget cap allowance? I don’t see the point in stripping previous results/points.

Maybe Ferrari dropped Binotto because they knew their 2022 BC was over the limit?
Maybe Mercedes has c.50 strong finance team because they need to go over everything from 2022 because the FIA believe they’re over?

[organic]

They denied it last year after AMuS' report and prior to the release of all information iirc, so I won't pay attention to that denial

As for 2022 I believe Mick cost Haas millions in the early part of the season, writing off a chassis at Saudi for instance with a huge shunt.

Haas don't have the means to go over the cap. It was only this year with the Moneygram deal that they are even getting near it.

Realistically any issue is coming from the top 6 teams. They are the only ones with the means to overspend.

Agree on all fronts

Posted the stuff about Mick as people were talking about few "big crashes" in 2022, and perhaps only Zhou's, but I believe Mick's Monaco & Saudi Arabia crashes were both very, very expensive & both should count

[Just_a_fan]

Maybe Mercedes has c.50 strong finance team because they need to go over everything from 2022 because the FIA believe they’re over?

Or maybe they've set up a structure to ensure that they don't go over the cap limit in the first place.

This is the team that turned down the opportunity to test tyres - and be paid some money towards the cost of doing it - because of the risk of going over the cost cap following Bottas's expensive get together with Russell.

[Stu]

A lot of you are talking about this year's upgrades! It doesn't really matter since we're talking about last year's budget cap! I remember last year a certain team being ready to bring a lightweight chassis! I find this interesting too since Mercedes has been saying since the start of the season that it's impossible under the budget cap to develop a new chassis...

That chassis does not get included as it wasn’t used (just the same as the mysterious ‘goblin wing’ will not be included).
It wouldn’t surprise me if the RB19 is using a development of the lightweight chassis - meaning that they haven’t developed two chassis that have to be accounted for in the cap period.



However, it is interesting to see that mud is being thrown before the report is released, AGAIN!!