2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

[BMMR61]

Yep I get that. However many a great driver (Alonso, Ricciardo etc) has made a poor career choice and missed out on the good times to come. Hypothetically if Lando left today would Lewis consider a shock move back to his old home? Nothing is as simple as it sometimes seems but McLaren atm are working their way into a position of promise in the driver stakes, except both drivers have contracts into 2024&25.

[f1rules]

Honestly i think Landos "maturing/growing in the team" and more explicit/vocal behavior played a part in Keys departure. For sure he didnt do himself any favours the last two years and the failures, but Lando for some time now was increasingly/very vocal and very direct in saying, flaws was inherited year after year after year. Even after the reset and new rules/concepts, the flaws remained. But that is a thing of the past, now. Things seem to be on the right track and i havent been this positive about Mclaren in a long long time.

[djos]

Yep I get that. However many a great driver (Alonso, Ricciardo etc) has made a poor career choice and missed out on the good times to come. Hypothetically if Lando left today would Lewis consider a shock move back to his old home? Nothing is as simple as it sometimes seems but McLaren atm are working their way into a position of promise in the driver stakes, except both drivers have contracts into 2024&25.

Im not sure that Lewis would move back, he usually gets what he wants at Merc. At least when he told them, for a second year in a row, that the cockpit was too far forward, they publicly committed to fixing it. On top of that, Merc have some of the best facilities on the grid.

[djos]

Honestly i think Landos "maturing/growing in the team" and more explicit/vocal behavior played a part in Keys departure. For sure he didnt do himself any favours the last two years and the failures, but Lando for some time now was increasingly/very vocal and very direct in saying, flaws was inherited year after year after year. Even after the reset and new rules/concepts, the flaws remained. But that is a thing of the past, now. Things seem to be on the right track and i havent been this positive about Mclaren in a long long time.

True, I'm cautiously optimistic next year will be a big leap forward under the new team structure Stella has implemented. I also hope the trend of a more competitive car continues this year.

[BMMR61]

I get concerned when I see forum optimism through the roof over two good results as much as it annoys me when keyboard warriors say things like “McLaren are finished”. Most people have little idea how difficult success in F1 is. Just moving up the pecking order takes tremendous investment, decision making, courage, luck - it’s an incredibly hard sport. Zak has taken an enormous amount of heat on forums . While the recovery from 2017 hasn’t been linear and stalled in 2022, there’s a lot to feel optimistic about. I’m confident the main reason for the stagnation was car concept so the changes made in March look to be spot on. With an expansion of top engineering talent coming from two top teams 2025 looks like it could be an exciting time for McLaren.

[f1rules]

About Lando and his increased critique, i think its just natural development, maturing. He started as a kid, fooled around a couple of years with sainz, it was fun, his talent was obvious. Then came the big unsure, daniel, who he destroyed, and since that, hes been a clear leader, being more vocal, outlining what he want, and i want that from a driver. Hes aware of his talent now, and what it can bring him. Unfortunately the last couple of years Mclaren didnt seem the team to be able to honour his rightfull demands. That has fortunately changed now with light at the end of the tunnel emerging. I think he wants to win with mclaren, thats why the growing frustration, he didnt trust Key or even the team here at the end, but thankfully seidls, send from heaven departure and i like him!, provoked a big reaction, and it seem the cards has been dealt greatly first by Zak and now by Stella

[Ground Effect]

Iirc, James key joined for 2018 which was the first year McLaren ran Renault and discovered that their chassis was actually not even close to being decent.

So they redesigned it from scratch for 2019 which was the year Lando joined. I don’t recall if Fernando was still there for 2019 or not.

My point being, I’m not sure if Fernando’s driving style was the primary influence, or finding out their chassis was poor regardless of the PU driving it.

James Key joined in 2019, Fernando left at the end of the 2018 season.

[djos]

Iirc, James key joined for 2018 which was the first year McLaren ran Renault and discovered that their chassis was actually not even close to being decent.

So they redesigned it from scratch for 2019 which was the year Lando joined. I don’t recall if Fernando was still there for 2019 or not.

My point being, I’m not sure if Fernando’s driving style was the primary influence, or finding out their chassis was poor regardless of the PU driving it.

James Key joined in 2019, Fernando left at the end of the 2018 season.

Cheers, I was a little hazy on the timeline.

[geogate]

you take from a Pirelli tyre test that Ricciardo can handle the RB19 just fine? on a day immediately following a GP weekend? urm, ok.

[djos]

you take from a Pirelli tyre test that Ricciardo can handle the RB19 just fine? on a day immediately following a GP weekend? urm, ok.

RedBull fired Nyck one hour into the test and replaced him with Daniel, what does that say?

Besides, don’t take my word for it, RedBull positively gushed over the test results.

[f1rules]

there is always a limiting factor to a car, always, the difference is this has been outlined for years from different drivers, if they succeedd curring, it will be the next limiting factor Lando will mention, but you have to chip away, at each, thats how you end up in rb's situation

[saputra_25]

"If there's any team that says that the bodywork and the sidepods don't have an effect in the current regulations, there's this long nose, Pinocchio-style," Many people relate this comment toward Toto's claim that when Mercedes implementing Redbull style downwash sidepod on their model, they even lost significant performance.

I see this as a genuine quality of Andrea, who has strong technical background. I'm happy that we have a team principal who knows what he is talking about and can be on par with his engineers when discussing technical issue.

However, I hoped Zak reminded him, that he is now a team principal, who inevitably has to deal with F1 politics IN and OUT the track.
Despite, I think Mclaren have had excellent relationship with Mercedes, as Olla (current CEO) was a former Mclaren man (was one of Mclaren leadership team back in early 2000 under Ron' era).
I still could not imagine that we mess around with our engine supplier (or in this case, the boss of the works team of our engine supplier), since I believe Toto still has a strong influence at Stuttgart for their Brixworth operation (HPP).

Or perharps Zak will cover all politics and all external communications and let Andrea focus on making the team operates as efficient as possible to produce the fastest car.

[BMMR61]

Iirc, James key joined for 2018 which was the first year McLaren ran Renault and discovered that their chassis was actually not even close to being decent.

So they redesigned it from scratch for 2019 which was the year Lando joined. I don’t recall if Fernando was still there for 2019 or not.

My point being, I’m not sure if Fernando’s driving style was the primary influence, or finding out their chassis was poor regardless of the PU driving it.

James Key joined in 2019, Fernando left at the end of the 2018 season.

Regarding Key’s impact on car concepts his joining in 2019 meant his first design was meant to be the 2020 car. However the FIA restrictions on development in combination with the change to Mercedes PU meant the 35M was largely a repowered MCL35. So James Key’s first clean sheet designed McLaren was the evolutionary 2021 which was a gentle improvement on its predecessor. last year’s dismal car was most definitely not an improvement in the first year of the ground effect cars. His second go was equally poor and internal rumblings it now seems were at play late last year. The current car is doing pretty well for a “band aid” car, arguably because the primary cause of the poor performance was a lack of aero integration. The handling issue complained of won’t be resolved until, at the earliest, a clean sheet design is introduced next year. I imagine the team are learning an awful lot from the successful change of direction they have taken.

[djos]

Iirc, James key joined for 2018 which was the first year McLaren ran Renault and discovered that their chassis was actually not even close to being decent.

So they redesigned it from scratch for 2019 which was the year Lando joined. I don’t recall if Fernando was still there for 2019 or not.

My point being, I’m not sure if Fernando’s driving style was the primary influence, or finding out their chassis was poor regardless of the PU driving it.

James Key joined in 2019, Fernando left at the end of the 2018 season.

Regarding Key’s impact on car concepts his joining in 2019 meant his first design was meant to be the 2020 car. However the FIA restrictions on development in combination with the change to Mercedes PU meant the 35M was largely a repowered MCL35. So James Key’s first clean sheet designed McLaren was last year’s dismal 36, the first of the ground effect cars. His second go was equally poor and internal rumblings it now seems were at play late last year. The current car is doing pretty well for a “band aid” car, arguably because the primary cause of the poor performance was a lack of aero integration. The handling issue complained of won’t be resolved until, at the earliest, a clean sheet design is introduced next year. I imagine the team are learning an awful lot from the successful change of direction they have taken.

Good points, sometimes the timeline blends together in my head. They certainly seemed to have turned a corner on the Aero front, lets hope the overall trajectory continues.

[Ground Effect]

Iirc, James key joined for 2018 which was the first year McLaren ran Renault and discovered that their chassis was actually not even close to being decent.

So they redesigned it from scratch for 2019 which was the year Lando joined. I don’t recall if Fernando was still there for 2019 or not.

My point being, I’m not sure if Fernando’s driving style was the primary influence, or finding out their chassis was poor regardless of the PU driving it.

James Key joined in 2019, Fernando left at the end of the 2018 season.

Regarding Key’s impact on car concepts his joining in 2019 meant his first design was meant to be the 2020 car. However the FIA restrictions on development in combination with the change to Mercedes PU meant the 35M was largely a repowered MCL35. So James Key’s first clean sheet designed McLaren was the evolutionary 2021 which was a gentle improvement on its predecessor. last year’s dismal car was most definitely not an improvement in the first year of the ground effect cars. His second go was equally poor and internal rumblings it now seems were at play late last year. The current car is doing pretty well for a “band aid” car, arguably because the primary cause of the poor performance was a lack of aero integration. The handling issue complained of won’t be resolved until, at the earliest, a clean sheet design is introduced next year. I imagine the team are learning an awful lot from the successful change of direction they have taken.

The first car to be overseen by Key was the MCL35, the 2020 car. There were no FIA restrictions then, that came during the covid disrupted season in 2020 for the 2021 car, where the token system was introduced, but McLaren had to give up theirs in exchange for switching to the Mercedes PU.