2023 Aston Martin | Aramco | Cognizant F1 Team

[Jambier]

Awful qualy…

This will be a very long half season now.
Fighting for P8-10, and given that this is a « good » track for the car even no points.

Never saw a team fall that quickly

[diffuser]

Right, they are on pole for all but 1 race and nobody here thinks he has more in hand?

Perez didn't even make Q3 five times in a row... Bagging all those poles doesn't mean he has more in hand. There's no direct correlation there. Just go back and watch the sessions. Doesn't look like he's taking it easy to me.

Nobody is saying he's taking it easy, but definitely not pushing like his life is hanging by a thin thread. Doing his job as an average F1 driver to me. And in such a sceanrio, any driver hardly makes any mistake.

Exactly. When you're pushing at 4 or 5 on 10, you make almost no mistakes. When you're pushing 9 or 10 on 10, you're margin for error is slim to none. When Alonso is pushing 10 on 10 on turns 13 and 14 well, he's not gonna get it right 100% of time. The degree of difficulty is much higher.

[Gillian]

In Monaco, he brushed the walls so many times, a little here and there, and he could have been in the wall. Was very lucky. On the other hand, I don't remember Alo brushing the walls even once in quali.

Does this not satisfy your criteria:

Nobody is saying he's taking it easy, but definitely not pushing like his life is hanging by a thin thread.

Would taking pole by using all of the track and skimming walls not qualify as "life is hanging by a thin thread"?

Exactly.

[alonsofan]

Would taking pole by using all of the track and skimming walls not qualify as "life is hanging by a thin thread"?
[/quote]

Taking pole by brushing walls in a superior car is poor driving. Very lucky he didn't end up in the wall.

And by that analogy, you mean to say that Alo wasn't pushing? C'mon.

[diffuser]

Would taking pole by using all of the track and skimming walls not qualify as "life is hanging by a thin thread"?

Taking pole by brushing walls in a superior car is poor driving. Very lucky he didn't end up in the wall.

And by that analogy, you mean to say that Alo wasn't pushing? C'mon.
[/quote]

No other driver had a car that could even attempt that.

[nowaysthatsreal]

Clearly someone like a nando would be faster on one lap if he was driving AMR but not at the cost of FA, Lance needs to be replaced by someone who can match FA or do better. The points table would look different if Lance was scoring when competition was struggling with their cars. But lack of pace specifically for this track is concerning. Updates did not get em closer to RB, and that’s strange given the wind tunnel time they had.

[604gtir]

i wonder how much AMR has been impacted by the tire construction change

[Farnborough]

i wonder how much AMR has been impacted by the tire construction change

I feel that's a very valid point, they don't appear to have made the gain (look similar in pace as before) some other teams have experienced. That itself is clouded in the updates other chassis have brought to track.

The pace difference of FA to MV at beginning of season generally now contains many other teams on this track.

The more robust tyre carcass should need more load to get it moving and then to generate more core temperature. Aston fine balance at season start, split between warming the tyre and then working it just enough during race to keep it absolutely in a optimum windo, looks to have suffered a little in comparison to others that appear to have needed this construction earlier season and can now take advantage.

[Farnborough]

To add, the RB appears paired with the Aston in this respect, they both didn't need the more robust construction and now both pegged back into the field by comparison with earlier races.

It should still help race pace (the latent chassis ability) for both, but being stuck behind someone may not let us see true pace though.

[101FlyingDutchman]

Would taking pole by using all of the track and skimming walls not qualify as "life is hanging by a thin thread"?

Taking pole by brushing walls in a superior car is poor driving. Very lucky he didn't end up in the wall.

And by that analogy, you mean to say that Alo wasn't pushing? C'mon.

No other driver had a car that could even attempt that.
[/quote]

Mate. This level of conversation is beneath you. You could clearly see that VER had to go all out in Monaco to even get close to pole. Peak DF is not the RB19s strength and it shows up in Hungary and Monaco. The fact is you guys are arguing a point that you can’t even begin to back up with facts. Please stop

As it happens, Nando was fairly realistic about where AMR sits at the moment and isn’t unhappy. That’s good enough for me. Hopefully they’re evaluating upgrades but due budget gap only get it to the car when there is a decent step in performance and related directly to ‘24

[alonsofan]

Would taking pole by using all of the track and skimming walls not qualify as "life is hanging by a thin thread"?

Taking pole by brushing walls in a superior car is poor driving. Very lucky he didn't end up in the wall.

And by that analogy, you mean to say that Alo wasn't pushing? C'mon.

No other driver had a car that could even attempt that.

Mate. This level of conversation is beneath you. You could clearly see that VER had to go all out in Monaco to even get close to pole. Peak DF is not the RB19s strength and it shows up in Hungary and Monaco. The fact is you guys are arguing a point that you can’t even begin to back up with facts. Please stop

As it happens, Nando was fairly realistic about where AMR sits at the moment and isn’t unhappy. That’s good enough for me. Hopefully they’re evaluating upgrades but due budget gap only get it to the car when there is a decent step in performance and related directly to ‘24
[/quote]

The argument was about Alo regularly making mistakes in quali, and Max not making mistakes. And the answer to that was that nobody has pushed Max to the point where he makes mistakes. He's had it easy so far.

Whereas Alo has been pushing the car to it's limits to extract the maximum performance, and when you try doing that, there is always a chance for making mistakes.

[diffuser]

Clearly someone like a nando would be faster on one lap if he was driving AMR but not at the cost of FA, Lance needs to be replaced by someone who can match FA or do better. The points table would look different if Lance was scoring when competition was struggling with their cars. But lack of pace specifically for this track is concerning. Updates did not get em closer to RB, and that’s strange given the wind tunnel time they had.

Yep, they haven't had much in upgrades aside from the Canada one. So maybe they have diverted significant resources to 2024 early on.

I keep thinking that they've been saying all Along that they haven't been expecting this huge uptic in performance. They might have been already planning to take what they'd learned and roll it into the following year's car.

They need to increase the undercut even more, remove the kick out from the side pods and improve performance from the floor.

[KimiRai]

On the Alo qualy thing. Trulli was half of times faster than him over one lap. 2012 one of his greatest seasons, last 2 races he botched qualy and qualified behind Massa (one of them they had Massa be penalised in order to start ahead of him). 2007 showed Lewis is faster in absolute peak pace. But because racing is a competition with multiple facets or layers of expertise and not just one lap pace, it meant he would go on to beat Lewis with inferior Ferraris from 2010 to 2013 four years straight. It's not aging it's just how Fernando has always been, long corners, if you study it you'll see it has little to do with age (and also why he's one of the greatest despite the long corners).

I recommend you watch this video from Peter Windsor, does a great job at explaining it.

[max_speed]

Clearly someone like a nando would be faster on one lap if he was driving AMR but not at the cost of FA, Lance needs to be replaced by someone who can match FA or do better. The points table would look different if Lance was scoring when competition was struggling with their cars. But lack of pace specifically for this track is concerning. Updates did not get em closer to RB, and that’s strange given the wind tunnel time they had.

Yep, they haven't had much in upgrades aside from the Canada one. So maybe they have diverted significant resources to 2024 early on.

I keep thinking that they've been saying all Along that they haven't been expecting this huge uptic in performance. They might have been already planning to take what they'd learned and roll it into the following year's car.

They need to increase the undercut even more, remove the kick out from the side pods and improve performance from the floor.

Rules are stable so if updates are not working on current car. It makes sense to focus on this year, find a stable direction to develop the car before putting resources on next year. They brought one big upgrade and it failed.
Till now both alonso and krack were saying track specific performance of opponents, finally yesterday Krack admitted rivals have out developed them.in formula1 excuses are dead weights tied to your feet they take you to the bottom faster.

[diffuser]

Clearly someone like a nando would be faster on one lap if he was driving AMR but not at the cost of FA, Lance needs to be replaced by someone who can match FA or do better. The points table would look different if Lance was scoring when competition was struggling with their cars. But lack of pace specifically for this track is concerning. Updates did not get em closer to RB, and that’s strange given the wind tunnel time they had.

Yep, they haven't had much in upgrades aside from the Canada one. So maybe they have diverted significant resources to 2024 early on.

I keep thinking that they've been saying all Along that they haven't been expecting this huge uptic in performance. They might have been already planning to take what they'd learned and roll it into the following year's car.

They need to increase the undercut even more, remove the kick out from the side pods and improve performance from the floor.

Rules are stable so if updates are not working on current car. It makes sense to focus on this year, find a stable direction to develop the car before putting resources on next year. They brought one big upgrade and it failed.
Till now both alonso and krack were saying track specific performance of opponents, finally yesterday Krack admitted rivals have out developed them.in formula1 excuses are dead weights tied to your feet they take you to the bottom faster.

Well that sucks.