2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

[MrGapes]

Some thoughts for Hungary:

Despite the collection of longer and slower speed corners in Hungary, historically this has been a pretty good track for Macca, mostly in qualifying… the high downforce nature of Hungary means the teams run very loaded setups, thus the corners become very ‘stop and go’ and really reduces the mid corner and the asphalt around Hungaroing also offers very high grip, which is inherently good for McLaren.

Last year luckily both quail and the race were much cooler conditions with overcast which really helped maintain higher grip, with new soft rubber and lower fuel the car was about +0.4 off pole.

It is a very different track to Silverstone, whilst the slow speed is a fundamental underlying issue, this won’t be a big problem in qualifying as the high grip surface, and new softs will mask those losses as seen last year. The MCL60 overall as a package produces decent downforce, as have McLarens historically in a high downforce configuration, so I don’t think it’s farfetched to think we can qualify somewhere at the sharp end (edit: the cooler the better)

The race is where I expect us to fall back compared to Silverstone, where we lost in the slower turns 4-5, 6-7, and 16-17 the car made up for in Copse, Maggotts, Becketts, and Stowe. A positive is that despite the slower speed weakness the car was still better or matched some of the top cars in the slower sections despite the underlying issues…

I did say we will perform well in qualifying

To be honest the heavy fuel pace in FP2 surprised me... if FP2 is indicative of what will be seen tomorrow in the race that will be quite exciting.

- I'm also slightly more optimistic because of the new mediums which shouldn't be underestimated in warmer conditions... all the scrub tyres will have undergone a significant heat cycle and may grain quicker and harder.

[Mostlyeels]

I did say we will perform well in qualifying

I'll admit, I was sceptical

To be honest the heavy fuel pace in FP2 surprised me... if FP2 is indicative of what will be seen tomorrow in the race that will be quite exciting.

In FP2 (via my eyeballs) I counted AMR +0.4s on Mediums, Ferrari looked closer to McLaren on Mediums too, and Alpine looked more competitive on Hards (as always), but didn't think to look at Mercedes at all. Anyone got a long run chart?

E: from Racefans, FP2 long runs.

• Red Bull, softs (Verstappen) 1:23.3
• Alfa Romeo, mediums 1:23.3
• McLaren, mediums 1:23.6
• Mercedes, mediums (Russell) 1:24.2

[FittingMechanics]

Some thoughts for Hungary:

Despite the collection of longer and slower speed corners in Hungary, historically this has been a pretty good track for Macca, mostly in qualifying… the high downforce nature of Hungary means the teams run very loaded setups, thus the corners become very ‘stop and go’ and really reduces the mid corner and the asphalt around Hungaroing also offers very high grip, which is inherently good for McLaren.

Last year luckily both quail and the race were much cooler conditions with overcast which really helped maintain higher grip, with new soft rubber and lower fuel the car was about +0.4 off pole.

It is a very different track to Silverstone, whilst the slow speed is a fundamental underlying issue, this won’t be a big problem in qualifying as the high grip surface, and new softs will mask those losses as seen last year. The MCL60 overall as a package produces decent downforce, as have McLarens historically in a high downforce configuration, so I don’t think it’s farfetched to think we can qualify somewhere at the sharp end (edit: the cooler the better)

The race is where I expect us to fall back compared to Silverstone, where we lost in the slower turns 4-5, 6-7, and 16-17 the car made up for in Copse, Maggotts, Becketts, and Stowe. A positive is that despite the slower speed weakness the car was still better or matched some of the top cars in the slower sections despite the underlying issues…

I did say we will perform well in qualifying

To be honest the heavy fuel pace in FP2 surprised me... if FP2 is indicative of what will be seen tomorrow in the race that will be quite exciting.

- I'm also slightly more optimistic because of the new mediums which shouldn't be underestimated in warmer conditions... all the scrub tyres will have undergone a significant heat cycle and may grain quicker and harder.

We need to recalibrate our expectations (to the better). This car did fine during Austria and Silverstone races, in various conditions. I expect it to do well going forward. I think team realizes that which is why both drivers are saying they want to fight for a podium and with the cars ahead.

Fun time to be a McLaren fan. What a turnaround

[mclaren111]

To the front of the grid almost? Even in winter it is mighty. Look at how everyone spoke of AM at the start and they were still trailing RB.

This is orders of magnitude better and the team have even been surprised.

Peter Prodmorou, you have everyone's thanks.

The improvement is definitely amazing and I’m not trying to undermine the effort and the magnitude of it… All I’m saying is that this is not your normal in-season development, this is the result of approximately 6 months of work and instead of an iteration of their concept (which is the normal for in-season development) it is the result of a complete concept change, therefore more akin to a Winter improvement (new car).

Yeah this has definitely been brewing since testing, which is I think the point at which Stella said they realised they had to completely redesign the aero so has been 5 months in the making.

But this is beyond any fans wildest dreams, this car is top 3 and at some tracks is top 2, let's see which track it can be top 1.

IIRC this started late last year...

[Farnborough]

Wasn't there team reference to realising in November 2022 that they were on the wrong track ?

I can't remember which person the quote was attributed to, but further thought that they new the Bahrain test car was effectively being shunted into a siding as development followed another pathway.

[mclaren111]

I thought Spa would be a good one for McLaren. Tracks with more medium/high speed should suit the car.

Qatar & Suzuka are chances for wins IMO

Agreed...

[mwillems]

Wasn't there team reference to realising in November 2022 that they were on the wrong track ?

I can't remember which person the quote was attributed to, but further thought that they new the Bahrain test car was effectively being shunted into a siding as development followed another pathway.

In relation to how the floor works - Key mentioned they they saw a month too late that the new floor regs required a totally different approach, they spoke seperately about the realisation they had to start over with the Aero at the start of the season. I think they did bring some small changes to the aero to help the new floor but.. it all got binned to be replaced by the new Aero package. I believe this is minds were made certain over JKs removal and PPs promotion.

[mwillems]

The improvement is definitely amazing and I’m not trying to undermine the effort and the magnitude of it… All I’m saying is that this is not your normal in-season development, this is the result of approximately 6 months of work and instead of an iteration of their concept (which is the normal for in-season development) it is the result of a complete concept change, therefore more akin to a Winter improvement (new car).

Yeah this has definitely been brewing since testing, which is I think the point at which Stella said they realised they had to completely redesign the aero so has been 5 months in the making.

But this is beyond any fans wildest dreams, this car is top 3 and at some tracks is top 2, let's see which track it can be top 1.

IIRC this started late last year...

I may be wrong, but I believe they spoke about the floor direction being wrong in November and they started again and brough that to Baku. At the start of the season they stated that the Aero needed completely redoing, so they began a project to redesign the Aero, this was at testing I believe, 3 months after they started designing the new floor.

[mwillems]

This article talks about how the tyres have helped Mclaren and hindered RB and Aston. There's definitely something in it, I'd imagine a few tenths have come to Mclaren from the tyre construction. We know the team struggle with how the tyre deformed under lateral load, and we know the construction is now sturdier, so it seems like Pirelli have helped us out in all of the corners.

Was tyre deformation related to the off throttle behaviours I wonder? The act of dropping off throttle, cruising off throttle and then applying acceleration causing the tyres to deform to a different profile that harmed the aero? This would explain some improvement of behaviour in long corners and twisty sections.

https://www.racefans.net/2023/07/22/ast ... ge-alonso/

[mclaren111]

Verstappen colliding with a backmarker to crash out of the race would be truly historic.

But McLaren victory is much more enjoyable.

I will love it if VER can take out HAM at the start...

[mwillems]

Verstappen colliding with a backmarker to crash out of the race would be truly historic.

But McLaren victory is much more enjoyable.

I will love it if VER can take out HAM at the start...

I just want to win on Merit and watch Norris and Piastri go at it (Safely!). We are a little way away from that.

[mwillems]

Norris frustrated Hungaroring is a track where it is hard to overtake. Seems he thinks he can fight with the cars ahead.

Should be fun race tomorrow.

He'd struggle to get past an RB anyway, but there is always strategy, if we can keep close to the Bulls then we can put the pressure on them and see who blinks first, and who gets the luck.

Of course, there is always the start, if we make progress and get track position then we are in with a shout, but the RB has the pace to overtake with DRS, easily. Maybe we will see some tasty battles between the Mclarens and Red Bull tomorrow. Ham v Nor was especially dramatic to watch at Sil, very big elbows against Hamilton. Verstappen has nothing to gain by being aggressive with Norris though, and they are mates, so likely it would be very amicable.

The hardest task tomorrow will be for the strategy Team… Between a potential 2 stopper, a risky though aggressive strategy could reap reward.

The biggest advantage for McLaren in the race is the fact that out of top 3, they are the only ones with 2 cars in play… Just for fun, a thought to use Piastri to slow down the cars in front… Me been silly, I would put Piastri on Hards from the beginning and make him go long and pull a Perez in Abu Dhabi to Verstappen, Hamilton… Keep Norris out for as long as possible, either for a potential overcut or simply to gain a tire delta to the other 2, if Piastri could be a road block for the other 2 then it could be game on

The fact that we can even dare to discuss potential strategies for win is simply amazing

Yep for strategy, no rain today so it is down to the race start and the pit stops, but I do expect to see some passing on track, not sure if it is the Mclaren that will be passing though.

I'd like a Med-Hard-Med approach if possible, see what ground we can make up at that start, pit and hold position and wait for a timely pit onto mediums at the end and attack the race.

Over the last 10 races there have been 7 races with safety cars or VSC, with some races having more than one VSC or safety car fort a total of 10 incidences. So there is a good chance that some teams are going to benefit for either the virtual or actual safety car today.

Re: Oscar. How mean! lol It did cross my mind but we can't use him like that as you already acknowledged. But hopefully if we do need to stage a rear-guard defence then having those two cars together will be useful.

Hopefully they do not attack each other, they just need to get around the track in the quickest way possible.

[BMMR61]

Verstappen colliding with a backmarker to crash out of the race would be truly historic.

But McLaren victory is much more enjoyable.

I will love it if VER can take out HAM at the start...

I just want to win on Merit and watch Norris and Piastri go at it (Safely!). We are a little way away from that.

A few hours away?
Let’s go boys!

[mclaren111]

https://www.gpfans.com/en/f1-news/10003 ... d-prix-f1/


Soooo Close...

[Darth-Piekus]

I am hearing that the rules regarding tyres changed and many claim that many teams gained something from that with Mclaren getting the most and others like Red Bull and Aston Martin losing ground. Do you think that is the case or is it because of our upgrade?