2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

[organic]

Tough race, but a Russell quote from today sticks out "I'd rather have a good car and bad day than the other way round". Alpine can have their moment today. Hopefully, the team learns from this and we can challenge in what looks like similar conditions next weekend.

Also, I think the new wing would have helped in that comeback drive today, especially when Lando was stuck behind Tsunoda. I suspected the old draggier wing may have caused us problems if any racy situations arised.

I think next week the team will bring a cutout wing with the new philosophy or perhaps even a low DF special with Vegas also in mind. Hopefully, we can bounce back strong and keep the momentum up! My goal for the team is 5 podiums this year, don't think that's too unrealistic.

The new rear wing would've been the optimal choice regardless, but they didn't want to risk damaging more of them. Given how treacherous the quali and race were, probably the right call.

The old spec rear wing was enough to get Lando and Oscar P2/P3 on the grid if both did decent laps. Lando did an alright lap but oscar didn't and that was that. You don't need the straight-line speed for overtaking if you're expecting to start very high up the grid really (p2-p5). It was impossible to forecast the situation that has both Oscar and Lando out of the top 10 on lap 5 stuck behind with the draggier RW. Plus that new wing is more efficient but also produces less df so in the wetter conditions might've struggled a bit more which was when the car seemed already a bit weaker compared to its rivals like Merc

[Mostlyeels]

I agree. Perhaps I misunderstood, but I thought someone said Lando overruled the team to stay out.
Also the radio "we are faster than inters cars" made me laugh, that was bizarre.
They should have split the strategy and pit at least one of them is my opinion.

The radio call was likely a lap late lol

Yeah it's weird, like he looked at last lap times or something. In changing conditions you can't really be looking at 1 minute old data. Only last minisectors paint the picture.

I didn't actually watch the radio call, but was it just the normal 30-second delay the FIA put in on team radio i.e. the team would've been talking about it in real time, but we're hearing about it with some delay?

[mwillems]

Tough race, but a Russell quote from today sticks out "I'd rather have a good car and bad day than the other way round". Alpine can have their moment today. Hopefully, the team learns from this and we can challenge in what looks like similar conditions next weekend.

Also, I think the new wing would have helped in that comeback drive today, especially when Lando was stuck behind Tsunoda. I suspected the old draggier wing may have caused us problems if any racy situations arised.

I think next week the team will bring a cutout wing with the new philosophy or perhaps even a low DF special with Vegas also in mind. Hopefully, we can bounce back strong and keep the momentum up! My goal for the team is 5 podiums this year, don't think that's too unrealistic.

The new rear wing would've been the optimal choice regardless, but they didn't want to risk damaging more of them. Given how treacherous the quali and race were, probably the right call.

The old spec rear wing was enough to get Lando and Oscar P2/P3 on the grid if both did decent laps. Lando did an alright lap but oscar didn't and that was that. You don't need the straight-line speed for overtaking if you're expecting to start very high up the grid really (p2-p5). It was impossible to forecast the situation that has both Oscar and Lando out of the top 10 on lap 5 stuck behind with the draggier RW. Plus that new wing is more efficient but also produces less df so in the wetter conditions might've struggled a bit more which was when the car seemed already a bit weaker compared to its rivals like Merc

We needed straight line speed to maintain position though. Imagine if we couldnt get past cars when we had DRS, how we'd defend against cars when we don't... we were second fastest in qualy conditions but in race there is more to do yet. I think it would have been hard to get a podium.

Still loving the competitiveness though.

[SmallSoldier]

The radio call was likely a lap late lol

Yeah it's weird, like he looked at last lap times or something. In changing conditions you can't really be looking at 1 minute old data. Only last minisectors paint the picture.

I didn't actually watch the radio call, but was it just the normal 30-second delay the FIA put in on team radio i.e. the team would've been talking about it in real time, but we're hearing about it with some delay?

Some times it can be a couple of laps delay… They have people listening to the radios, then someone picks and chooses which they will transmit, then they do the graphics so that you can read them in the broadcast… It’s not live

[MCLvamos]

Not sure it was that much of a delay judging by this. Not sure what Lopez was looking at...

[SmallSoldier]

Tough race, but a Russell quote from today sticks out "I'd rather have a good car and bad day than the other way round". Alpine can have their moment today. Hopefully, the team learns from this and we can challenge in what looks like similar conditions next weekend.

Also, I think the new wing would have helped in that comeback drive today, especially when Lando was stuck behind Tsunoda. I suspected the old draggier wing may have caused us problems if any racy situations arised.

I think next week the team will bring a cutout wing with the new philosophy or perhaps even a low DF special with Vegas also in mind. Hopefully, we can bounce back strong and keep the momentum up! My goal for the team is 5 podiums this year, don't think that's too unrealistic.

The new rear wing would've been the optimal choice regardless, but they didn't want to risk damaging more of them. Given how treacherous the quali and race were, probably the right call.

The old spec rear wing was enough to get Lando and Oscar P2/P3 on the grid if both did decent laps. Lando did an alright lap but oscar didn't and that was that. You don't need the straight-line speed for overtaking if you're expecting to start very high up the grid really (p2-p5). It was impossible to forecast the situation that has both Oscar and Lando out of the top 10 on lap 5 stuck behind with the draggier RW. Plus that new wing is more efficient but also produces less df so in the wetter conditions might've struggled a bit more which was when the car seemed already a bit weaker compared to its rivals like Merc

We needed straight line speed to maintain position though. Imagine if we couldnt get past cars when we had DRS, how we'd defend against cars when we don't... we were second fastest in qualy conditions but in race there is more to do yet. I think it would have been hard to get a podium.

Still loving the competitiveness though.

It depends on the circuit layout, yes top speed will definitely help, but if it is at the cost of more tire degradation or simply lower downforce that allows your rivals to be very close before a DRS activation zone, it doesn’t matter how much more top speed you have (without DRS)… On the other hand, if you have more DF and can build a gap in the middle sector for example or build a delta close to the DRS zone, then you may be completely out of danger.

[mwillems]

The new rear wing would've been the optimal choice regardless, but they didn't want to risk damaging more of them. Given how treacherous the quali and race were, probably the right call.

The old spec rear wing was enough to get Lando and Oscar P2/P3 on the grid if both did decent laps. Lando did an alright lap but oscar didn't and that was that. You don't need the straight-line speed for overtaking if you're expecting to start very high up the grid really (p2-p5). It was impossible to forecast the situation that has both Oscar and Lando out of the top 10 on lap 5 stuck behind with the draggier RW. Plus that new wing is more efficient but also produces less df so in the wetter conditions might've struggled a bit more which was when the car seemed already a bit weaker compared to its rivals like Merc

We needed straight line speed to maintain position though. Imagine if we couldnt get past cars when we had DRS, how we'd defend against cars when we don't... we were second fastest in qualy conditions but in race there is more to do yet. I think it would have been hard to get a podium.

Still loving the competitiveness though.

It depends on the circuit layout, yes top speed will definitely help, but if it is at the cost of more tire degradation or simply lower downforce that allows your rivals to be very close before a DRS activation zone, it doesn’t matter how much more top speed you have (without DRS)… On the other hand, if you have more DF and can build a gap in the middle sector for example or build a delta close to the DRS zone, then you may be completely out of danger.

All true and RB championed sacrificing some top speed for DF. But at this track we would have been caught in the corners before the DRS zones as they were also a weakness so I think unlikely we were going to keep 2nd.

Top 6 was always the position I'd be content with. 4th was a reasonable ask if all went well. The Merc seemed faster than us for a start. AM might be slower over a lap but as soon as they have DRS they'd get by and we wouldn't get them back.

[SmallSoldier]

We needed straight line speed to maintain position though. Imagine if we couldnt get past cars when we had DRS, how we'd defend against cars when we don't... we were second fastest in qualy conditions but in race there is more to do yet. I think it would have been hard to get a podium.

Still loving the competitiveness though.

It depends on the circuit layout, yes top speed will definitely help, but if it is at the cost of more tire degradation or simply lower downforce that allows your rivals to be very close before a DRS activation zone, it doesn’t matter how much more top speed you have (without DRS)… On the other hand, if you have more DF and can build a gap in the middle sector for example or build a delta close to the DRS zone, then you may be completely out of danger.

All true and RB championed sacrificing some top speed for DF. But at this track we would have been caught in the corners before the DRS zones as they were also a weakness so I think unlikely we were going to keep 2nd.

Top 6 was always the position I'd be content with. 4th was a reasonable ask if all went well. The Merc seemed faster than us for a start. AM might be slower over a lap but as soon as they have DRS they'd get by and we wouldn't get them back.

I agree that top 6 was a reasonable target… We know though that races rarely go according to plan, lol… But yes, I agree that Mercedes seem to have more pace… I’m not that sure about AMR comparatively, I believe that McLaren might have slightly more pace than them.

The reality is that the car has improved a lot, but it hasn’t fixed all it’s weaknesses and until the top speed is on par, overtaking will always be difficult… Been said that, when the car was in free air, it had very strong pace.

[MrGapes]

Not sure it was that much of a delay judging by this. Not sure what Lopez was looking at...

No yeah this was pretty much live, I saw Lando flip the radio switch on. The funny part was during this message he is literally being passed left and right by inter runners

[mwillems]

It depends on the circuit layout, yes top speed will definitely help, but if it is at the cost of more tire degradation or simply lower downforce that allows your rivals to be very close before a DRS activation zone, it doesn’t matter how much more top speed you have (without DRS)… On the other hand, if you have more DF and can build a gap in the middle sector for example or build a delta close to the DRS zone, then you may be completely out of danger.

All true and RB championed sacrificing some top speed for DF. But at this track we would have been caught in the corners before the DRS zones as they were also a weakness so I think unlikely we were going to keep 2nd.

Top 6 was always the position I'd be content with. 4th was a reasonable ask if all went well. The Merc seemed faster than us for a start. AM might be slower over a lap but as soon as they have DRS they'd get by and we wouldn't get them back.

I agree that top 6 was a reasonable target… We know though that races rarely go according to plan, lol… But yes, I agree that Mercedes seem to have more pace… I’m not that sure about AMR comparatively, I believe that McLaren might have slightly more pace than them.

The reality is that the car has improved a lot, but it hasn’t fixed all it’s weaknesses and until the top speed is on par, overtaking will always be difficult… Been said that, when the car was in free air, it had very strong pace.

Clean air is by and large Qualifying, dirty air is racing, and we do seem to be a bit better on Saturday. It feels like AM might close the gap in the race, but not often enough I'd wager.

I am curious about this low speed corner issue. This V shape they need to take in the shorter corners to avoid the understeer we see in the longer corners feels like their is some physical behavior the car can't cope with, possibly relating to the tyres.

[Mostlyeels]

Did anyone notice that, on the restart, Piastri had a couple of big moments after being passed? Looked a lot like in the old days when a car would move out of the slipstream, but I'm guessing just cold tyres?

[MrGapes]

Hi guys,
do you think Monza will be suitable for McLaren?

Monza is a unique circuit, with quite a distinct DF package, so I always find it very difficult to predict competitiveness. We really haven’t run a low DF configuration this season either, some have already trialed possible versions at SPA, the main question is around aero efficiency. Last year if I compare the MCL36 to the RB18 and F175, it had marginal losses on the straights but lost chunks in every corner. The last two DF configurations suggest the straight line is certainly better (the RB may still gain under DRS) but mostly even, but levels of efficiency differ from DF package. The big positive as it has been historically, there is very little track weaknesses, the only one I can think of is traction out of the first chicane, and the track plays to McLaren’s strength, Variante Ascari and Parabolica are two high speed sections that lead to important straights (over the last few years the car can both overtake and defend cause it’s able to stretch its advantage through the high speed before the main straight).

I honestly have zero clue, but will be very interesting to see the cornering numbers, and good test for the aero. efficiency.

[BMMR61]

Relative speeds of the cars behind RB were very mixed today. Not just dampness of track was changing the competitiveness across the board, a little like (though much less than) you see Haas lose relative pace quickly through any race. My point is that today was completely useless for determining relative competitiveness around Zandvoort - because Zandvoort and other factors were changing so much. I thought it obvious that one Aston was really the second fastest car, one Ferrari (on fresh rubber) was pretty decent behind it, both McLarens were a fraction behind with Mercedes coming on as expected with their low tyre deg overall - equal with McLaren though not linear. Considering one of our tyre characteristics has been fast warm up, slightly high deg, these things kind of jived with what we have seen since the upgrades. Oscar on fresh softs was instantly setting fastest laps before running out of steam behind more slippery cars. I see no reason to believe both drivers wouldn't have been fighting for P3 - P6. The pitwall will be feeling pretty sore about the missed opportunities.

[PikeStance]

Strategy errors. We just need to be better.


Coach Mora summs it up perfectly.




The team would go on to win 9 straight.

[Darth-Piekus]

They had the ability to double stack them in the first rain as Oscar was behind some seconds. It's a pity they screwed up the strategy there but what done is done. Onwards to Monza and see what Low DF set up they bring.

OMG can someone do a count of how many times he's mentioned the strategy mistake??!

Edit: Why don't you put all your complaints in your signature, to save typing them out each time?

Be careful mate, you’ll be accused of personal attacks 🫣

You both feel triggered. Get a snickers.You arent you when you're hungry.