2023 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

[Xyz22]

The main losses for LEC came from della roggia chicane. SAI nailed the chicane where he gained over a tenth on both LEC and VER. SAI either had a very distant tow, or is running less fw flap (which is more likely the case IMO)since he had a 2-3kph adavantage on the straights. Not a crazy amount.

With a clean roggia chicane LEC would've been on pole by 2 tenths as he gained over a tenth back through parabolica. SAI did just enough to secure the lap.

https://ibb.co/2qWzMQr

Check the gap between a corner exit and the end of the relative straight. Sainz gained time every time, and that can't be fully explained by a better exit.

When you sum up everything, the difference is over 0.15s

I think Scuderia Brandon's point about the front wing flap settings is a good one. We have also observed this "phenomenon" at RB. Perez always 2-3 km/h faster than Verstappen on the straights at many circuits. It makes sense that more front wing angle (preferred for Verstappen, Leclerc), is draggier.

Both drivers have a new engine and I dont think that Sainz had a mode that Leclerc did not (unless we later find Leclerc was told the wrong setting ). Of course Sainz might have had the slightest of slip streams as well.

In fact i was joking because clearly engines modes were the same. You guys underestimate the difference of 3-4 kph over a long straight like Monza. As a matter of fact at the end of the first straight (before the first chicane) Sainz already had an advantage of 0.057 on Leclerc. If that can be explained by different flaps settings, i have no idea.

It's super clear in this graph. Again when you sum up all the time lost by Lec in the straights we are looking at something around 0.15s

[scuderiabrandon]

Check the gap between a corner exit and the end of the relative straight. Sainz gained time every time, and that can't be fully explained by a better exit.

When you sum up everything, the difference is over 0.15s

I think Scuderia Brandon's point about the front wing flap settings is a good one. We have also observed this "phenomenon" at RB. Perez always 2-3 km/h faster than Verstappen on the straights at many circuits. It makes sense that more front wing angle (preferred for Verstappen, Leclerc), is draggier.

Both drivers have a new engine and I dont think that Sainz had a mode that Leclerc did not (unless we later find Leclerc was told the wrong setting ). Of course Sainz might have had the slightest of slip streams as well.

In fact i was joking because clearly engines modes were the same. You guys underestimate the difference of 3-4 kph over a long straight like Monza. As a matter of fact at the end of the first straight (before the first chicane) Sainz already had an advantage of 0.057 on Leclerc. If that can be explained by different flaps settings, i have no idea.

It's super clear in this graph. Again when you sum up all the time lost by Lec in the straights we are looking at something around 0.15s

https://storage.googleapis.com/fp-media ... ISON-1.jpg

That's exactly why I was suggesting a fw flap difference. Carrying a bit more drag over a longer distance could also be exaggerated at Monza. This choice could bare fruit in the race by protecting the fronts through lesmos/ascari/parabolica.

[Juzh]

Also not correct, if you are slower you take longer which means you are deployed for longer and use more battery

The faster you go the more battery you use, always been like that. Before 2017 there was very little talk of clipping because cars were simply too slow to use up much more than needed of battery juice, then after 2017 clipping became much more obvious as cars were using up the charge maintaining higher corner speed.

[dialtone]

Also not correct, if you are slower you take longer which means you are deployed for longer and use more battery

The faster you go the more battery you use, always been like that. Before 2017 there was very little talk of clipping because cars were simply too slow to use up much more than needed of battery juice, then after 2017 clipping became much more obvious as cars were using up the charge maintaining higher corner speed.

Not when we're talking about having to brake more to go through a corner and then having a short straight in front into another corner, where you are again slower, and then another short straight into a corner where you again are slower and through out each of these straights you are slower and stay more deployed.

If we were talking about a long straight I'd be with you, but not in the case I describe in my post.

[jambuka]

How are both cars looking in long runs, especially in FP3? With Charles saying he just copied Carlos' setup today, either both got setup for Quali or long run. Long run data from FP3?

[Xyz22]

Albano came up with a similar number to mine. According to him, Sainz advantage in the straights accounted for almost 0.2s, in small part explained by a better exit out of some corners.

[avantman]

Albano came up with a similar number to mine. According to him, Sainz advantage in the straights accounted for almost 0.2s, in small part explained by a better exit out of some corners.

the numbers on the graph above show Leclerc is anything but a 'short corner driver'. Verstappen is and Sainz is much closer to him than Leclerc, contrary to what Formula 1 propagandist Peter Windsor says.
Max is cornering for just 15% of the lap, 74.3% of the lap at full throttle. Carlos cornering for 16.9% , at full throttle for 72% and Charles numbers are 19.3% and 70.9%. Isn't that why Charles looks so much better in the corners gaining lap time on Sainz and then losing on the straights, that are simply always longer for him, he spends less time at full throttle.
Great data and the graph, thanks!

[dialtone]

This is the race sim from FP3, SAI and LEC are the same so not 0.4s off, from here it would appear Ferrari had the better pace compared to RedBull but we don't know the fuel load.

[AR3-GP]

https://i.imgur.com/SgpulLx.png

This is the race sim from FP3, SAI and LEC are the same so not 0.4s off, from here it would appear Ferrari had the better pace compared to RedBull but we don't know the fuel load.

Ferrari's race sims are definitely on lower fuel here. It's easy to tell by looking at the race pace from last year which was low 26, high to mid 25 on full fuel for Verstappen and low 26 for Leclerc. High 24s is way too quick for a 1st stint. Pole today was slower than last year so it's not like the cars are way faster than last year.

My guess is RB did a 1st stint (54 laps fuel), and Ferrari did an end of race stint (20-25 laps fuel). Rb's pace in your graph correlates well with stint 1 race pace from last year. Ferrari likely want to see they can go to the soft tire for the final stint.

[organic]

https://i.imgur.com/SgpulLx.png

This is the race sim from FP3, SAI and LEC are the same so not 0.4s off, from here it would appear Ferrari had the better pace compared to RedBull but we don't know the fuel load.

If you include other teams' race sims you'll see RB are like 4th quickest team in those.. so unless you believe that will occur on Sunday I wouldn't put much weight in rb's long run times

The race sim of Ferrari looked good, but moreso because they had good gaps to teams other than RB on what are more likely to be comparable programs

[dialtone]

https://i.imgur.com/SgpulLx.png

This is the race sim from FP3, SAI and LEC are the same so not 0.4s off, from here it would appear Ferrari had the better pace compared to RedBull but we don't know the fuel load.

If you include other teams' race sims you'll see RB are like 4th quickest team in those.. so unless you believe that will occur on Sunday I wouldn't put much weight in rb's long run times

The race sim of Ferrari looked good, but moreso because they had good gaps to teams other than RB on what are more likely to be comparable programs

Yeah I don’t believe Ferrari to be faster by 0.8s per lap

[jambuka]

https://i.imgur.com/SgpulLx.png

This is the race sim from FP3, SAI and LEC are the same so not 0.4s off, from here it would appear Ferrari had the better pace compared to RedBull but we don't know the fuel load.

Ferrari's race sims are definitely on lower fuel here. It's easy to tell by looking at the race pace from last year which was low 26, high to mid 25 on full fuel for Verstappen and low 26 for Leclerc. High 24s is way too quick for a 1st stint. Pole today was slower than last year so it's not like the cars are way faster than last year.

My guess is RB did a 1st stint (54 laps fuel), and Ferrari did an end of race stint (20-25 laps fuel). Rb's pace in your graph correlates well with stint 1 race pace from last year. Ferrari likely want to see they can go to the soft tire for the final stint.

Interesting, why would Ferrari do race sims on lower fuel load ? Isn't car performance, degradation and consistency their biggest issue on high fuel?

[AR3-GP]

https://i.imgur.com/SgpulLx.png

This is the race sim from FP3, SAI and LEC are the same so not 0.4s off, from here it would appear Ferrari had the better pace compared to RedBull but we don't know the fuel load.

Ferrari's race sims are definitely on lower fuel here. It's easy to tell by looking at the race pace from last year which was low 26, high to mid 25 on full fuel for Verstappen and low 26 for Leclerc. High 24s is way too quick for a 1st stint. Pole today was slower than last year so it's not like the cars are way faster than last year.

My guess is RB did a 1st stint (54 laps fuel), and Ferrari did an end of race stint (20-25 laps fuel). Rb's pace in your graph correlates well with stint 1 race pace from last year. Ferrari likely want to see they can go to the soft tire for the final stint.

Interesting, why would Ferrari do race sims on lower fuel load ? Isn't car performance, degradation and consistency their biggest issue on high fuel?

Ferrari already did higher fuel runs yesterday. A "race simulation" can involve a simulation any part of the race: beginning, middle, or end.

[Xyz22]

https://x.com/formuladdict/status/16981 ... sKmlITLIhQ

Huge difference in the straights as highlighted yesterday.

[search]

Ferrari's race sims are definitely on lower fuel here. It's easy to tell by looking at the race pace from last year which was low 26, high to mid 25 on full fuel for Verstappen and low 26 for Leclerc. High 24s is way too quick for a 1st stint. Pole today was slower than last year so it's not like the cars are way faster than last year.

most likely, yeah. But it's still an interesting run, also because Perez suffered from much higher degradation, although his laps were a couple of laps younger.

Mercedes did a longrun as well in FP3, btw, and was around 2 tenths behind Ferrari. Maybe their fuel load was more comparable.