TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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The Federation focused especially on that area of connection between the nose and the front wing , on which other teams believe that Aston Martin had to change something during the season, as well as on the area of connection between the endplate and the flaps but also between the flaps themselves, where teams always try to seek stall by dynamically closing the slots between one profile and another. However, the new DT018 is not only related to the front wing as we also talk about the connection of the elements making up the rear wing,such as the mobile wing and the mainplane, to the side bulkheads. The FIA then refers to how the beam wing is connected to the wing endplates, to the crash structure and/or to the (mono) pylon, as well as how the latter is attached to the rear impact structure. The technical directive also mentions areas of the bottom, the plank and its related slots (the board underneath the bottom is made up of several pieces), as well as those joints with pins that allow relative rotation on an axis. This also led to an update of the famous, and very impactful for Ferrari, technical directive 039-22.
https://formu1a.uno/retroscena-da-una-c ... tive/?s=09

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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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https://www.fia.com/news/fia-insights-f ... olutionary

This is from the FIA themselves about TD018. Nice to have a bit more transparency.
At this weekend’s FIA Formula 1 Singapore Grand Prix, the FIA is introducing a new Technical Directive regarding the aerodynamic influence offered by particular components, and while directives are advisory and do not constitute Technical Regulations, they form a key element of the Federation’s application of the rules – providing clarity, ensuring compliance and promoting fairness.

In the case of TD018, the clarity is provided around bodywork design details and in particular front and rear wings that according to FIA Single Seater Technical Director Tim Goss “try to get the most out of the boundaries that exist within the regulations”.

“There are a lot of clever engineers out there looking to get the most out of the regulations and we have to make sure that everyone has a common understanding of where the boundaries are and we have to be fair and balanced across the whole group in how we apply them,” he says. “And in recent times we have seen a little bit too much freedom being applied to the design details of aerodynamic components.”

In the new directive, Goss says that the FIA became aware of a number of cases where bodywork designs (in particular, front and rear wing designs), comply with the requirements of Article 3.15 of the Technical Regulations, governing Aerodynamic Component Flexibility, but which could be deemed to contravene the provisions of Article 3.2.2, because they “exploit regions of purposely designed localised compliance and/or relative motion between adjacent components”.
In layman’s terms, as Goss explains, it means that clearer guidance around how components are joined together needed to be given.

“For us, the important bit of Article 3.2.2 is that ‘all aerodynamic components or bodywork, influencing the car’s aerodynamic performance must be rigidly secured and immobile with respect to their frame of reference and that they must make use a uniform, solid, hard, continuous surface under all circumstances’,” he explains. “Now, quite clearly things cannot be totally rigid. So, we have a range of load deflection tests that define how much elements can bend and we've evolved those tests to represent what the teams are trying to achieve on track and to put a sensible limit on them. We play by those rules, while teams look to exploit the allowance in terms of deflection. That’s normal. So the TD is just about making sure that we, the FIA, and the teams, all have a common understanding of where we will draw the line in terms of these design details.”

And according to TD018 that line now exists at point where “regardless of conformity with the load tests defined in Article 3.15 [the FIA] would consider any design which uses the relative motion between adjacent components of mechanisms in order to maximise aerodynamic deformation to be in breach of Article 3.2.2. “What we don't want to see,” says Goss, “as an example, is that the joint of a rear beam wing and an end plate is decoupled in any way such that it rotates about a pivot there, or that it can move laterally or up and down.”
Advisories such as the one being made this weekend often stem from questions being asked about the legality of one team’s car by a rival, but in the case of TD018, Goss explains that guidance is being issued in response to a broader recognition that more clarity was needed.

“It's not that we've seen any one particular car or feature that we've targeted, or an element that's been common across the whole grid,” he says. “This is about where front and rear wing elements join the nose, join the rear impact structure, join the rear wing endplates. And there have been several instances where teams have tried to make the most of the deflection allowance by permitting some bits and pieces to start moving relative to each other. And if you've allowed one piece to be decoupled relative to another, the bodywork might have to have some degree of local flexibility at that location. And if there is local flexibility, we’re saying, clearly, that's not compliant with being uniform, solid, hard and continuous. Under the TD, we have included various examples, designs which we consider are not permitted and exceptions which we consider are permitted.”
To illustrate the grid-wide need for clarity, the FIA technical department issued a draft version of the directive to teams, asking for further feedback before finalising the advisory.

“With matters such as this we issue the TD in draft form,” explains Goss. “We've been speaking to some teams for several weeks where we believed there was a need for clarity, and then issued our proposal to all teams asking for feedback by the 29th of August. We then spoke again in Monza, about design details, where teams were asking us about examples. It’s just a matter of fairness to everyone, making sure we all have that common understanding, and that everyone knows how we are going to operate from a given date.”

To ensure further transparency going forward the FIA is to also begin requesting additional drawings of the structural designs of areas of concern.

“Teams have to submit designs at the moment, they upload lots of information but now they will have to upload structural connections and that in itself helps to self-police it.”

And ultimately, the FIA Single-Seater Technical Director says that advisories such as Technical Directive 018 are a hugely important mechanism through which the F1’s rulemaker can effectively and progressively guarantee fairness.

“This Technical Directive is an example of where ourselves and the teams work together to try and make sure that we have a common understanding and it is a huge positive,” he says. “It's not simple, but if we can evolve that understanding in a sensible, considered way then I think we’re going in the right direction.”

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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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Haas nosecone shows two wing attachment bosses per side.

Image

RB18 with similar treatment:

Image

MCL36 uses flanges and also bolts through underside:
SmallSoldier wrote:
24 Aug 2022, 18:54
MCL36 front wing attachment points in the nosecone (from Spa):

Image

Via: Albert Fabrega
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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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organic wrote:
13 Sep 2023, 22:42
“We've been speaking to some teams for several weeks where we believed there was a need for clarity, and then issued our proposal to all teams asking for feedback by the 29th of August..... It’s just a matter of fairness to everyone”
FIA wants fairness for everyone, but gives some teams a head start :roll:

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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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who generally get impacted with this TD change? AM is sure and they have update to cover it this weekend. shall we know who else? will it really cause any performance issue?

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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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The question is, what's an impact? If a team is a tenth slower due to the TDs, who will ever notice?
AMR obviously went wide over the limit, so they had to change their FW already before Singapore. No such story about an other team popped up - so I doubt a big effect...

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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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Are there already new frontwings around? If they rework them it should be visible....and today is the day?
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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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AR3-GP
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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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Well I think RB will struggle to get out of Q1 but it may be wishful thinking on my part. :lol:
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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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The best estimate around at the moment anyway is 0.1-0.2s/lap which is not enough to bridge the gap, although if this forces RBR to run less wing it might help bridge the gap in tire wear which could net out bigger than above through the race distance.

Anyway they'll still win handily.
Last edited by CMSMJ1 on 14 Sep 2023, 22:17, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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dialtone wrote:
14 Sep 2023, 18:30
The best estimate around at the moment anyway is 0.1-0.2s/lap which is not enough to bridge the gap, although if this forces RBR to run less wing it might help bridge the gap in tire wear which could net out bigger than above through the race distance.
For front wing flex? We still don't know who was targeted by the TD aside from AMR.
Last edited by CMSMJ1 on 14 Sep 2023, 22:17, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Remove off topic
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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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Cost cap isn't this thread.. So trimmed a touch
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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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Cs98 wrote:
13 Sep 2023, 11:20
PlatinumZealot wrote:
13 Sep 2023, 03:00
For all we know Ferrari likely had solid fuel impregnated ablative pistons! No one knows.

Anyway..

On the aero, Tombazis is saying that the teams are playing with what should be solid mounting points, to makem act as slides, hinges or levers. Do you remember in the 2010's when the front wing mounts could split apart to aid bendy wings? Think of this but on a much smaller scale.

We already know that Apline has a wobly wing, and RedBull has a rear wing endplates that are basicaly rudders... We have seen so many hints... The big one I think is the mounting in the floors. The floor skin is very shallow in certain places... And the metal bracket part has some sort of mechanism to it.... Well.. My suspiscions at least.
:lol: The rudder thing you just made up, no one has heard that before. As far as "metal bracket mechanisms". Yeah, the mechanism is called supporting the floor edge, copied by most teams.
Ahem!!

RedBull in 7th and 8th. Drivers complaining of poor braking and rear grip! It's obvious now that they have been hit the hardest by this TD.
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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
16 Sep 2023, 02:47
Cs98 wrote:
13 Sep 2023, 11:20
PlatinumZealot wrote:
13 Sep 2023, 03:00
For all we know Ferrari likely had solid fuel impregnated ablative pistons! No one knows.

Anyway..

On the aero, Tombazis is saying that the teams are playing with what should be solid mounting points, to makem act as slides, hinges or levers. Do you remember in the 2010's when the front wing mounts could split apart to aid bendy wings? Think of this but on a much smaller scale.

We already know that Apline has a wobly wing, and RedBull has a rear wing endplates that are basicaly rudders... We have seen so many hints... The big one I think is the mounting in the floors. The floor skin is very shallow in certain places... And the metal bracket part has some sort of mechanism to it.... Well.. My suspiscions at least.
:lol: The rudder thing you just made up, no one has heard that before. As far as "metal bracket mechanisms". Yeah, the mechanism is called supporting the floor edge, copied by most teams.
Ahem!!

RedBull in 7th and 8th. Drivers complaining of poor braking and rear grip! It's obvious now that they have been hit the hardest by this TD.
A little bit too early to tell yet

AR3-GP
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Re: TD018 2023 - clampdown on flexible wings

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
16 Sep 2023, 02:47
Cs98 wrote:
13 Sep 2023, 11:20
PlatinumZealot wrote:
13 Sep 2023, 03:00
For all we know Ferrari likely had solid fuel impregnated ablative pistons! No one knows.

Anyway..

On the aero, Tombazis is saying that the teams are playing with what should be solid mounting points, to makem act as slides, hinges or levers. Do you remember in the 2010's when the front wing mounts could split apart to aid bendy wings? Think of this but on a much smaller scale.

We already know that Apline has a wobly wing, and RedBull has a rear wing endplates that are basicaly rudders... We have seen so many hints... The big one I think is the mounting in the floors. The floor skin is very shallow in certain places... And the metal bracket part has some sort of mechanism to it.... Well.. My suspiscions at least.
:lol: The rudder thing you just made up, no one has heard that before. As far as "metal bracket mechanisms". Yeah, the mechanism is called supporting the floor edge, copied by most teams.
Ahem!!

RedBull in 7th and 8th. Drivers complaining of poor braking and rear grip! It's obvious now that they have been hit the hardest by this TD.
Yes, PZ.
A lion must kill its prey.