2023 Qatar Grand Prix - Lusail, Oct 06 - 08

[TFSA]

Don't remember, regardless what happened in Austria it should be in real time.

Ver wasn't even close to TL in T12 on his fastest lap.

We're unlikely to get an automated track limits system in F1 that works reliably in every condition.

Camera based solutions with AI requires high placed cameras, and is likely to face challenges with adverse weather condition or cars going side by side.

Sensors are an unlikely solution because it's a high cost of install, and because F1 cars differ in sizes, and even change in size from year to year. It can work for a spec series where all cars are the same dimensions, but I doubt they will ever get it reliably working for F1.

[DDopey]

The much simpler solution is to let drivers feel the track limits. Their problem at Lusail and Austria was they could not see or feel the track limits.

[scuderiabrandon]

gravel or grass will solve this issue instantly

[PlatinumZealot]

Don't remember, regardless what happened in Austria it should be in real time.

Ver wasn't even close to TL in T12 on his fastest lap.

We're unlikely to get an automated track limits system in F1 that works reliably in every condition.

Camera based solutions with AI requires high placed cameras, and is likely to face challenges with adverse weather condition or cars going side by side.

Sensors are an unlikely solution because it's a high cost of install, and because F1 cars differ in sizes, and even change in size from year to year. It can work for a spec series where all cars are the same dimensions, but I doubt they will ever get it reliably working for F1.

A vision sensor on the car's wing mirrors should be cheap and easy.

[PlatinumZealot]

Another cool idea is a strip that fouls/abrades the cars tyres placed one half car width out from the track.

[AR3-GP]

Another cool idea is a strip that fouls/abrades the cars tyres placed one half car width out from the track.

If you mean "physically damages the tire"...they tried that...it led to 18 lap stints

If you mean a substance which leaves residue on the tire, then what happens when it rains?

[TFSA]

A vision sensor on the car's wing mirrors should be cheap and easy.

Won't work. Requires that the mirrors be placed as far out as the edge of the tire, which they currently aren't by a substantial margin. Would also be affected by adverse weather, and any damage to the mirror would undermine the system. Would also likely contribute to more dirty air.

As i said, it's a tough challenge to crack. If it was easy, I'm confident F1 would have done it a long time ago.

[DDopey]

Another cool idea is a strip that fouls/abrades the cars tyres placed one half car width out from the track.

If you mean "physically damages the tire"...they tried that...it led to 18 lap stints

If you mean a substance which leaves residue on the tire, then what happens when it rains?

It doesn’t have to, a heightened line would be enough.

[PlatinumZealot]

A vision sensor on the car's wing mirrors should be cheap and easy.

Won't work. Requires that the mirrors be placed as far out as the edge of the tire, which they currently aren't by a substantial margin. Would also be affected by adverse weather, and any damage to the mirror would undermine the system. Would also likely contribute to more dirty air.

As i said, it's a tough challenge to crack. If it was easy, I'm confident F1 would have done it a long time ago.

The mirrors themselves dont have to be placed far out at all, just the lenses. On a road car the widest thinga are the mirrors, in F1 these are kept inboard which is actually very unusual!

[chrisc90]

Just had this pop up this morning.

[chrisc90]

I can only think that it will highlight the dangers of crossing a live race track. Maybe there have been other incidents in lower series/motorsport in general and the FIA are going to use Lewis' 'role model status' to highlight those dangers to the lower leagues.

[taperoo2k]

Don't remember, regardless what happened in Austria it should be in real time.

Ver wasn't even close to TL in T12 on his fastest lap.

We're unlikely to get an automated track limits system in F1 that works reliably in every condition.

Camera based solutions with AI requires high placed cameras, and is likely to face challenges with adverse weather condition or cars going side by side.

Sensors are an unlikely solution because it's a high cost of install, and because F1 cars differ in sizes, and even change in size from year to year. It can work for a spec series where all cars are the same dimensions, but I doubt they will ever get it reliably working for F1.

A vision sensor on the car's wing mirrors should be cheap and easy.

The low tech solution would be to have gravel traps and grass in the right places to discourage drivers from abusing
track limits. You'd need to make a sensor pretty much bullet proof to survive the rigors of an F1 race, alongside keeping the latency low so the FIA can judge track limits in real time allowing for error correction. I think the teams would rather use AI for developing cars.

[napoleon1981]

A vision sensor on the car's wing mirrors should be cheap and easy.

Won't work. Requires that the mirrors be placed as far out as the edge of the tire, which they currently aren't by a substantial margin. Would also be affected by adverse weather, and any damage to the mirror would undermine the system. Would also likely contribute to more dirty air.

As i said, it's a tough challenge to crack. If it was easy, I'm confident F1 would have done it a long time ago.

The mirrors themselves dont have to be placed far out at all, just the lenses. On a road car the widest thinga are the mirrors, in F1 these are kept inboard which is actually very unusual!

If we compare roadcars to f1 cars, there is more stuff on unusual....

[PlatinumZealot]

We're unlikely to get an automated track limits system in F1 that works reliably in every condition.

Camera based solutions with AI requires high placed cameras, and is likely to face challenges with adverse weather condition or cars going side by side.

Sensors are an unlikely solution because it's a high cost of install, and because F1 cars differ in sizes, and even change in size from year to year. It can work for a spec series where all cars are the same dimensions, but I doubt they will ever get it reliably working for F1.

A vision sensor on the car's wing mirrors should be cheap and easy.

The low tech solution would be to have gravel traps and grass in the right places to discourage drivers from abusing
track limits. You'd need to make a sensor pretty much bullet proof to survive the rigors of an F1 race, alongside keeping the latency low so the FIA can judge track limits in real time allowing for error correction. I think the teams would rather use AI for developing cars.

You wouldn't need high level AI really. I think AI wasTFSA's suggestion. Talking about plain jane vision technology from the early 2000's.

Cameras also don't need to be mpunted on the mirrors if the system is extremely precise but the use of the mirror mount is to track outside tyre deformation. A 3D point map of the track borders can be captured minutes before the race via the saftey car and used as reference in a computer. This computer takes vision and gps data from all the cars to monitor excursions. What is nice about this system is that you can program it to determine if a lasting advantage was gained...

[PlatinumZealot]

We're unlikely to get an automated track limits system in F1 that works reliably in every condition.

Camera based solutions with AI requires high placed cameras, and is likely to face challenges with adverse weather condition or cars going side by side.

Sensors are an unlikely solution because it's a high cost of install, and because F1 cars differ in sizes, and even change in size from year to year. It can work for a spec series where all cars are the same dimensions, but I doubt they will ever get it reliably working for F1.

A vision sensor on the car's wing mirrors should be cheap and easy.

The low tech solution would be to have gravel traps and grass in the right places to discourage drivers from abusing
track limits. You'd need to make a sensor pretty much bullet proof to survive the rigors of an F1 race, alongside keeping the latency low so the FIA can judge track limits in real time allowing for error correction. I think the teams would rather use AI for developing cars.

Low tech is ideal but FIA seems to want the cars not to careen off into the distance or get stuck for some reason. They like the cars to keep circulating so it's about finding that sweet spot of gravel that disadvantages but doesn't incapcitate.