SmallSoldier wrote: ↑21 Oct 2023, 20:54
mwillems wrote: ↑21 Oct 2023, 20:44
SmallSoldier wrote: ↑21 Oct 2023, 20:39
That’s a very valid point… Been said that, keep in mind that on race pace, getting on the power is less of a struggle since you are not on the edge (specially during tire management phases)… I also would be careful making an assessment based on what Mercedes for example may be doing in terms of rear wing, the way the cars generate downforce isn’t the same and McLaren may simply be generating more DF than Mercedes from the floor (ergo, the performance of McLaren in S1 and S3 regardless of an apparent smaller rear wing… If the problem is traction out of big braking zones (T1, T11) it’s more related to Mechanical Grip than DF levels (as well as driver input, which also has an impact, different lines, throttle application, what the car allows them to do in terms of rotation, etc)… Just saying that reducing the apparent struggle out of those corners to rear wing level may be flawed.
It's more based on watching the car round the track, but then seeing the success that others can have with more DF.
As for the floors, I've no idea what they generate, but you can see that we aren't happy on a fast lap. But you are right that in the first half of the race tomorrow it will be less of an issue, but in the second half it will be and in the sprint it also will be.
Traction issues at the rear was on exit, not entry, this is what concerns me. We knew that turns 11 & 12 would push us, but typically we have good traction out of the corners and pull it back, but now the car is struggling, which is another indicator that this may just be setup specific.
We just need to be careful deriving conclusions without considering all the variables… Mercedes may have missed the mark from an Aero stand point with this generation of cars, but their mechanical grip has always been top of the class… You are making an assumption that the only variable separating both cars is related to aero, more importantly simply the Rear Wing level without considering all other factors (Suspension Setup, Ride Height, Beam Wing, CoP and the list goes on)… The team has always stated that slow speed is still a weakness of this car and that it won’t fix it until next year, which spells the necessity to address it not only from aero stand point, but from a chassis point of view too.
Look at the telemetry, you will see that “traction” isn’t an issue since the MCL60 gains time against the Mercedes from the beginning of the straight (traction zone of the back straight) all the way until the braking point… It is during the corner itself, that Mercedes gains time.
I think you're getting carried way, it isn't a conclusion, just an opinion and it's a valid one, as there is plenty of evidence to suggest it could be the case. It's also valid to suggest it might not be the case. Typically you'll look at the fastest way round the track and then add your mitigations to ensure it is a durable car still, which would normally but not always retard single lap performance by adding more wing, not often by reducing it.
So it is by no means obvious and clear that the bigger rear wing would help, but it looks to me that this car is struggling at the rear and my prediction is that this is going to become an issue. But it isn't a conclusion as I don't have all the facts, just some data and my own opinion which I'm OK with
But I'm totally open to going to a shop tonight and tomorrow, to buy a hat to eat. Especially if it is made from cake.
Edit: In terms of context of rear traction, it is something that for a large part of the season this car has been one of the best in class so I feel confident in the rear traction of this car from a mechanical aspect, especially in the lowest speed corners where we were some of the fastest on exit. But here we struggled and it is uncharacteristic for this car to struggle on exit.
