Toto Wolff accused of leaking/receiving confidential information

[Luscion]

Guy who has the award has commented and said Lewis most likely thought he was an FIA official,which is believable considering he was also taking pics with Max and held Max's award that was next to Lewis' on the table

[littlebigcat]

Well this is embarrassing for a lot of people. Both in how they have reacted and acted

[Wouter]

Guy who has the award has commented and said Lewis most likely thought he was an FIA official,which is believable considering he was also taking pics with Max and held Max's award that was next to Lewis' on the table

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This is so sad for the student that he believes this! Mercedes didn't make a statement at all about the trophy!!
It was a fairytale from the Race!!
Mercedes didn't say anything on their IG or Twitter/X account about the trophy! It was a fake message from The Race like they did before!! RN 365 took it over from The Race. No one else did because Mercedes didn't say anything about it!!

[mcdenife]

@wouter, have to commend you on some really fancy footwork there!

[Wouter]

@wouter, have to commend you on some really fancy footwork there!

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Thank you sir.

[ValeVida46]

[TFSA]

https://twitter.com/formularacers_/stat ... 0072167712

It's a really stupid argument.

If the FIA hadn't investigated and closed this case within a day, the media would be speculating for weeks about this. This does not do Toto nor Suzie any favors either. Also, the whole "go after my family" argument is just as stupid an argument. She's involved in the business. It's not like he's married to someone who works in an entirely different field.

I feel like I'm repeating myself here, but an investigation is in itself not an accusation - and an investigation in itself does not need evidence to be initiated, unless you're planning to use some heavy handed tools that highly inconvene the subject of the investigation.

In fact, given how the investigation was carried out, you could argue that it was more the FOM who was investigated (since the FIA asked them to clarify what procedures they have in place to prevent confidential information from leaking), and the FIA cleared that there was a problem with their employment of Suzie Wolff within a day.

Now I'll be very clear that I'm speculating now, but i think this is just the teams and Toto/Suzie eyeing an option to wage war on the FIA, despite the fact that they were only doing their job. The guns are still pointed entirely in the wrong direction. But they aren't interesting in waging war on a small slanderous Tabloid, when they can go after the FIA and MSB instead.

I mean, doesn't anyone find it curious that neither Toto nor Suzie has lashed out against BusinessF1 (who started all of this)? I may be wrong of course, but i can't recall reading them saying anything about it. They don't care about going after a small tabloid who writes stupid stuff - at best, that's gonna get them pocket change. They care about gaining leverage on the FIA.

[dans79]

I mean, doesn't anyone find it curious that neither Toto nor Suzie has lashed out against BusinessF1 (who started all of this)? I may be wrong of course, but i can't recall reading them saying anything about it. They don't care about going after a small tabloid who writes stupid stuff - at best, that's gonna get them pocket change. They care about gaining leverage on the FIA.

What I find interesting is how much it unsettles certain members of the forum who support a different team/driver.

[Wouter]

I mean, doesn't anyone find it curious that neither Toto nor Suzie has lashed out against BusinessF1 (who started all of this)? I may be wrong of course, but i can't recall reading them saying anything about it. They don't care about going after a small tabloid who writes stupid stuff - at best, that's gonna get them pocket change. They care about gaining leverage on the FIA.

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What I find interesting is how much it unsettles certain members of the forum who support a different team/driver.

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What I find interesting is how a certain member of the forum sounds like a broken record.

[ValeVida46]

I mean, doesn't anyone find it curious that neither Toto nor Suzie has lashed out against BusinessF1 (who started all of this)? I may be wrong of course, but i can't recall reading them saying anything about it. They don't care about going after a small tabloid who writes stupid stuff - at best, that's gonna get them pocket change. They care about gaining leverage on the FIA.

What I find interesting is how much it unsettles certain members of the forum who support a different team/driver.

Of course. It's Mercedes and Toto. Therefore when it comes to defamation it becomes a "really stupid argument" to reach for the rule of law.
You would have to be pretty dim not to lawyer the hell out of BusinessF1 and then the FIA.

What I'm keen to see is the off the record briefing the FIA gave journalists when breaking the story of the investigation.
Because the rumour has it that Toto and Suzie's names were given to the journos by the FIA.
If that's the case, well MBS has got a very big problem as they're witnesses and cut the court time for defamation cases by 90%.

[ValeVida46]

I feel like I'm repeating myself here, but an investigation is in itself not an accusation - and an investigation in itself does not need evidence to be initiated, unless you're planning to use some heavy handed tools that highly inconvene the subject of the investigation.

You cannot conduct an investigation based on spurious gossip.
Not even the damn police can do that.
You can investigate if you have evidence of wrongdoing. ie rogue email, recording, overbudget accounts, dead body, missing person, missing data, drugs, etc etc...

The one thing a sporting body doesn't do, is go after a team due to a shitrags story.
And if you think they should, be mindful where that leaves this sport.

[TFSA]

You cannot conduct an investigation based on spurious gossip.
Not even the damn police can do that.

Sure they can.

If i call the police and say "It sounds like my neighbors are fighting", and they show up and knock on my neighbors door, that technically qualifies as an investigation, and it's technically based on gossip.

Sure, it's not a heavy handed investigation - it's just a casual investigation. Just like the FIAs inquiry to FOM about their procedures is also just a casual investigation. They only used light investigative tools, because that's what the gossip warranted. They didn't call Toto or Suzie in for an interview, or demanded their private communication. They simply inquired FOM about their preventive measures.

But the point is, that what you're saying is simply not true. Police can absolutely investigate something, even if it's just remotely suspicious. They do it all the time, and as long as they don't use unnecessary measures and brings the SWAT team, then nobody bats an eye. So why is everyone making a big fuss over this? Simple, because the teams and the Wolff couple wants leverage on the FIA

And just to be clear: This is me critiqueing all the teams, not just Mercedes. Toto and Suzie just happened to be the catalyst for this, because of the article. This is clearly just being used as a PR stunt right now, and is an escalation of the war between the teams/FOM and the FIA.

I'm pretty sure that the teams and FOM at this point are just hoping to undermine the FIA and their current president long-term, in order to maximize their own influence on the sport and minimize the FIAs influence.

The one thing a sporting body doesn't do, is go after a team due to a shitrags story.
And if you think they should, be mindful where that leaves this sport.

And i think you should be mindful of what the outlook would be if the FIA completely ignored a potential controversy that was quickly gaining traction in the media.

If Toto and Suzie had set their sights on the real villain here, everyone (including the sport) would all be better off for it.

Of course. It's Mercedes and Toto. Therefore when it comes to defamation it becomes a "really stupid argument" to reach for the rule of law.
You would have to be pretty dim not to lawyer the hell out of BusinessF1 and then the FIA.

BusinessF1: yes. It was a horrible article, and I'm even somewhat ashamed of having started this thread in the first place.

The FIA: No.

It's funny how people keep talking about defamation, but doesn't really understand it. Toto and Suzie have absolutely nothing on the FIA here legally speaking. If you think they do, you might want to talk to a lawyer, who can explain why defamation standards are pretty damned high to begin with.

This will never meet the legal standard. Any court is gonna take a look at this and quickly conclude that the FIA were perfectly entitled to investigate this as the governing body. And Toto/Suzies attempts at "getting to the bottom of this" (as in, who made the inquiry) isn't gonna lead anywhere either, because it's plain and simple whistle-blower protection. If someone reported a concern to the FIA - if anyone did at all, and the FIA didn't decide to investigate this themselves - then they are perfectly allowed to do that anonymously, without having to fear repercussions.

There's a reason that the EU has enacted whistle-blower laws to begin with. Just because someone reported something that involves you, you are not entitled to hunt them down in revenge.

BusinessF1 has a very bad case though. Unless they can provide their sources (if any exists), they are very likely to lose a lawsuit from Mercedes. You simply can't go writing stories like this, if it's complete fabrication.

What I find interesting is how much it unsettles certain members of the forum who support a different team/driver.

What i find interesting is how much certain members of the forum wants to critisize the FIA, despite the fact they were simply doing their job. One might also suggest that someone has an agenda against the FIA.

Pot, meet kettle.

[denyall]

It would have been very easy for the FIA to "investigate" behind closed doors and then issuing their "everything looks good" press release. No one would have been clamoring for an investigation, it took all of 48 hours to conclud their look...

The issue is the very public way that the FIA "announced" the investigation. If they were doing due diligence only it would have been private, but when there is an opportunity to hit a team and FOM politically they took it. It being based on a BS tabloid piece is all the more sting as most people saw that piece for what it was, fabrication.

[TFSA]

It would have been very easy for the FIA to "investigate" behind closed doors and then issuing their "everything looks good" press release. No one would have been clamoring for an investigation, it took all of 48 hours to conclud their look...

Agreed, but they aren't required to. They are entitled to announce they are investigating something. In fact, they should. Most investigations are publicized. Typically, only police investigations are secret. But it's standard practice for companies to publicly announce when they are conducting both internal and external investigations. So again, why the fuss over them doing something that's pretty much standard practice?

Also, you don't know how long an investigation is gonna take. Yes, this one was quickly concluded. But that's not a given. Could be 48 hours. Or 48 days.

The issue is the very public way that the FIA "announced" the investigation. If they were doing due diligence only it would have been private, but when there is an opportunity to hit a team and FOM politically they took it. It being based on a BS tabloid piece is all the more sting as most people saw that piece for what it was, fabrication.

Again, it didn't "hit" anyone. They concluded that everything was in order.

They said they were investigating, and then said "Everything is in order - the FOM has proper procedures in place to ensure information isn't leaked". How is that "hitting the FOM" again? Or Suzie Wolff for that matter. It pretty much clears them of any wrongdoing.

You're simply spinning a false narrative now.

[dans79]

What i find interesting is how much certain members of the forum wants to critisize the FIA, despite the fact they were simply doing their job. One might also suggest that someone has an agenda against the FIA.

Pot, meet kettle.

Might want to try a little harder, I've had an issue with the FIAs stupidity, bias, complacency, and overall uselessness for well over a decade!