2026 F1 Cars - General Thread

[mzso]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GDVSaWPWAAE ... ame=medium


Still too long...

For sure. Despite some claims, I think it's little more than cosmetic.

Can't see it shortening the wheelbase at all - esp when you read the 26 reg about mgu-k placement. The turbo thing might help. IF the wheelbase limit was 400mm shorter then teams would have to make wider/taller fuel cells and a shorter gearbox case. It's achievable. There just has to be a will from the FIA to lay down the law, which given the state of F1 atm might not be wise politically.

They for sure should introduce a (much lower) hard limit. It's not like it's a challenge to design shorter cars. The old turbo cars had double the fuel volume or more and still were a meter shorter.

As for politics, the FIA is just making itself weaker by compromising all the rule changes when it doesn't suit a team or two. They have full rights to write the rules, they should grow up to it...

[mzso]

IF the teams were told, 2026 the weight will be 550kg + 80 for the driver, the teams WOULD deal with it. And with the cost cap, they would all be having the same struggle, but perhaps addressing the issue in different ways. Now there's a cost cap, within reason, the rules can say anything.

The actual problem is that it would undo the last 20 years of trying to get all the teams in the same performance window, as now they have very few choices regarding how to get the car working. The only way to keep the current paradigm is to incrementally reduce the weight year by year. Sort of the reverse of the last 20 years.

Same performance window? That never happened, especially not in 2023. Since 2000 we had long years of utter dominance. Ferrari, Red Bull, Mercedes, Red Bull again. We had two champion teams in the last 15 years... It has never been this bad before.

I think a subset of people have disliked the growing weight and length of cars for 20 years+. I remember complaining that the 2003 cars were too long...

A very large subset.

[mzso]

Let's not forget safety issue as well, imagine battery getting smashed and catching fire in a crash... They don't call it survival cell for nothing

They don't need to use flammable electrolytes. So they don't need to catch fire even if they are punctured.

[Vanja #66]

Hard? For RB? They consistently deliver one of the best cars at least. They were also in on developing the electric parts.

What do strong chassis have to do with hybrid PUs?

They don't need to use flammable electrolytes. So they don't need to catch fire even if they are punctured.

Such as?

[Henk_v]

LiFePo4?

[wuzak]

My personal opinion is that they would be better served by upping the ICE power by ~100hp (increase the energy flow rate by 25%), leaving recovery at 350kW but restricting deployment to 150kW.

And then you could reduce the fuel allowance for the race.

It would be nice if all these simulations were made public so we can see what we are getting.

Or make recovery unlimited and keep the deployment power. That would definitely create a drive for better efficiency.
And create a challenge of light, but (in bursts) high performance motor/generators

Where do you see the reduced fuel allowance coming from?

They would save fuel by not burning it to generate electricity.

Make recovery unlimited in what way?

The 2026 rules have a 9MJ recovery limit per lap, and unlimited deployment. Both at 350kW.

Are you advocating for unlimited energy recovery?

Or unlimited recovery power - which will be limited by the MGU capability.

[FW17]

My personal opinion is that they would be better served by upping the ICE power by ~100hp (increase the energy flow rate by 25%), leaving recovery at 350kW but restricting deployment to 150kW.

And then you could reduce the fuel allowance for the race.

It would be nice if all these simulations were made public so we can see what we are getting.

Or make recovery unlimited and keep the deployment power. That would definitely create a drive for better efficiency.
And create a challenge of light, but (in bursts) high performance motor/generators

Where do you see the reduced fuel allowance coming from?

They would save fuel by not burning it to generate electricity.

Make recovery unlimited in what way?

The 2026 rules have a 9MJ recovery limit per lap, and unlimited deployment. Both at 350kW.

Are you advocating for unlimited energy recovery?

Or unlimited recovery power - which will be limited by the MGU capability.

They should have allowed a front Generator

[Tzk]

They should have allowed a front Generator

Iirc teams were against this. There's no space in front of the drivers feet and the idea of fitting drive shafts (generator in the nose) or heavy uprights (generator on the wheel hub) was quickly abandoned. Too heavy, too bulky.

[Vanja #66]

LiFePo4?

Can we really consider them for high performance applications? How much heavier would they be for the same storage capacity, 30-35%?

[Henk_v]

There are many variations in battery chemistry and construction. Many of them do not contain flammables, catch Fire when pierced or have thermal runaway.

Any F1 battery I assume will be custom made.

For roadgoing vehicles, thermally instable chemistries are slowly being obsoleted. Back when Electric driving was percieved as green, there was acceptance of the increased risk. As Electric driving becomes more mainstream now as a luxury, the risk acceptance is no longer there.

There are already several examples where old Electric cars are not allowed due to the risk of fire.

[mzso]

Hard? For RB? They consistently deliver one of the best cars at least. They were also in on developing the electric parts.

What do strong chassis have to do with hybrid PUs?

They don't need to use flammable electrolytes. So they don't need to catch fire even if they are punctured.

Such as?

I was pointing out that RB doesn't go half-assed on developments.
Also that, as I remeber they were included in the development of the electric side.

There dozens of tested chemistries, usually in the solid state, sulfur cathode realm. Always with higher energy density, than common Li-ion. F1 need not restrict itself to off-the-shelf parts, it didn't use to.

[mzso]

My personal opinion is that they would be better served by upping the ICE power by ~100hp (increase the energy flow rate by 25%), leaving recovery at 350kW but restricting deployment to 150kW.

And then you could reduce the fuel allowance for the race.

It would be nice if all these simulations were made public so we can see what we are getting.

Or make recovery unlimited and keep the deployment power. That would definitely create a drive for better efficiency.
And create a challenge of light, but (in bursts) high performance motor/generators

Where do you see the reduced fuel allowance coming from?

They would save fuel by not burning it to generate electricity.

Make recovery unlimited in what way?

The 2026 rules have a 9MJ recovery limit per lap, and unlimited deployment. Both at 350kW.

Are you advocating for unlimited energy recovery?

Or unlimited recovery power - which will be limited by the MGU capability.

I meant power, no limit on recovery, keep deployment to 350kW. Should eliminate traditional rear brakes as an added benefit.
MGU power would be as high as they choose. (For recovery anyway)

I guess your proposed fuel saving highly depends on how/when they capture and utilize the generated energy.
It could easily be the other way around.

[Tommy Cookers]

I meant ..no limit on recovery, keep deployment to 350kW.

Should eliminate traditional rear brakes as an added benefit.

1500 kW would do that - has the FIA agreed ?

unlikely there would be a gearbox helping the MG as much as the 2014-25 one has

[mzso]

I meant ..no limit on recovery, keep deployment to 350kW.

Should eliminate traditional rear brakes as an added benefit.

1500 kW would do that - has the FIA agreed ?

unlikely there would be a gearbox helping the MG as much as the 2014-25 one has

We're talking hypotheticals, so of course not.

Not sure what you mean about the gearbox.

[wuzak]

I meant ..no limit on recovery, keep deployment to 350kW.

Should eliminate traditional rear brakes as an added benefit.

1500 kW would do that - has the FIA agreed ?

unlikely there would be a gearbox helping the MG as much as the 2014-25 one has

The current PUs and the '26 PUs allow for a "gearbox" between the MGU and crankshaft, but it must be of fixed speed ratio.