2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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f1isgood
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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AR3-GP wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 07:47
"We realised here that our superior performance was no longer," Marko begins to tell German Motorsport-Magazin.com. "We found out that the track temperature was five to six degrees lower and could not translate this one-to-one to the performance of the tyres. We worked on that for two practice days and eventually the Max factor came."

It is always the tires.

https://www.gpblog.com/en/news/262460/m ... orner.html
Need to wait for more races to judge true gains then. I think it is between 7 tenths to a second. But we shall see.

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Vanja #66
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Comparing 22, 23 and 24 RB cars was more intriguing than Ferrari, so I'll share an interesting finding here. While Top speeds are about the same, 24 car has a minimal advantage on T3-4 and T10-11 straights. I'd dare say it was harvesting more on SF straight than previous years and RB20 is the lowest-drag-car of the 3 of them.

A peculiar thing happens in T11 and T13, RB20 was notably slower than RB19. Max's pole lap was actually the best one in those corners, first Q3 lap was as "slow" as RB18 there. However, in T14 the situation was reversed, but it looks more like Max wasn't as fast as possible there last year. All 3 corners are similar in speed, so either wind was particularly affecting RB20 yesterday or the car is slower in medium speed corners now. T4 is oriented differently so wind wasn't having the same effect and is at the same speed range, so this suggests RB20 is slower in that range now. Of course, it is 99% likely setup related, but peculiar nonetheless.

At the same time, there's big gains in T1 and T9, low speed stuff, which suggest the car definitely has a bit different nature here in Bahrain compared to a year ago, we'll need to se Jeddah behaviour to confirm if it's the car or Bahrain-specific setup. T5-6-7 are slightly better now, but T12 is slightly worse, though T12 looks to suffer from lower T11 apex speed, and lower acceleration - so less deployment now than a year ago.

Image
And they call it a stall. A STALL!

#DwarvesAreNaturalSprinters
#BlessYouLaddie

Cassius
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Vanja #66 wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 12:25
Comparing 22, 23 and 24 RB cars was more intriguing than Ferrari, so I'll share an interesting finding here. While Top speeds are about the same, 24 car has a minimal advantage on T3-4 and T10-11 straights. I'd dare say it was harvesting more on SF straight than previous years and RB20 is the lowest-drag-car of the 3 of them.

A peculiar thing happens in T11 and T13, RB20 was notably slower than RB19. Max's pole lap was actually the best one in those corners, first Q3 lap was as "slow" as RB18 there. However, in T14 the situation was reversed, but it looks more like Max wasn't as fast as possible there last year. All 3 corners are similar in speed, so either wind was particularly affecting RB20 yesterday or the car is slower in medium speed corners now. T4 is oriented differently so wind wasn't having the same effect and is at the same speed range, so this suggests RB20 is slower in that range now. Of course, it is 99% likely setup related, but peculiar nonetheless.

At the same time, there's big gains in T1 and T9, low speed stuff, which suggest the car definitely has a bit different nature here in Bahrain compared to a year ago, we'll need to se Jeddah behaviour to confirm if it's the car or Bahrain-specific setup. T5-6-7 are slightly better now, but T12 is slightly worse, though T12 looks to suffer from lower T11 apex speed, and lower acceleration - so less deployment now than a year ago.

https://i.ibb.co/vZ9LpJN/rb.jpg
It is exactly the challenge Waché mentioned. How to keep their mid and high speed corner strengths when trying to improve the low speed. They clearly have improved the low speed but seem to have some balance issues in the medium speed. I am sure they will be able to find a better setup to improve this or fix this with small aero tweaks in the next few races.

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Juzh
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Yeah ~140-180 speed range is not very good. Just not fast enough.

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organic
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Juzh wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 14:37
Yeah ~140-180 speed range is not very good. Just not fast enough.
How much of it is a setup choice

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Juzh
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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organic wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 15:38
Juzh wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 14:37
Yeah ~140-180 speed range is not very good. Just not fast enough.
How much of it is a setup choice
Come to think of it, is RB running with a tad less wing compared to others? They're equal or a smidgen faster than ferrari on straights, which wasnt the case late last year on most occasions.

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organic
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Juzh wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 16:00
organic wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 15:38
Juzh wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 14:37
Yeah ~140-180 speed range is not very good. Just not fast enough.
How much of it is a setup choice
Come to think of it, is RB running with a tad less wing compared to others? They're equal or a smidgen faster than ferrari on straights, which wasnt the case late last year on most occasions.
They're hitting 322kph on straight without a tow. Ferrari at 319kph. Not a lot of difference but not insignificant either.

AR3-GP
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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A rose tinted theory (lol), is that the simulations say this is faster and that they learned that they wouldn’t be able to exploit the Pirelli tire in the high speed corners due to deg, so they traded downforce for straight line speed.

With that said, they aren’t any faster than Ferrari on the non-DRS straights over 1 lap.

The RB20s advantages become even more vague, but the laptimes just say it’s fast.
A lion must kill its prey.

f1isgood
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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AR3-GP wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 16:17
A rose tinted theory (lol), is that the simulations say this is faster and that they learned that they wouldn’t be able to exploit the Pirelli tire in the high speed corners due to deg, so they traded downforce for straight line speed.

With that said, they aren’t any faster than Ferrari on the non-DRS straights over 1 lap.

The RB20s advantages become even more vague, but the laptimes just say it’s fast.
In Bahrain the non DRS straight is the ones in T11 to T15 I believe? The corners leading upto those straights are medium speed and isn't the RB20 relatively slow there? Wouldn't that have a carry-on effect in the rest of the straight as you are entering the corner slower and hence reaching the same speed of Ferrari simply takes a tad longer and therefore efficiency gains become less apparent?

I think RB20 is better in traction zones significantly. Potentially lower drag than the 19. But as of now it looks slower in the low-medium speed corners than the RB19.

AR3-GP
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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f1isgood wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 16:26
AR3-GP wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 16:17
A rose tinted theory (lol), is that the simulations say this is faster and that they learned that they wouldn’t be able to exploit the Pirelli tire in the high speed corners due to deg, so they traded downforce for straight line speed.

With that said, they aren’t any faster than Ferrari on the non-DRS straights over 1 lap.

The RB20s advantages become even more vague, but the laptimes just say it’s fast.
In Bahrain the non DRS straight is the ones in T11 to T15 I believe? The corners leading upto those straights are medium speed and isn't the RB20 relatively slow there? Wouldn't that have a carry-on effect in the rest of the straight as you are entering the corner slower and hence reaching the same speed of Ferrari simply takes a tad longer and therefore efficiency gains become less apparent?

I think RB20 is better in traction zones significantly. Potentially lower drag than the 19. But as of now it looks slower in the low-medium speed corners than the RB19.
Ah that's right. Top speed is similar, but RB is clearly gaining time down all of the straights, DRS or not.
A lion must kill its prey.

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vorticism
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Sevach wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 17:40
Max's pace is just humiliating.
My refrain for a few years has been along the lines of "RB would be on their 4+(CurrentYear-2014) WCC had the NA engines not been phased out." BadForTheSport-ers would have long since moved to NASCAR, variety panel judge shows, Formula E.
𓄀

f1isgood
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Extremely well managed race. Comfortable 1-2. Max also gets a Grand Slam. RB20 is once again a beast in race trim. Well done to the engineers for a risky mini revolution and ensuring it worked out well in the end :).

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organic
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Healthy gap despite huge management. Expect tight quali sessions and some easy wins for Max. Hopefully the lack of 1-lap medium-high speed performance was a decision rather than a trait of the car, but let's see

f1isgood
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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organic wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 19:08
Healthy gap despite huge management. Expect tight quali sessions and some easy wins for Max. Hopefully the lack of 1-lap medium-high speed performance was a decision rather than a trait of the car, but let's see
How did it track in the race? Any idea where Max made up his time today?

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Vettel165
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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f1isgood wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 19:12
organic wrote:
02 Mar 2024, 19:08
Healthy gap despite huge management. Expect tight quali sessions and some easy wins for Max. Hopefully the lack of 1-lap medium-high speed performance was a decision rather than a trait of the car, but let's see
How did it track in the race? Any idea where Max made up his time today?
Sector 2 mostly.

Extremely happy with today. Hopefully that 2024 season is the same as 2013 with Seb dominanting the field. After watching onboard with Max the car looked amazing in low-speed section of the track.