2024 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[Cs98]

The problem is in the design yeah, how do you suggest they figure out what’s wrong if they have correlation issues?

I suggest they try to hoan in on the best performing set-up every weekend, step by step, not getting ahead of themselves. Then try to find the common denominator between the best performing set-ups and apply that knowledge to the simulator. The issue I have is these "experiments" seem more like stabs in the dark. It's trying to take three steps at once and more often than not (if not always) they end up back on square one.

I don’t think you have the data to say their way of experimenting is flawed. They are also certainly doing what you say since Russell is doing it. More tests and more data is always better for analysis.

I would really just wonder why they haven’t found the issue yet, the drivers have no fault here, they are paid to do what the engineers tell them to.

Third year of little to no progress doesn't count?

[Jurgen von Diaz]

The problem is in the design yeah, how do you suggest they figure out what’s wrong if they have correlation issues?

I suggest they try to hoan in on the best performing set-up every weekend, step by step, not getting ahead of themselves. Then try to find the common denominator between the best performing set-ups and apply that knowledge to the simulator. The issue I have is these "experiments" seem more like stabs in the dark. It's trying to take three steps at once and more often than not (if not always) they end up back on square one.

I don’t think you have the data to say their way of experimenting is flawed. They are also certainly doing what you say since Russell is doing it. More tests and more data is always better for analysis.

I would really just wonder why they haven’t found the issue yet, the drivers have no fault here, they are paid to do what the engineers tell them to.

Yes they are paid to do so but could you imagine Max doing what the engineers tell him to do and knowing it affects his speed? Where is Lewis's self respect and competitive spirit when it comes bad car and being volunteer to take a beating from his team mate. I just don't buy it, this is Lewis's escape story when he tries to find his speed from experiments.

[dialtone]

I suggest they try to hoan in on the best performing set-up every weekend, step by step, not getting ahead of themselves. Then try to find the common denominator between the best performing set-ups and apply that knowledge to the simulator. The issue I have is these "experiments" seem more like stabs in the dark. It's trying to take three steps at once and more often than not (if not always) they end up back on square one.

I don’t think you have the data to say their way of experimenting is flawed. They are also certainly doing what you say since Russell is doing it. More tests and more data is always better for analysis.

I would really just wonder why they haven’t found the issue yet, the drivers have no fault here, they are paid to do what the engineers tell them to.

Third year of little to no progress doesn't count?

We don’t know the issue… unless you have a better method than the scientific method or what other teams use to get out of the same situation… refining your setup is going to give you points close to one another in the correlation, while you also need the extremes to have decently precise interpolation.

For example if you are looking to extrapolate how downforce works in relation to ride height for your floor, doing 50 laps in FP at very similar ride height is going to allow you to observe only that space but for the simulator you need to know how the car behaves across a variety of ride heights.

When you build a new car you kind of throw the simulator data out of the window and have to start from scratch, so each year feels like deja vu if you keep having correlation issues.

[dialtone]

I suggest they try to hoan in on the best performing set-up every weekend, step by step, not getting ahead of themselves. Then try to find the common denominator between the best performing set-ups and apply that knowledge to the simulator. The issue I have is these "experiments" seem more like stabs in the dark. It's trying to take three steps at once and more often than not (if not always) they end up back on square one.

I don’t think you have the data to say their way of experimenting is flawed. They are also certainly doing what you say since Russell is doing it. More tests and more data is always better for analysis.

I would really just wonder why they haven’t found the issue yet, the drivers have no fault here, they are paid to do what the engineers tell them to.

Yes they are paid to do so but could you imagine Max doing what the engineers tell him to do and knowing it affects his speed? Where is Lewis's self respect and competitive spirit when it comes bad car and being volunteer to take a beating from his team mate. I just don't buy it, this is Lewis's escape story when he tries to find his speed from experiments.

Yes I can imagine Max doing that, just like Leclerc did last year. Saying no to this isn’t self-respect, it’s selfish and very unprofessional.

[Jurgen von Diaz]

I don’t think you have the data to say their way of experimenting is flawed. They are also certainly doing what you say since Russell is doing it. More tests and more data is always better for analysis.

I would really just wonder why they haven’t found the issue yet, the drivers have no fault here, they are paid to do what the engineers tell them to.

Yes they are paid to do so but could you imagine Max doing what the engineers tell him to do and knowing it affects his speed? Where is Lewis's self respect and competitive spirit when it comes bad car and being volunteer to take a beating from his team mate. I just don't buy it, this is Lewis's escape story when he tries to find his speed from experiments.

Yes I can imagine Max doing that, just like Leclerc did last year. Saying no to this isn’t self-respect, it’s selfish and very unprofessional.

I don't think Max would be doing it if he sees Perez outperfoming him. The thing is if Merc have a problem, it's always Lewis "taking care of it" and before that it's Lewis that is underperforming. Like in Red Bull, Perez is struggling and he starts doing his own experiments to get the pace back.

Lewis has been so weird this season, sometimes he says the car is amazing and next day awful. George is happy with the car, Lewis is the one who is lost.

[dialtone]

Yes they are paid to do so but could you imagine Max doing what the engineers tell him to do and knowing it affects his speed? Where is Lewis's self respect and competitive spirit when it comes bad car and being volunteer to take a beating from his team mate. I just don't buy it, this is Lewis's escape story when he tries to find his speed from experiments.

Yes I can imagine Max doing that, just like Leclerc did last year. Saying no to this isn’t self-respect, it’s selfish and very unprofessional.

I don't think Max would be doing it if he sees Perez outperfoming him. The thing is if Merc have a problem, it's always Lewis "taking care of it" and before that it's Lewis that is underperforming. Like in Red Bull, Perez is struggling and he starts doing his own experiments to get the pace back.

Lewis has been so weird this season, sometimes he says the car is amazing and next day awful. George is happy with the car, Lewis is the one who is lost.

Different drivers, different ways to react but George isn’t happy with the car, and Lewis never said it’s terrible.

Both said the car is good but they can’t extract its potential yet due to setup issues.

https://formu1a.uno/en/george-russell-m ... stand-w15/

[Il Leone]

Yes I can imagine Max doing that, just like Leclerc did last year. Saying no to this isn’t self-respect, it’s selfish and very unprofessional.

I don't think Max would be doing it if he sees Perez outperfoming him. The thing is if Merc have a problem, it's always Lewis "taking care of it" and before that it's Lewis that is underperforming. Like in Red Bull, Perez is struggling and he starts doing his own experiments to get the pace back.

Lewis has been so weird this season, sometimes he says the car is amazing and next day awful. George is happy with the car, Lewis is the one who is lost.

Different drivers, different ways to react but George isn’t happy with the car, and Lewis never said it’s terrible.

Both said the car is good but they can’t extract its potential yet due to setup issues.

https://formu1a.uno/en/george-russell-m ... stand-w15/

Russell was very positive today and claimed he would have been in the top 3 had he not made a mistake in P2. Hamilton is in the biggest rut of his career, maybe it's time questions are asked?

[dialtone]

I don't think Max would be doing it if he sees Perez outperfoming him. The thing is if Merc have a problem, it's always Lewis "taking care of it" and before that it's Lewis that is underperforming. Like in Red Bull, Perez is struggling and he starts doing his own experiments to get the pace back.

Lewis has been so weird this season, sometimes he says the car is amazing and next day awful. George is happy with the car, Lewis is the one who is lost.

Different drivers, different ways to react but George isn’t happy with the car, and Lewis never said it’s terrible.

Both said the car is good but they can’t extract its potential yet due to setup issues.

https://formu1a.uno/en/george-russell-m ... stand-w15/

Russell was very positive today and claimed he would have been in the top 3 had he not made a mistake in P2. Hamilton is in the biggest rut of his career, maybe it's time questions are asked?

Russell was 2nd in FP2 in Saudi Arabia. How did that race go?



This is the interview he gave. Among the things he said are that they are still trying to understand the car. He said that he was comfortable but he lost the car on T9-10 and made the mistake that broke his front wing on his fast lap. The interviewer also told him at first that the car seemed tricky and he said that he was pushing.

So you think he’s happy that he was pushing in FP2 while half the grid is turned down and taking it chill because it’s FP2, but he got 2nd so it’s all good.

The hate on Hamilton feels a bit too much.

[zibby43]

Different drivers, different ways to react but George isn’t happy with the car, and Lewis never said it’s terrible.

Both said the car is good but they can’t extract its potential yet due to setup issues.

https://formu1a.uno/en/george-russell-m ... stand-w15/

Russell was very positive today and claimed he would have been in the top 3 had he not made a mistake in P2. Hamilton is in the biggest rut of his career, maybe it's time questions are asked?

Russell was 2nd in FP2 in Saudi Arabia. How did that race go?



This is the interview he gave. Among the things he said are that they are still trying to understand the car. He said that he was comfortable but he lost the car on T9-10 and made the mistake that broke his front wing on his fast lap. The interviewer also told him at first that the car seemed tricky and he said that he was pushing.

So you think he’s happy that he was pushing in FP2 while half the grid is turned down and taking it chill because it’s FP2, but he got 2nd so it’s all good.

The hate on Hamilton feels a bit too much.

Thank you for introducing some reason into this thread.

[Luscion]

Russell was very positive today and claimed he would have been in the top 3 had he not made a mistake in P2. Hamilton is in the biggest rut of his career, maybe it's time questions are asked?

Russell was 2nd in FP2 in Saudi Arabia. How did that race go?



This is the interview he gave. Among the things he said are that they are still trying to understand the car. He said that he was comfortable but he lost the car on T9-10 and made the mistake that broke his front wing on his fast lap. The interviewer also told him at first that the car seemed tricky and he said that he was pushing.

So you think he’s happy that he was pushing in FP2 while half the grid is turned down and taking it chill because it’s FP2, but he got 2nd so it’s all good.

The hate on Hamilton feels a bit too much.

Hamilton is 9 tenths of Russell, if this continues in qualifying then he deserves all the flack.

I feel like people are being a little dramatic, the guy had an extreme setup in fp2 and had damage to his car

[chrisc90]

Merc have always pushed in FP2. Watch come FP3 and quali when the others wind the wick up a bit

[Rodak]

I suggest they try to hoan in on the best performing set-up every weekend, step by step, not getting ahead of themselves. Then try to find the common denominator between the best performing set-ups and apply that knowledge to the simulator. The issue I have is these "experiments" seem more like stabs in the dark. It's trying to take three steps at once and more often than not (if not always) they end up back on square one.

It's 'hone in'! But seriously, changing more than one variable at a time means you have no way to understand how each variable affects the result and you are indeed taking stabs in the dark.

Things that can be tried during free practice are limited but add up to many possible changes. The team can quickly change ride height, camber and pressure (to Pirelli limits), toe, wings, shock (damper) settings, sway bars, suspension interactions, engine modes, etc, so there are an enormous number of combinations. This is where the step by step approach is required. Radical changes will tell you nothing. If we had unlimited testing these issue would probably be quickly solved; simulators are great, but they are not real life, especially with aero components when there are correlation issues.

[PlatinumZealot]

The last time I saw Hamilton struggle like this when when he ran the wrong rear wing in belgium racing for McLaren. He is lost. Very lost. It is unbelieveable.

He's being the ultimate team player again sacrificing himself as while George nibbles up the scraps.

[dialtone]

Hope now that Ham is on FP3 podium, winning a total of 0 points, you feel better about him. He can now take the rest of the weekend off.


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[Luscion]

Hope now that Ham is on FP3 podium, winning a total of 0 points, you feel better about him. He can now take the rest of the weekend off.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The doom of Hamilton being washed 3 weekends into a season has been crazy, maybe this puts a stop to it