2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

[mwillems]

For me it was a racing incident. Sainz could have driven better for sure, but it wasn't a punishable offence I don't think. It is frustrating, but no more.

I'm not saying the judges should punish Sainz. No. I say that Sainz punished himself. What happened in the first corner between Oscar and Carlos is completely a racing incident and no one should be penalized for it. Carlos fined himself, so to speak. He was only helped by a red flag, which returned him to third position. Without the red flags, his race would have ended outside the points.

I agree with this and fortune smiled on him with the sectors. If the crash was a little later or didn't happen we'd have 2nd and 3rd.

But at least it's going to be a very exciting year in the championship!

[Vanja #66]

There was plenty of space to Sainz's right. But Oscar can’t go any further to the left, there’s a wall there. It was Sainz who ran into Oscar and punctured his left tire. Sainz's guilt is obvious.

***

You yourself know that every person has his own view of things. What do you think about the incident between Magnussen and Perez? Racing incident? Is it Kevin's fault? Is it Sergio's fault? From my point of view, I see Sergio's guilt, just as I saw Logan's guilt in Miami. Because the rider in front leaves no room. In the case of Sergio, everything is even obvious. He looked twice to the right in the mirrors and saw Kevin.

If the car behind gets into the wheelbase of the one in front, shouldn't that driver leave room? From my point of view, this is called “slamming the gate.” But Perez never knew how to admit his mistakes.

Actually, there's a fan video from above T1 and it shows there was no push from Sainz into Oscar, who had plenty of room on the left on T1 exit, here's a screenshot bellow. It was a typical T1 tussle and I don't think Sainz was lucky at all with how it went...



Perez and Mag was a racing incident, KMag was too optimistic but was entitled to the space he occupied. Perez shouldn't have turned right alongo the racing line, but also didn't do it on purpose. Agreed also on Miami penalty for Mag, no idea what kind of rule was taken as relevant there

Pushing into a wall and pushing into space are different things. I'm not sure applying the same rules to Monaco really works that well. But I also agree that Sainz didn't go too far, it was hard racing and whilst Sainz could have done more to prevent the touch, it was a racing incident at the first corner.

Yeah, of course it's different, I just put it out there as a "it could have gone much worse for all" It was very silly of Sainz to clip Alonso in Australia last year and was penalised. It was also very poor judgement trying to close the door on Piastri in Spa, but he punished himself there as well. Luckily, he's a bit more patient this year and it benefits him greatly obviously.

For what it's worth, I don't mind Piastri in any of their fights at all. On the contrary - he's young and eager to establish himself and it's nice to see this. Everyone who turned out to be someone did it in his early years in top-level racing.

[LionsHeart]

For me it was a racing incident. Sainz could have driven better for sure, but it wasn't a punishable offence I don't think. It is frustrating, but no more.

I'm not saying the judges should punish Sainz. No. I say that Sainz punished himself. What happened in the first corner between Oscar and Carlos is completely a racing incident and no one should be penalized for it. Carlos fined himself, so to speak. He was only helped by a red flag, which returned him to third position. Without the red flags, his race would have ended outside the points.

I agree with this and fortune smiled on him with the sectors. If the crash was a little later or didn't happen we'd have 2nd and 3rd.

But at least it's going to be a very exciting year in the championship!

But you can’t argue with that! This will be an interesting championship. By the way, I just realized yesterday that 8 races are already left behind, which means 1/3 of the season has already been completed. Everything is going very quickly.

[geogate]

dont think i ever seen a driver so devastated by a second place in a single race as Pato was. He needs some Oscar energy (desperately trying to make it remotely relevant to this thread)

[LionsHeart]

There was plenty of space to Sainz's right. But Oscar can’t go any further to the left, there’s a wall there. It was Sainz who ran into Oscar and punctured his left tire. Sainz's guilt is obvious.

***

You yourself know that every person has his own view of things. What do you think about the incident between Magnussen and Perez? Racing incident? Is it Kevin's fault? Is it Sergio's fault? From my point of view, I see Sergio's guilt, just as I saw Logan's guilt in Miami. Because the rider in front leaves no room. In the case of Sergio, everything is even obvious. He looked twice to the right in the mirrors and saw Kevin.

If the car behind gets into the wheelbase of the one in front, shouldn't that driver leave room? From my point of view, this is called “slamming the gate.” But Perez never knew how to admit his mistakes.

Actually, there's a fan video from above T1 and it shows there was no push from Sainz into Oscar, who had plenty of room on the left on T1 exit, here's a screenshot bellow. It was a typical T1 tussle and I don't think Sainz was lucky at all with how it went...

https://i.ibb.co/w6MjBC3/mon-24-rac.jpg

Perez and Mag was a racing incident, KMag was too optimistic but was entitled to the space he occupied. Perez shouldn't have turned right alongo the racing line, but also didn't do it on purpose. Agreed also on Miami penalty for Mag, no idea what kind of rule was taken as relevant there

Pushing into a wall and pushing into space are different things. I'm not sure applying the same rules to Monaco really works that well. But I also agree that Sainz didn't go too far, it was hard racing and whilst Sainz could have done more to prevent the touch, it was a racing incident at the first corner.

Yeah, of course it's different, I just put it out there as a "it could have gone much worse for all" It was very silly of Sainz to clip Alonso in Australia last year and was penalised. It was also very poor judgement trying to close the door on Piastri in Spa, but he punished himself there as well. Luckily, he's a bit more patient this year and it benefits him greatly obviously.

For what it's worth, I don't mind Piastri in any of their fights at all. On the contrary - he's young and eager to establish himself and it's nice to see this. Everyone who turned out to be someone did it in his early years in top-level racing.

Well, at the exit of the first turn you always want to drive closer to the wall for better acceleration, and Sainz placed himself as close as possible to Oscar. It was not Oscar who pushed Sainz, but Sainz who came close. I don't see error #81 here. Sainz should have had a better feel for the dimensions of his car. This is not the first time he has come to Oscar in recent races.

[billamend]

dont think i ever seen a driver so devastated by a second place in a single race as Pato was.

Who can blame him?

[CjC]

dont think i ever seen a driver so devastated by a second place in a single race as Pato was. He needs some Oscar energy (desperately trying to make it remotely relevant to this thread)

Hopefully he’ll get plenty more chances… he’s only 25, look at how old some of the other guys who race in Inday car are!!

[FittingMechanics]

dont think i ever seen a driver so devastated by a second place in a single race as Pato was. He needs some Oscar energy (desperately trying to make it remotely relevant to this thread)

Finished P2 in 2024
Crashed out while attacking P2 in the last laps in 2023.
Pato finished P2 in 2022.
Finished P4 in 2021
Finished P6 in 2020.

In IndyLights (Freedom 100) finished P2 in 2017.

The guy is constantly fast there but always someone has just a slightly faster car.

This is third in a row he was a genuine threat for victory in the last laps of the race. I don't remember the details of 2021 or 2022 so it may be even more. It has to be devastating as you don't have a guarantee your car will be good enough next year.

[mwillems]

There was plenty of space to Sainz's right. But Oscar can’t go any further to the left, there’s a wall there. It was Sainz who ran into Oscar and punctured his left tire. Sainz's guilt is obvious.

***

You yourself know that every person has his own view of things. What do you think about the incident between Magnussen and Perez? Racing incident? Is it Kevin's fault? Is it Sergio's fault? From my point of view, I see Sergio's guilt, just as I saw Logan's guilt in Miami. Because the rider in front leaves no room. In the case of Sergio, everything is even obvious. He looked twice to the right in the mirrors and saw Kevin.

If the car behind gets into the wheelbase of the one in front, shouldn't that driver leave room? From my point of view, this is called “slamming the gate.” But Perez never knew how to admit his mistakes.

Actually, there's a fan video from above T1 and it shows there was no push from Sainz into Oscar, who had plenty of room on the left on T1 exit, here's a screenshot bellow. It was a typical T1 tussle and I don't think Sainz was lucky at all with how it went...

https://i.ibb.co/w6MjBC3/mon-24-rac.jpg

Perez and Mag was a racing incident, KMag was too optimistic but was entitled to the space he occupied. Perez shouldn't have turned right alongo the racing line, but also didn't do it on purpose. Agreed also on Miami penalty for Mag, no idea what kind of rule was taken as relevant there

Pushing into a wall and pushing into space are different things. I'm not sure applying the same rules to Monaco really works that well. But I also agree that Sainz didn't go too far, it was hard racing and whilst Sainz could have done more to prevent the touch, it was a racing incident at the first corner.

Yeah, of course it's different, I just put it out there as a "it could have gone much worse for all" It was very silly of Sainz to clip Alonso in Australia last year and was penalised. It was also very poor judgement trying to close the door on Piastri in Spa, but he punished himself there as well. Luckily, he's a bit more patient this year and it benefits him greatly obviously.

For what it's worth, I don't mind Piastri in any of their fights at all. On the contrary - he's young and eager to establish himself and it's nice to see this. Everyone who turned out to be someone did it in his early years in top-level racing.

You don't need to explain, I know you have a balanced opinion. It could have been worse and a few more centimetres from Sainz and it would have been! But through luck or judgement they both got through relatively unscathed. At the end of the day one is as good as the other and Sainz took every CM that he could, as he should.

For the record, I'm glad Oscar is getting his elbows out and I don't mind him even getting a few penalties in the meantime, as you say, everyone who is someone behaves like that, and for very good reason... being a reliable overtake is not a good label, you want people to fear overtaking you and to work harder for the pass.

I've seen comments around him showing his inexperience/immaturity/rush of blood to the head during some of the races, particularly Miami, but I think those perspectives totally miss the point. It took Lando a bit too long to get his elbows out in my view and for a while he was an easy pass, but he's shrugged that label now and he's got stuck in a bit more.

[mwillems]

Sums it up. Sometimes the rules give and sometimes they take.

[SilviuAgo]

dont think i ever seen a driver so devastated by a second place in a single race as Pato was. He needs some Oscar energy (desperately trying to make it remotely relevant to this thread)

I hope not to see Lando or Oscar like this...heartbreaking

[LionsHeart]

dont think i ever seen a driver so devastated by a second place in a single race as Pato was. He needs some Oscar energy (desperately trying to make it remotely relevant to this thread)

I hope not to see Lando or Oscar like this...heartbreaking

Nice to see Zak come over and support his driver.

[LionsHeart]

Sums it up. Sometimes the rules give and sometimes they take.

Well, there are completely different things here, in one case there is a safety car, in the other there are red flags that can teleport the driver back to the top of the table. In both cases there is a luck factor.

And if everything is clear with the safety car, the race director makes the decision there, then in the case of red flags I would change a couple of rules. For example, a ban on changing tires, provided that the tires are intact and in good order, there is no puncture or slow puncture. If there is one, then allow this driver to change tires, but at the same time oblige him to change tires later in the race.

I don't follow IndyCar or Nascar, but I sometimes follow the guys who play iRacing, and I know some of the rules, including in real racing. For example, under red flags, cars cannot be touched, repairs cannot be made, and tires cannot be changed.

For example, in Formula 1 I would allow teams to repair cars under red flags, but would prohibit changing tires. Tire changes should only occur during the race when drivers are in race mode. For Monaco specifically, it is not necessary to ask Pirelli to bring even softer sets of tires. It is enough to oblige all teams to make two pits.

[mwillems]

Sums it up. Sometimes the rules give and sometimes they take.

Well, there are completely different things here, in one case there is a safety car, in the other there are red flags that can teleport the driver back to the top of the table. In both cases there is a luck factor.

And if everything is clear with the safety car, the race director makes the decision there, then in the case of red flags I would change a couple of rules. For example, a ban on changing tires, provided that the tires are intact and in good order, there is no puncture or slow puncture. If there is one, then allow this driver to change tires, but at the same time oblige him to change tires later in the race.

I don't follow IndyCar or Nascar, but I sometimes follow the guys who play iRacing, and I know some of the rules, including in real racing. For example, under red flags, cars cannot be touched, repairs cannot be made, and tires cannot be changed.

For example, in Formula 1 I would allow teams to repair cars under red flags, but would prohibit changing tires. Tire changes should only occur during the race when drivers are in race mode. For Monaco specifically, it is not necessary to ask Pirelli to bring even softer sets of tires. It is enough to oblige all teams to make two pits.

You explained it perfectly in the first statement. It is luck, and sometimes it goes your way and sometimes it doesn't. The rules don't always and can't always work for everyone, but in general they don't discriminate save a few high profile examples over the years and it does balance out. Ish.

Our luck gave us a race win that we didn't outright deserve because of our Saturday performance, so for me I take it with good grace when we get it our way or when we don't.

[Vanja #66]

You don't need to explain, I know you have a balanced opinion. It could have been worse and a few more centimetres from Sainz and it would have been! But through luck or judgement they both got through relatively unscathed. At the end of the day one is as good as the other and Sainz took every CM that he could, as he should.

For the record, I'm glad Oscar is getting his elbows out and I don't mind him even getting a few penalties in the meantime, as you say, everyone who is someone behaves like that, and for very good reason... being a reliable overtake is not a good label, you want people to fear overtaking you and to work harder for the pass.

I've seen comments around him showing his inexperience/immaturity/rush of blood to the head during some of the races, particularly Miami, but I think those perspectives totally miss the point. It took Lando a bit too long to get his elbows out in my view and for a while he was an easy pass, but he's shrugged that label now and he's got stuck in a bit more.

Cheers mate, let's hope for more of these hard and fair fights until the end of season! Mind you, we've 16 races left and not so long ago that was a full season on its own