Flexiwings 2024

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https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... ntfluegel/

Seems this flexiwings saga is continuing, and possibly heating up. Maybe a protest could occur?

Red Bull is taking aim at the front wings of McLaren and Ferrari. Targeted bending is supposed to make them a miracle weapon. Now Mercedes has also taken a giant step with its new bending wing. What is the secret?

Red Bull is pointing the finger more and more openly at the front wings of McLaren and Ferrari, which are said to bend too much under the corresponding load. They wanted to use Aston Martin to protest. But they didn't want to hear of it. It is suspected that the technical office in Silverstone is working on a similar solution.

Mercedes also suspected that the secret of the McLaren and Ferrari lay more in the front wing than in the underbody. But instead of taking action against the competition, they have now taken the initiative themselves. The new Mercedes front wing is also said to belong to the family of legal flexible wings and is playing a significant role in the Silver Arrows suddenly learning to walk. The car is suddenly easier to balance and the drivers have more confidence.

"If this continues to be tolerated, we will have to go the same way," says Red Bull

[SirBastianVettel]

Is it really that difficult to come up with a system for the FIA to measure this correctly so this issue can be solved once and for all.

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Canada

[bluechris]

This is the "Famous method of the eye" checking?

[Stu]

This is the "Famous method of the eye" checking?

‘iGauge’?

[bluechris]

This is the "Famous method of the eye" checking?

‘iGauge’?

yeap and iTouch™

[FW17]

What I never understood was how the top flap is allowed to move so much on TV cameras. I understand that the top flat is adjustable, but what we see it having different movements on either side of the adjuster where it is split

The purpose of the regulation was the all flaps connect to the nose; but how is the flap allowed to split?

[SharkY]

Is it really that difficult to come up with a system for the FIA to measure this correctly so this issue can be solved once and for all.

I don't believe there's a correct way to measure it. The only way to be sure the forces are somewhat similar to what the car experiences on the track is to test it full scale in the wind tunnel, which isn't a feasible option for mid weekend testing. Without the wind tunnel you have to decide how much force is needed and where to place it - and the forces for each team will be different. So you'd need to get a full CFD data and build special test rigs for each wing independently and change the rigs with each FW revision. But then again, I don't think it'd be a feasible option, and even if it would, I'm pretty sure teams would find the way to go around it somewhat.

You could use a camera system, to check it (coupled with some motion capture software to see all the bending directions), but given how much the FW deflects I'm not sure the accuracy would be enough to determine that.

IMO the current system shows the beauty of the sport: finding very clever ways to bypass regulations.
And the regulations themselves are the problem, as the rigidity requirement is absurd. In a simplified form, the FW is a beam supported from one side, so it'll always be bending under stress, especially in such a lightweight structure as FW.

Why not give the teams freedom in this regard and control the safety with punishments: the wing snaps without a contact with another driver or the wall? You can't use that wing anymore and a grid drop penalty.

This is the "Famous method of the eye" checking?

To be fair, they were also touching them. Maybe they're cyborgs with calibrated dynamometers in their hands.

[bluechris]

Is it really that difficult to come up with a system for the FIA to measure this correctly so this issue can be solved once and for all.

I don't believe there's a correct way to measure it. The only way to be sure the forces are somewhat similar to what the car experiences on the track is to test it full scale in the wind tunnel, which isn't a feasible option for mid weekend testing. Without the wind tunnel you have to decide how much force is needed and where to place it - and the forces for each team will be different. So you'd need to get a full CFD data and build special test rigs for each wing independently and change the rigs with each FW revision. But then again, I don't think it'd be a feasible option, and even if it would, I'm pretty sure teams would find the way to go around it somewhat.

You could use a camera system, to check it (coupled with some motion capture software to see all the bending directions), but given how much the FW deflects I'm not sure the accuracy would be enough to determine that.

IMO the current system shows the beauty of the sport: finding very clever ways to bypass regulations.
And the regulations themselves are the problem, as the rigidity requirement is absurd. In a simplified form, the FW is a beam supported from one side, so it'll always be bending under stress, especially in such a lightweight structure as FW.

Why not give the teams freedom in this regard and control the safety with punishments: the wing snaps without a contact with another driver or the wall? You can't use that wing anymore and a grid drop penalty.

This is the "Famous method of the eye" checking?

To be fair, they were also touching them. Maybe they're cyborgs with calibrated dynamometers in their hands.

The only real and correct way to measure them, is that each team will sent a front wing or rear wing or any part that we need to test it for flexing, and put it in a mini wind tunnel ( i think a 4 x 4 meter one without the fan), and throw to it 300klm air and measure correctly the flex.

Thats the only solution.. all the rest mumbo jumbo tests that we press with this amount of newtons or anything is wrong beacuse teams do tricks with the way that they build the carbon and all pass the tests.

[LM10]

Mercedes also suspected that the secret of the McLaren and Ferrari lay more in the front wing than in the underbody.

What’s that even supposed to mean?
Which secret?

[Vanja #66]

This is gonna be a bigger nothingburger topic than the W13 zeropod midwing legality and performance advantage

I love it how F1 "pundits" and massmedia keep reinventing stories on materials exploited on cars for at least 25 years

Mercedes also suspected that the secret of the McLaren and Ferrari lay more in the front wing than in the underbody.

What’s that even supposed to mean?
Which secret?

Literally the sentence that stops you considering the article as serious...

[SiLo]

Mercedes also suspected that the secret of the McLaren and Ferrari lay more in the front wing than in the underbody.

What’s that even supposed to mean?
Which secret?

My guess: the teams are flexing the front wings more, meaning flow to the floor is less disturbed. But at lower speeds they get the gains of higher AoA on the front wing to counteract the current reg cars tendencies to understeer.

[mwillems]

Mercedes also suspected that the secret of the McLaren and Ferrari lay more in the front wing than in the underbody.

What’s that even supposed to mean?
Which secret?

Might they be considering that the floor could be stalled with a certain amount of flex ?

[Sevach]

What I never understood was how the top flap is allowed to move so much on TV cameras. I understand that the top flat is adjustable, but what we see it having different movements on either side of the adjuster where it is split

The purpose of the regulation was the all flaps connect to the nose; but how is the flap allowed to split?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2qMjryAMao

The rules should be changed to require rigid flap adjusters both on the inside and out (sounds obvious right).
It will make pit stop adjustments harder, but alas.
They are bringing active aero anyways.

Right now there's only adjusters on the outside, and the inside(which is where most of the downforce is generated these days) is completely free to move.

[Just_a_fan]

What’s that even supposed to mean?
Which secret?

Might they be considering that the floor could be stalled with a certain amount of flex ?

It's a way of controlling the aero balance - at low/medium speeds the front wing gives good downforce helping the nose turn in. At high speed, the front wing bleeds off some downforce giving a slight bit of understeer which is a desirable thing in a high speed corner.