2024 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

[Sevach]

As soon as I saw that the floor roof was lowered with the new upgrades I thought of the possibility of porpoising. I've not read what exactly Sainz said, but if he actually mentioned porpoising then of course it's the explanation for their huge lift compared to others in the high speed section. That's a big time loss.

But I'm not worried. The team just needs to find out the optimal setup to shut off the porpoising again. It's been a big upgrade package overall (Imola and Barcelona combined).

Another thing which Sainz said was the characteristics of the track which partly are similar to China and Suzuka and that it was not a surprise that they struggled (or something on those lines) because these type of corners are the weak point of the car. So I guess he means the long radius corners? If yes, I wonder how to solve that and whether they addressed these issues with the current upgrades already or it will happen later in the season.

The colder track didn't help either.

Since mid-2022(no need to talk about "that" again) Ferrari hasn't been strong in high speed corners, this car is significantly better than the SF-23 at it but still not fantastic (they also have a little lift into 9 which i did not expect).

Hopefully the car was set in a ride height that it grounds a bit with qualy speeds but flies easily through there in race speeds, halving the losses.
Ferrari was able to comeback in the race to finish in front of the Mclaren's in Japan, i hope they can do something similar tomorrow, at least vs the Mercs.

[venkyhere]

The colder track didn't help either.

Track temp was in the 30s or 40s, right ?
How hot does the track have to be for Ferrari to 'come into tyre window' ? 50 ? 60 ?
The Ferrari PR team has trained drivers and staff to use this 'track temp' as an excuse, as if something beyond their control is hampering them - didn't they know what tracks temps for these 22 races are going to be, when designing the car ?

The truth is Ferrari does this 'pendulum swing' with correcting issues with previous gen car and then eventually arrives at an optimal one. 2022 - car was peaky in downforce, porpoised, but rotated excellently, had mega traction from slow corner exits (driveability) => 2023 started as a car that had benign downforce, no porpoising, but had poor driveability where rotation and traction from corners suffered => last one third of 2023 => driveability was back without sacrificing downforce/speed => 2024 has good driveability, but not able to add performance, whilst other teams are able to. Now the fear is whether 2nd half of 2024 will add so much performance, that driveability will be lost again.

My guess is that Ferrari's problem is 'converging' with the car.

[Sphere3758]

Regarding the colder track being a potential issue, wasn’t the problem for Ferrari in sector 2? In all the previous cases, they lost out in sector 1 because of this issue.

[dani5549]

Regarding the colder track being a potential issue, wasn’t the problem for Ferrari in sector 2? In all the previous cases, they lost out in sector 1 because of this issue.

Exactly, tyre temperature wasn't a problem, S1 was always the fastest with Sainz atleast, they lost it in S2 and S3

[search]

I don't really see much reason for all the negativity in this thread. Barcelona was never going to be a good track for Ferrari, so three tenths off pole isn't that bad. Better than I had thought before the weekend.

The upgrade was a.o. supposed to solve problems with tire warm up, and as far as I can see, it did. Tires fired off immediately, and were gone by sector 3, just like in last year's Ferrari. With some fine tuning, this can be a good package - if they don't lost their race advantage at the same time.

[yooogurt]

iirc in Imola team had no problems with bouncing in high speed corners with 2.0 package, so the updates don't work as expected?

[yooogurt]

Damn there rain start at the end f3 race, thing goes worse.

[DoctorRadio]

iirc in Imola team had no problems with bouncing in high speed corners with 2.0 package, so the updates don't work as expected?

Mclaren also bounced in high speed corners, so it wasn’t only a bouncing issue for Ferrari.
Taking into account that Leclerc did a mistake and Norris got a bit of a tow, the gap is closer than it looks (maybe two tenths), but it’s certain that at tracks like Barcelona, Silverstone, Hungary and Spa, the Mclaren is still a better aero package than the Ferrari.
Considering where they were last year and the less experience with this concept than Red Bull/Mclaren, it’s a big improvement and they are on course to have the all round package next year.

So I don’t understand the general negativity (not aimed at you), in F1 you don’t invent things overnight.

[LM10]

The colder track didn't help either.

Track temp was in the 30s or 40s, right ?
How hot does the track have to be for Ferrari to 'come into tyre window' ? 50 ? 60 ?
The Ferrari PR team has trained drivers and staff to use this 'track temp' as an excuse, as if something beyond their control is hampering them - didn't they know what tracks temps for these 22 races are going to be, when designing the car ?

Never said Ferrari was not in the tyre window. However, cooler track temperatures (10-12°C cooler than on Friday) surely didn't help them relative to others, as in they might have lost performance relative to others. In F1, everything is about compromises and relations. You can have the tyres in the window with 35°C as well as 45°C track temperature, but still extract less potential from the car in one case while the opposite happens for others.

No idea which PR team training you're talking about.

[Xyz22]

I'm expecting a comparable pace in the race to McL and RB in free air. Unfortunately, starting P5 will compromise the final result.

[CouncilorIrissa]

As soon as I saw that the floor roof was lowered with the new upgrades I thought of the possibility of porpoising. I've not read what exactly Sainz said, but if he actually mentioned porpoising then of course it's the explanation for their huge lift compared to others in the high speed section. That's a big time loss.

But I'm not worried. The team just needs to find out the optimal setup to shut off the porpoising again. It's been a big upgrade package overall (Imola and Barcelona combined).

Another thing which Sainz said was the characteristics of the track which partly are similar to China and Suzuka and that it was not a surprise that they struggled (or something on those lines) because these type of corners are the weak point of the car. So I guess he means the long radius corners? If yes, I wonder how to solve that and whether they addressed these issues with the current upgrades already or it will happen later in the season.

The colder track didn't help either.

Yeah, I thought of the same thing about lowering the floor roof, that in quest of finding more performance the team did a France 2022.
I have a sneaking suspicion that the upgrades have made the car worse. We obviously don't have enought data to conclude that, so that's more of a gut feeling than anything else.

[yooogurt]

Yeah, I thought of the same thing about lowering the floor roof, that in quest of finding more performance the team did a France 2022.
I have a sneaking suspicion that the upgrades have made the car worse. We obviously don't have enought data to conclude that, so that's more of a gut feeling than anything else.

To be fair: after France 2022 car become faster but harder to drive.

[CouncilorIrissa]

I'm expecting a comparable pace in the race to McL and RB in free air. Unfortunately, starting P5 will compromise the final result.

I expect the opposite. Now that the car is competitive in S1 and slow in S3, I fully expect the return of SF-23 race trim experience.

[Fakepivot]

if that's the case then Charles is very good at handling those Tyre hehe..

[Space-heat]

I'm expecting a comparable pace in the race to McL and RB in free air. Unfortunately, starting P5 will compromise the final result.

I expect the opposite. Now that the car is competitive in S1 and slow in S3, I fully expect the return of SF-23 race trim experience.

Was most of the gain in S1 not due the longer straight and Ferrari top speed. I know Carlos is running more wing than Charles so may be I am mistaken. It seems Merc are able to run their car very low here and as discussed here plenty Ferrari might be just suited to non traditional circuits where everyone needs to run a little higher. Of the circuits since the Imola upgrade, Barcelona was always going to be the worst characteristically. If Ferrari are within 1-2 tenths of RBR in clean air it is still encouraging.

Charles mentioned he was hopefully for race pace, Ferrari may have set their car up for the predicted colder race conditions, hence the tires falling off in S3. The threat from behind is minimal so Charles or Carlos should chance starting on the soft, most likely Charles as he is P5. If deg is high on the green track, the undercut and low wing should work well to clear traffic post pit stop. Hopefully, they split Carlos and Charles, although Carlos mentioned in his post q interview that as long as he was P5 after lap one, then the podium was a chance.

The Merc jump is the most puzzling part as the track wasn't cold like Canada and China, they always go well here, even the W13, so it might be the flat conditions. It does seem that the Monaco front wing has brought a huge jump. I know AMUS mentioned Ferrari already using a similar bending design but Marco only mentioned Mcl and Merc over the weekend so hopefully Ferrari can bring something similar after the summer break if the FIA are going to allow it. Does anyone know if Ferrari are still running the same FW since Bahrain?