Eco friendly F1 car

[stl0]

It is not about making the actual racing greener, it is about advancing greener technology, but it seems that is waste to many of you as well, guess you'll all go back to your home planet after this one is fully destroyed.

Just as racing helped advance safety technology, and braking tech & engine technology, it can do the same for greener, environmentally responsible technology.

As it should, and I hope it can. My post was more to suggest that their approach needs to be pervasive to the entire operation. Without an approach that includes every aspect of the racing any effort on the cars will be seen as token marketing. Racing teams in general, if committed to energy reduction in every dimension of their operation, would not only help to develop solutions, but also promote existing solutions to the fans of the sport. They could help eliminate the myth that acting sustainably means sacrificing any fun in your life.

As for the cars, the challenge is that the goal of green tech is efficiency, and F1 is a sprint formula. Perhaps if they required cellulosic fuels, limited the amount of fuel available, and took the constraints off of kers (let them use all of the energy recovered instead of a limited amount per lap) it would encourage developments that would enhance efficiency. The challenge is to encourage teams to use kers to improve efficiency instead of speed.

The question then is whether or not F1 would remain popular as an efficiency formula, since efficiency is generally inversely proportional to speed. I think a better approach is in the area of encouraging development of alternative fuels, since if we power the car with cellulosic ethanol we could go fast with impunity, with huge co2 reductions and no impact on food crops.

I suppose if it was an easy question someone would have come up with an answer by now. Without an answer the sport will become totally irrelevant, and all motorsport will simply cease to exist. I wonder how much time we have left.

[xpensive]

Just the introduction of full-bodies would make a world of differece energy-wise, see:

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6816

[Jersey Tom]

The rules, regulations, stipulations, and technology behind F1 mean nothing. Nothing. Doesn't make a damn bit of difference if it's V10, V10, V6, I4... gasoline, ethanol, diesel... slicks, grooved tires... wild aerodynamics or none.

F1 is the premiere global open-wheel racing series, attracting the best talent among drivers, engineers, and management. That is all.

The concept of trying to pioneer stuff in F1 to carry over to the consumer market.. is a load of crap. Ploy.

The concept of being green in F1 to save the environment, likewise a gimmick and a ploy.

That is all.

[flynfrog]

my thoughts exactly JT

[Giblet]

It is not about making the actual racing greener, it is about advancing greener technology, but it seems that is waste to many of you as well, guess you'll all go back to your home planet after this one is fully destroyed.

Just as racing helped advance safety technology, and braking tech & engine technology, it can do the same for greener, environmentally responsible technology.

If I built a race team from the ground up, and I made it into a successful one because I love auto racing, and then 20 years later I was told I had to start finding ways to save the planet, I would be right pissed.

I want to work on racing car to make it fast, not find ways to make concessions to the planet.

I am for saving the Earth, and honestly, have likely done more selfless acts to try to save it than most people here, and doing it via a racing car is not the way to go, me thinks.

F1 will not save the planet, but it should have a push to at least minimize their footprint on the Earth to a reasonable level.

Going door to door for almost a full year, in the rain, snow, and sun, collecting donations from people to pay scientists to research the decline of the Western Spotted Owl was how I chose to do it. When we started there was around 30 breeding pairs left in the world, and all of them were pocketed into a small corner of BC, which happened to be land that was all ready to be timbered.

The logging companies that were in that area, after these independent researchers did the surveying required to prove that the logging is declining the species to the point of extinction, were asked and convinced to pull out of these 13 cut blocks that were issued as part of their tree license. No violence, no jumping up and down with a placard, just good honest work towards a goal, and not allowing anyone to convince you what you are doing is stupid or pointless.

The species is by no means out of the woods yet, but they are no longer being dwindled, and might be able to recover.

A waste of time? Maybe, but to me that feels like a better way for energy to be focused.

FYI - Nothing to do with GreenPeace.

Western Canada Wilderness Committee is a not for profit group (NGO) whose primary mission is to educate first, ask for help second, and never take direct illegal action, like some boat ramming types.

[xpensive]

The concept of trying to pioneer stuff in F1 to carry over to the consumer market.. is a load of crap. Ploy.

The concept of being green in F1 to save the environment, likewise a gimmick and a ploy.

That is all.

Difficult one this, some people would argue the symbolic value of racing on a "green" agenda, like CART running on Methanol.

However, problem runs deeper than this I'm afraid, with dwindling oil-reserves and increasing gasoline consumption in countries like China and India, the days of individual people going to work in their own car might end within our lifetime.

There are simply no substitutes for gasoline on any significant scale today, the cost and energy-density of petroleum is superior to anything else we know, no matter what journos and politicians wants us to belive.

Ethanol is a dead end energy-wise with a 10% efficiency in the manufacturing process, besides there are not enough carbohydrates grown in this world to make a serious impact.

With electricity, problem seems to be not only the storage, but also charging, to charge the energy equal of 60 liters of gasoline, 2 GJ, in six hours, you need a 100 kW connection.

[The_Man]

http://kn.theiet.org/magazine/issues/09 ... s-0910.cfm

I think this is so cool. Not only the fact that the perfect eco-car but also it implements amazing new technology. 3D woven carrot fiber I think is amazing. I had personally never thought about recycling Carbon Fiber.

Warwick University.. Respect!

[Shrek]

What about spec items like tires

[Ciro Pabón]

...
The concept of trying to pioneer stuff in F1 to carry over to the consumer market.. is a load of crap. Ploy.
...

Well, maybe, from the engineering point of view. However, from the point of view of marketing, there is the PR value of F1.

Any new gadget in these cars will be on the papers of the world in one week, it will be known to many of the people involved in the industry and to the "lead change agents" in one month.

That's impossible to achieve by "regular means".

For example, how much has weighted into the minds of the public the fact that VW has won races with injected diesels?

[Scotracer]

What about spec items like tires

They are spec...

[James_graham]

...
The concept of trying to pioneer stuff in F1 to carry over to the consumer market.. is a load of crap. Ploy.
...

Well, maybe, from the engineering point of view. However, from the point of view of marketing, there is the PR value of F1.

Any new gadget in these cars will be on the papers of the world in one week, it will be known to many of the people involved in the industry and to the "lead change agents" in one month.

That's impossible to achieve by "regular means".

For example, how much has weighted into the minds of the public the fact that VW has won races with injected diesels?

I'm not so sure it is a ploy if you think what has come out of F1 and motorracing ni the past. It is just they have become more toechnologically advanced. There was an excellent F! technology demonstration at the Science museum in london recently showcasing technology which has been derived from F1. I think the relevence is still there but it is much harder to see in the automotive markets.

[Ciro Pabón]

Sorry for reposting so soon: I try to see both sides, James, and altough I concurr with you, the "ploy" side in Tom post comes (perhaps) from the fact that in the past most advances (and we've posted about them) in Formula One came from racing necessities, nowadays some of them are dictated. The results show that dictatorship is not very efficient, at least lately.

[xpensive]

In order to make F1 more Eco or "greener", I believe that reducing the power-output is the most efficient way.
Keeping the 2.4 V8s, but slashing revs to 12k and output to 500 hp would probably make them indestructable as well.

Full bodywork will never happen of course, but with a little tweaking of the rules such as smaller fronts and reduced minimum weight, speeds could probably be kept at the same level. Carrying ballast, what's the sense in that anyway?

[James_graham]

Not on topic but thought people may be interested it is the stuff at the science museum

http://www.sciencemuseum.org.uk/visitmu ... rward.aspx

[Shrek]

yes i've always wondered about why have a lot of ballast they could all probably lose 20 or more kg and they still would have ballast left and the teams then don't have to spend money on that ballast and the fuel that they waste.