2nd weekend in a row where nobody is happy haha.
Ferrari didn’t win.
MCL underperformed massively.
Mercs lost a 1-2 due to some funny stuff.
Max didn’t win and made up only a few places although finished 4th in the end.
this is nonsense, the cars are checked before the race, Russell could wear out the tires and the bottom board a lot, there was a photo of Russell's tires after the race and they were worn out much more than Lewis's, a pit stop for Russell would have solved the problem I think
The tyre offset alone more than makes up for the at most 2 tenths per lap difference. Likely a lot less in terms of lap time.
Agreed. They should weigh them without tyres. Picking up marbles always seemed like a stupid thing and this would eliminate it.TFSA wrote: ↑28 Jul 2024, 22:16Farnborough wrote: ↑28 Jul 2024, 19:12Its simple now all the car that finished, minus any propellant fuel. Thats it, clear and simple. Any infringement and you're out.Not entirely true.
First of all: F1 is a different standard to other racing series. It's the most well-funded racing series there is - they can afford to do things differently (and better) than other racing-series, who are more resource-constrained. So comparing it to how it's done in more resource-constrained series is a faulty argument already.
But second of all: The cars aren't always weighed as they are (minus fuel). What I'm suggesting - weighing the car with a different set of tires - is already a practice that is implemented when the race is a wet-weather race. If a car has an intermediate or wet weather tire fitted at the end of a race, the car will be weighed with a set of dry tires (although not necessarily a new set - the rules say it's weighed with an appropriate dry-tire set selected by the F1 technical delegate).
If they can replace the tires before weighing when the race is wet, there's no excuse for them not being capable of doing it in a dry race. This may help us avoid a situation like this again. We can do better than this.
Don't resist change just for the sake of resisting change.
And so was Russell’s, they just didn’t remove the remaining fuel as they were supposed to. I guess FIA got suspicious as the car was exactly at the weight limit. If they removed a few hundred less grams of fuel so that the carbwas at some random weight above the limit they probably wouldn’t have double checked.
And for what would that change be ?TFSA wrote: ↑28 Jul 2024, 22:16Farnborough wrote: ↑28 Jul 2024, 19:12Its simple now all the car that finished, minus any propellant fuel. Thats it, clear and simple. Any infringement and you're out.Not entirely true.
First of all: F1 is a different standard to other racing series. It's the most well-funded racing series there is - they can afford to do things differently (and better) than other racing-series, who are more resource-constrained. So comparing it to how it's done in more resource-constrained series is a faulty argument already.
But second of all: The cars aren't always weighed as they are (minus fuel). What I'm suggesting - weighing the car with a different set of tires - is already a practice that is implemented when the race is a wet-weather race. If a car has an intermediate or wet weather tire fitted at the end of a race, the car will be weighed with a set of dry tires (although not necessarily a new set - the rules say it's weighed with an appropriate dry-tire set selected by the F1 technical delegate).
If they can replace the tires before weighing when the race is wet, there's no excuse for them not being capable of doing it in a dry race. This may help us avoid a situation like this again. We can do better than this.
Don't resist change just for the sake of resisting change.
Presumingly the car would have had to be taken back to the garage, drained of fuel, weighed (without the hose on) and fuel added back in?organic wrote: ↑28 Jul 2024, 23:02It's so obvious that they left 2.8L of fuel in the car hoping that FIA would just weigh the car and not check that it's fully drained. It was the exact amount required to make the car up to the 798.0kg that you'd expect the car to be without any fuel onboard.
But Merc can/will just claim that they made a procedural error and it can't really be disproven
I don’t want to set high expectations either for Zandvoort or 2025!Tvetovnato wrote: ↑28 Jul 2024, 23:12From an entertainment perspective, this race was a showcase of why focusing on amount of overtakes as criteria for entertaining races is not the right way to look at it. Just make sure four teams are in the fight pacewise, and that’s it. The rest will sort itself out. The wait for Zandvoort will be an agony…
And what a 2025 season we will have…
Exactly. They basically tried to pull a BAR mid 2000s fuel trick with the FIA, sneaky little bunch. Funny as they of all people should know it wont work. FIA can't prove they did it deliberately (most obvious) but it's still grounds for a harsher penalty imo.organic wrote: ↑28 Jul 2024, 23:02It's so obvious that they left 2.8L of fuel in the car hoping that FIA would just weigh the car and not check that it's fully drained. It was the exact amount of fuel required to make the car up to the 798.0kg that you'd expect the car to be without any fuel onboard. Beyond fishy.
But Merc can/will just claim that they made a procedural error and it can't really be disproven
Source:https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comme ... ing_15_kg/cfpachuca wrote:Hijacking the top comment to answer a few questions from the OP and hopefully clear a few bits up. (Source, am F1 mechanic that travels to every race and goes to parc ferme after the race help the FIA weigh the cars)
On OP’s point 2 about ‘somehow it being discovered they improperly drained it’, this isn’t the case. What happens is the race finishes, all the cars park, drivers get out and get weighed while pit in the fans and get the cars on the skateboards. Then one by one all the cars are weighed. This is before any work has been done to them.
The reason they then drained the fuel from George’s car is because it was already at the minimum limit - meaning they knew it would be below once the fuel was out. Also the improper procedure thing reads to me like they drained the tank but not the collector, but then said well it’s obviously already going to be under to let’s not bother getting the rest out.
After qualifying the top 10 cars all get weighed (which means Merc should have had an idea he was pushing the limit, I’m not sure why they didn’t rectify this over night), then after the race all classified cars are weighed. Every week.
That is the question I wanted answering. Are they weighed after Qualifying.karana wrote: ↑29 Jul 2024, 00:16For anyone saying that Mercedes were cheating, this comment from an F1 mechanic on Reddit might be interesting:
Source:https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comme ... ing_15_kg/cfpachuca wrote:Hijacking the top comment to answer a few questions from the OP and hopefully clear a few bits up. (Source, am F1 mechanic that travels to every race and goes to parc ferme after the race help the FIA weigh the cars)
On OP’s point 2 about ‘somehow it being discovered they improperly drained it’, this isn’t the case. What happens is the race finishes, all the cars park, drivers get out and get weighed while pit in the fans and get the cars on the skateboards. Then one by one all the cars are weighed. This is before any work has been done to them.
The reason they then drained the fuel from George’s car is because it was already at the minimum limit - meaning they knew it would be below once the fuel was out. Also the improper procedure thing reads to me like they drained the tank but not the collector, but then said well it’s obviously already going to be under to let’s not bother getting the rest out.
After qualifying the top 10 cars all get weighed (which means Merc should have had an idea he was pushing the limit, I’m not sure why they didn’t rectify this over night), then after the race all classified cars are weighed. Every week.