2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

[Jurgen von Diaz]

Red Bull is in the midst of a downfall, but Pérez is becoming more and more consistent. Pérez truly seems to prefer slower cars.

[Venturiation]

As all the developments have taken place when Newey was still there I wonder what happened.

https://www.crash.net/f1/news/1048056/1 ... ant-change

[ispano6]

Marko on Newey's absence

Red Bull's downturn in performance comes three months after design guru Adrian Newey stepping down from his technical role with the team, with Marko admitting the 65-year-old's input could be useful right now.

"Newey is no longer involved in the whole race [operation], that is a factor," he conceded. "We have a broad base, but perhaps in a situation like this, the routine and the incredible knowledge that he has accumulated over his many years in Formula 1 would help."

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/red- ... /10649863/

[TNTHead]

The first half of the season in this thread discussions were about the power struggle within Red Bull culminating in the leave of Newey midseason.
Now we see actual drop of pace. I wonder what the effect is of the turmoil at Red Bull on the focus and motivation of the team and the actual engineering work.

In the same time they took a development direction that made the setup (very) narrow in adopting parts of the Mercedes development direction of 2023.
It could be coincidence that the drop of pace started at the moment Newey left, it could be due to wrong development direction, it could be both.

Besides, what about the power units, are they (Mercedes vs Honda) equal? If I remember correctly the Mercedes did update a few things which could improve performance. Could it be that they have unleased the units after a few race, showing the improved pace (added up to the aero Improvements)?

[Sergej]

From Horner having a cocoa pops bowl to Lando winning the title: that's quite a butterfly effect, isn't it?

[ispano6]

The first half of the season in this thread discussions were about the power struggle within Red Bull culminating in the leave of Newey midseason.
Now we see actual drop of pace. I wonder what the effect is of the turmoil at Red Bull on the focus and motivation of the team and the actual engineering work.

In the same time they took a development direction that made the setup (very) narrow in adopting parts of the Mercedes development direction of 2023.
It could be coincidence that the drop of pace started at the moment Newey left, it could be due to wrong development direction, it could be both.

Besides, what about the power units, are they (Mercedes vs Honda) equal? If I remember correctly the Mercedes did update a few things which could improve performance. Could it be that they have unleased the units after a few race, showing the improved pace (added up to the aero Improvements)?

The issue appears to be with getting the tyres to work. The 2nd set of new tyres would not switch on. Leclerc also had an issue with his new set and complained he couldn't get his car to turn. Marko said they were faster on scrubbed softs, so it could be a tyre warm-up issue and they need two laps to get the tyres in the right window?

[gshevlin]

Red Bull is in the midst of a downfall, but Pérez is becoming more and more consistent. Pérez truly seems to prefer slower cars.

What Sergio prefers is a car with a neutral to understeer tendency, like many drivers. Max can tolerate more oversteer, so, like Lewis Hamilton and Michael Schumacher before him, he likes a car with a strong front end that turns in sharply and quickly on corner entry, allowing him to then balance the oversteer as he accelerates past the apex.
Sergio's reputation for tyre preservation comes from his car being more neutral, which degrades the tyres more evenly. His style is more like the "glider" style of Lauda and Prost.
The design of the car is such as to make it faster when Max drives it...if it is working as designed. Currently, it is not.

[venkyhere]

P1 - P5 = 15 points
P1 - P7 = 19 points

The only way a top5 result can salvaged out of this race, is to bolt on H and then hammer it right from the word go. Towards the end, when everyone ahead is already 10 laps into their second H stint, that will be the time to come in for fresh M and then attack. Because, going for conventional M-H-H is not going to gain anything - with that rear wing, DRS effect is barely there.

[Dunlay]

I think this car was also a one trick pony. Once that was neutered, there is a slide back, like the TD039 effect on Ferrari. My noob hunch is that I am not sure if Newey could have fixed this instantly either. This is not the first time that Newey's car has had balance issues. On another note, having trouble inducing folks like Jos around just creates bad noise. I am sure they have wise heads that would find out some solutions to the current car problems.

Max has to pray that Ferrari and Mercedes make gains to stop Lando from escaping, but it's also detrimental to Max if he gets stuck behind them and Lando escapes.

[JordanMugen]

The issue appears to be with getting the tyres to work.

Certainly. But is that because of aero balance/map or suspension, or both?

[Espresso]

Marko on Newey's absence

Red Bull's downturn in performance comes three months after design guru Adrian Newey stepping down from his technical role with the team, with Marko admitting the 65-year-old's input could be useful right now.

"Newey is no longer involved in the whole race [operation], that is a factor," he conceded. "We have a broad base, but perhaps in a situation like this, the routine and the incredible knowledge that he has accumulated over his many years in Formula 1 would help."

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/red- ... /10649863/

Which tells me that the improvements and setup changes during the race weekends was most probably heavily influenced by Newey’s input. As since he left that trait of RBR, improving the car overnight has disappeared…

[Jurgen von Diaz]

Red Bull is in the midst of a downfall, but Pérez is becoming more and more consistent. Pérez truly seems to prefer slower cars.

What Sergio prefers is a car with a neutral to understeer tendency, like many drivers. Max can tolerate more oversteer, so, like Lewis Hamilton and Michael Schumacher before him, he likes a car with a strong front end that turns in sharply and quickly on corner entry, allowing him to then balance the oversteer as he accelerates past the apex.
Sergio's reputation for tyre preservation comes from his car being more neutral, which degrades the tyres more evenly. His style is more like the "glider" style of Lauda and Prost.
The design of the car is such as to make it faster when Max drives it...if it is working as designed. Currently, it is not.

If they were to ask Pérez what kind of car Red Bull would design, this would be the result. That's why Max is their number one driver; he can push a fast car to the limit, while Pérez goes spinning through walls.

[Silent Storm]

As all the developments have taken place when Newey was still there I wonder what happened.

Actually Horner stressed that Newey wasn’t so much involved in the RB20. That’s the problem.

Newey's wife did reply to those comments by horner in a negative way on Twitter, so I'm assuming Newey was involved in RB20 development and upgrades...

[Sergej]

Unfortunately I have the feeling Mercedes and in particular Ferrari are not strong enough to beat Lando but enough to finish ahead of Max, and this will be the story of the next 2 races too.

Big point swing incoming.

[DDopey]

I am so confused when Iread these comments. Now Newey did not only run the car design, he also was in the lead with the car setup during the weekends. And that within een organization of 1800 people. It’s really amazing.