2024 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[Chuckjr]

They will be lost at sea in 2025 without Lewis to help develop the car. Mark my words.

He has been there for 3 years now, including 2024. He was there while 2022 car was being conceived.

Exactly.

[GrizzleBoy]

They will be lost at sea in 2025 without Lewis to help develop the car. Mark my words.

He has been there for 3 years now, including 2024. He was there while 2022 car was being conceived.

Exactly.

They have not been listening to his feedback or developing the car around him since 2021.

Nor will he be privy to important technical discussions in 2024.

They wasted 2022 not listening to him, only switching mid 2023 once their expected 1s per lap improvement never showed up in testing. At which point George's ability to hang with Lewis disappeared completely and he ended up p8 in the championship while Lewis fought Checo for P2.

If Lewis wasnt leaving in 2024 and had the team around him, it would be a similar story with George again in 2024.

Infact, if it wasnt for certain rain affected races in 2024 (Silverstone/Spa) where all of the control was put into the drivers hands and feet and less of the teams, I'd bet that Lewis would never have won a race this year.

[Dunlay]

He has been there for 3 years now, including 2024. He was there while 2022 car was being conceived.

Exactly.

They have not been listening to his feedback or developing the car around him since 2021.

Nor will he be privy to important technical discussions in 2024.

They wasted 2022 not listening to him, only switching mid 2023 once their expected 1s per lap improvement never showed up in testing. At which point George's ability to hang with Lewis disappeared completely and he ended up p8 in the championship while Lewis fought Checo for P2.

If Lewis wasnt leaving in 2024 and had the team around him, it would be a similar story with George again in 2024.

Infact, if it wasnt for certain rain affected races in 2024 (Silverstone/Spa) where all of the control was put into the drivers hands and feet and less of the teams, I'd bet that Lewis would never have won a race this year.

Do we know what exact technical or design issue(s) he asked to be changed, for which they didn't listen? I remember he said, we need to copy Red Bull.

[rijtuig]

They will be lost at sea in 2025 without Lewis to help develop the car. Mark my words.

Pretty sure this will be the case. What Lewis missed compared to Max is having a big mouth and slam the table with jis fists when needed. He’s too kind in the sense he wants to focus on driving only.

[PapayaFan481]

Exactly.

They have not been listening to his feedback or developing the car around him since 2021.

Nor will he be privy to important technical discussions in 2024.

They wasted 2022 not listening to him, only switching mid 2023 once their expected 1s per lap improvement never showed up in testing. At which point George's ability to hang with Lewis disappeared completely and he ended up p8 in the championship while Lewis fought Checo for P2.

If Lewis wasnt leaving in 2024 and had the team around him, it would be a similar story with George again in 2024.

Infact, if it wasnt for certain rain affected races in 2024 (Silverstone/Spa) where all of the control was put into the drivers hands and feet and less of the teams, I'd bet that Lewis would never have won a race this year.

Do we know what exact technical or design issue(s) he asked to be changed, for which they didn't listen? I remember he said, we need to copy Red Bull.

Cockpit position being too far forward was a key one.

[PapayaFan481]

Can I just remind all the people criticising Kimi for his crash in FP1 that a certain other highly rated youngster had a lot of crashes when he was a rookie.... He's now a multiple world champion. If Max could rein it in, so can Kimi.

[Quantum]

..and pointed Brixworth towards pushing like mad on 2014 PU before anyone else started thinking about hybrids.

F1: Renault Threatening To Quit Over 2013 Rules;
22:59, 07 June 2011

Ferrari and Mercedes are pushing for the 2013 engine rules to be delayed, FIA president Jean Todt has admitted.

"When I talk to those responsible at Renault they tell me they will go out of F1 if this new engine does not come in 2013. When I talk to Mercedes and Ferrari they ask me to postpone the introduction for a couple of years.

"They are not against the rules but want them postponed. So in the coming days I will keep up the contacts personally to see where we are," he added.

https://www.drive.com.au/news/f1-renaul ... 013-rules/

Great rebuttal and for the record correction.

[Quantum]

Cockpit position being too far forward was a key one.

That's a chicken before egg thing
Hamilton was clueless until he drove the car, then gave his feedback.
Unfortunately for Merc and Hamilton, that's baked in for the season regardless of how many times Lewis wanted it changed after he drove the car.

[Dunlay]

They have not been listening to his feedback or developing the car around him since 2021.

Nor will he be privy to important technical discussions in 2024.

They wasted 2022 not listening to him, only switching mid 2023 once their expected 1s per lap improvement never showed up in testing. At which point George's ability to hang with Lewis disappeared completely and he ended up p8 in the championship while Lewis fought Checo for P2.

If Lewis wasnt leaving in 2024 and had the team around him, it would be a similar story with George again in 2024.

Infact, if it wasnt for certain rain affected races in 2024 (Silverstone/Spa) where all of the control was put into the drivers hands and feet and less of the teams, I'd bet that Lewis would never have won a race this year.

Do we know what exact technical or design issue(s) he asked to be changed, for which they didn't listen? I remember he said, we need to copy Red Bull.

Cockpit position being too far forward was a key one.

Allison wasn't convinced that as a problem. That doesn't look like a convincing technical issue.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sports ... 17262.html

"Lewis doesn't like the handling of the car," Allison admits. "And he sits in a different position compared to before.

"But I'm not sure one is related to the other. I've had a few conversations with Lewis about it. And I don't think the seating position is a big factor in the issues he's feeling with the car.

"What he's right about is his criticism of the handling of the car. It's our job to fix that because that's laptime.

"But if we change the seating position, it's for many other reasons and not because we think that alone will solve all of Lewis' problems."

[Matt2725]

This whole "they didn't listen to Lewis" narrative is so tired.

I wonder, how does any team win without Lewis Hamilton giving them feedback on their cars then?

Who's fault will it be if Merc are comfortably ahead of Ferrari next season?

[rijtuig]

Yea maybe the engineers just don’t understand the feedback. Correlation of feedback requires some sort of mastery - what makes the Max - Newey relationship very strong.

It works both ways.

[Mosin123]

Do we know what exact technical or design issue(s) he asked to be changed, for which they didn't listen? I remember he said, we need to copy Red Bull.

Cockpit position being too far forward was a key one.

Allison wasn't convinced that as a problem. That doesn't look like a convincing technical issue.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.sports ... 17262.html

"Lewis doesn't like the handling of the car," Allison admits. "And he sits in a different position compared to before.

"But I'm not sure one is related to the other. I've had a few conversations with Lewis about it. And I don't think the seating position is a big factor in the issues he's feeling with the car.

"What he's right about is his criticism of the handling of the car. It's our job to fix that because that's laptime.

"But if we change the seating position, it's for many other reasons and not because we think that alone will solve all of Lewis' problems."

It has an effect on how you feel the car, If a driver cant feel the car, they cant push it. Allison doesnt drive, How would he know how the difference in seating position would affect how a car feels? he wouldnt....

Neway on the other hand, feels its important, Infact, driver feedback is extremely important for Neway, as he him self says, he doesnt drive the cars, the drivers do.

[Mosin123]

Cockpit position being too far forward was a key one.

That's a chicken before egg thing
Hamilton was clueless until he drove the car, then gave his feedback.
Unfortunately for Merc and Hamilton, that's baked in for the season regardless of how many times Lewis wanted it changed after he drove the car.

How would you know how a car feels, or its handling, or any thing, until you drive it? Am quite curious here. a driver cant give any feedback on a car they have yet to drive.

[Mosin123]

This whole "they didn't listen to Lewis" narrative is so tired.

I wonder, how does any team win without Lewis Hamilton giving them feedback on their cars then?

Who's fault will it be if Merc are comfortably ahead of Ferrari next season?

Mercedes came out them selfs and said they didnt listen to the drivers concerns with the car, and the direction they was heading in with development....... The vids are here in this forum.

[Quantum]

Cockpit position being too far forward was a key one.

That's a chicken before egg thing
Hamilton was clueless until he drove the car, then gave his feedback.
Unfortunately for Merc and Hamilton, that's baked in for the season regardless of how many times Lewis wanted it changed after he drove the car.

How would you know how a car feels, or its handling, or any thing, until you drive it? Am quite curious here. a driver cant give any feedback on a car they have yet to drive.

Exactly. Hence Chicken and egg.

And why driver feedback is bloviated, overrated mess of a metric to attribute to a driver as some mystical superpower.
You can't measure it. It exists after the fact of a car being designed and built.