2024 Mclaren Formula 1 Team

[BMMR61]

i think it is obvious the car is not dominant - it is just consistently competitive with whoever has a fast car that weekend. Hungary was a bit of an outlier where everyone else was terrible

edit, Zandvoort, not Hungary - my bad

It's consistently the best, if not always the fastest.

It's quite hard for people to get their heads round it after years of dominant cars.

As I said in an earlier post, the MCL38(B) is NOT a dominant car, it's the only car that's always competitive (since Miami). Big difference. The reason the assumptions that a 78 point lead (2 races ago) in the drivers title is/was Mount Improbable is that RedBull have a high probability of hitting back with more wins once they uncover where they went wrong. 78 point leads have never been overturned, even in the era of unreliability. 52 looks achievable IF the Red Bull team don't get themselves sorted out AND if Ferrari and/or Mercedes don't take points off Lando.

Other point, people seem to believe the cool-ade that we had a serious sped advantage over Ferrari at Monza - we didn't. And the losing of the race was on the strategy side, who had numerous options beyond the one they predictably chose. Oscar could have been used to hold Charles back on on his second set of tyres while Lando attacked on fresh third set. They just are thinking far too linear-conservative.

[BMMR61]

I still don't think WCC is a given especially if Leclerc enjoys Baku.

That's right, the threat for McLaren's WCC comes from Ferrari rather than Redbull (who have only one driver capable of a meaningful points haul). This is not a dismissable prppsition, since Ferrari have updated the floor in Monza, sorting out their bouncing from local loads.The rear suspension on the Ferrari looks supple now.

i feel that for mclaren to lose the WCC, it will be RBR finding form again more than what Ferrari do.

I don't think so, RB20 has lost direction. They are gropkng in the dark. Summer break isbover too. Even if they find a solution, it will have to be manufactured, tested on track, car has to be setup for it etc. The time left in the season is too small. RBR are in a similar quagmire that Merc found themselves in, for 2 yrs.

Yeah, but we are talking in probabilities. Ferrari look well poised to also overtake RedBull but I think we need to wait and see if the Monza revival was updates based or mostly circuit specific - I suspect the latter. Mercedes were trumped up after 3 wins but analysis at the time showed that circumstances were providential. Could be my bias but I feel circumstances have been quite harsh on McLaren's results. That and that terrible strategy team who don't know how to play the odds, let alone take a reasonable gamble at the right time. Any McLaren split strategies at work lately?

[geogate]

ferrari still have their weaknesses that Leclerc was more than happy to articulate over the radio - it wasn't a big factor at Monza, it will be elsewhere

[CjC]

I honestly think one will leave to be number 1 elsewhere. Maybe 2026 if Max leaves RBR ( for Aston??)

They both might leave at the end of their contracts
Aren’t both contracted till the end of 2025?
It’s a brave move to sign for another team next season IF McLaren still have a race winning/ championship winning car in 2025.

It won’t just be team personnel CVs that are flying across Zak’s desk every week if Lando or Oscar leave

I will be surprised if they have a championship winning car next year.

Which is why I am surprised with some of the decisions this year. I think they have a jump on others, and need to be all in to win both titles however possible.

I fully expect RB to be charging next year, and Ferrari have just upgraded. Merc is unknown, as they have stuck a schoolkid in the seat.

I’ll re-phrase to a car capable of winning the world championship.

Also to Mclarens credit, I don’t think there should be much reason to think that they’ll fall off the pace next season. To me they see to have to best grip of the current regs than most. Let’s be honest they spent all of 2022 stretching their heads and they had an inherently weak of a front end since 2019. That have had to graft their way into the position they are in now knowing what the pit falls are because they were in them.

It’s part of the reason why I think Ferrari first struggled, then Red Bull who haven’t cured it yet and now it seems Mercedes aren’t so sure about their car with its latest floor.
Sainz suggested that Ferrari lost 3
Months of development solving their Barca spec floor issue, that’s 3 months of development work for Mclaren to churn away gaining 1 tenth per lap per week in the wind tunnel it or CFD (Stella words if I’m not mistaken) and potentially that is where Red Bull and Mercedes (maybe) are now, struggling to solve their car which will increase their competitiveness on track once solved but again McLaren are just churning away finding 1 tenth a week in pure lap time in development.

If you look at Monza, if Ferrari weren’t competitive then it would have been another dominant result for McLaren.

However I do respect the competition so yes, if Ferrari and Red Bull develop a flexi wing they could catch and maybe surpass McLaren in the pecking order but it’s not a given that it will.

[CjC]

i think it is obvious the car is not dominant - it is just consistently competitive with whoever has a fast car that weekend. Hungary was a bit of an outlier where everyone else was terrible

edit, Zandvoort, not Hungary - my bad

It's consistently the best, if not always the fastest.

It's quite hard for people to get their heads round it after years of dominant cars.

Very valid point

[CjC]

Hungary was too early, and they did the correct thing. But after Netherlands they should have gone all in.

I still don't think WCC is a given especially if Leclerc enjoys Baku.

This... if Ferrari trend continues (why not?) there is no luck for the WCC if Ferrari eats the difference from MCLaren at least. Ok this seems far fetched and we will see in the next rounds.

Ferrari usually is good in Monza and more specifically on lower downforce circuits. They might still be decent in Baku with Leclerc, but I doubt if they can keep up for the rest of the season.

Leclerc has said as much.
He isn’t sure if they’ll remain competitive going into the Americas.

I believe McLaren are bringing at least one more performance upgrade to the upcoming races too

[geogate]

Im generally quite pessimistic about Mclaren championship challenges, but I see no reason to think mclaren wont be right up there next season. Mercedes will have a rookie, Ferrari have some new guy that might upset the apple cart somewhat. Mclaren clearly understands the aero philosophy they are using and they have incredible correlation.

[FittingMechanics]

I think we are currently favorites for WCC but it could easily slip away. Margins are small and things can easily swing other way around. Same obviously applies for WDC even more so. It's important for the team to capitalize while they are in position to do so.

Next season may be hard because the team will have less wind tunnel time if they take WCC this year. Right now they are getting more as they were P3 last time it got calculated.

[bananapeel23]

Ferrari usually is good in Monza and more specifically on lower downforce circuits. They might still be decent in Baku with Leclerc, but I doubt if they can keep up for the rest of the season.

Ferrari is great on stop and start tracks like Monaco and rides bumps and kerbs better than any other team. Ferrari will likely be near McLaren in sector 1 Baku, by far the best in sector 2 and broadly good in sector 3. I'd be very surprised if they weren't at least 2nd best in Baku, especially with how good Leclerc has historically been there.

Also if anything I'd argue Ferrari is usually just OK on low downforce tracks. They have simply been flattered by the Red Bull DNF in Australia before McLaren had brought their upgrades and a very unlikely win in Monza that mostly came down to tyre wear rather than pace on high speed tracks.

[mclaren111]

Lollipopman:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFPmFXtBfhc

[bluechris]

Lollipopman:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xFPmFXtBfhc

At last, we understood how the papaya rules came to life

[mwillems]

[Ben1980]

It's bloody impressive.

[bauc]

I was away, and I was not able to post here, I know Im 3 days late to all of the conversation that was before me.

We need to learn from Monza and not allow it to happen again, god know when we will be able to fight again for both championships, you never know what next year will bring, what the same year can bring, look at RBR right now ......

[BMMR61]

I was away, and I was not able to post here, I know Im 3 days late to all of the conversation that was before me.

We need to learn from Monza and not allow it to happen again, god know when we will be able to fight again for both championships, you never know what next year will bring, what the same year can bring, look at RBR right now ......

I know the blunt part of what you don't want to happen again but the reasons we have a great championship are several.
There are 7 drivers from 4 teams who have been winning, not 4 numero uno drivers battling for wins.
There are 4 teams who are so close in average performance that at each track there is a different team that is fastest, and not by a lot.
If all teams impose Schumacher-style driver orders the spectacle is....let's see, like Austria 2002 "move over Rubens" and the crowd riots. Joe Saward articulates my point perfectly on today's Missed Apex podcast https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_w24aOGwxZQ (around 39.00)
"It devalues the drivers championship by winning it with team orders". He did provide a number of exclusions to this which I think are appropriate today.

Andrea and Zak are running the show (mostly very well) and what they do will have more expert evaluation than what I or most fans can apply. I'm personally glad that McLaren are a two driver team and I wouldn't support them if they weren't - that's how strongly I feel about it. I have agreed with many of your posts but there is a way sport including F1 needs to be conducted. Manipulating the WDC in the way some think is a poor show.

In closing, your post seems to have an air of desperation about it - this is sport. The commercial part is in winning the WCC.