2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Sieper
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Joined: 14 Mar 2017, 15:19

Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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zeroday wrote:
17 Dec 2024, 18:38
F1NAC wrote:
17 Dec 2024, 14:05
Lawson will get wrecked hard by Max next year. Another rookie thrown into meatgrinder. Yuki would probably also got beaten but at this time, how much time he has in Vcarb? Can't drive it forever?
One day Max will be given a P2 driver that is actually skilled. I cant understand why almost every other team has two talented drivers but for Max they tend to be afraid to hurt his feelings and so give him weak teammates. Maybe its in his contract?

I won't be surprised Lawson ends up as Perez 2.0 not because Max will wreck him, but because i find he isn't special and at times comes off as just naturally weak.

The most commonsense decision for that seat would have been Valteri Bottas -- impeccably skilled and will happily play P2. Sure he will challenge Max for wins but Bottas is a guarantee to haul in the all-important points for the team, which is all they care about, Max feelings be damned. Bad management going with Lawson tbh.

2025 has a lot of new unique variables all down the grid. Should be a very interesting season.
“Bottas will challenge Max for wins.” You’ll be in for a cold shower. Bottas will never finish anywhere close to max in the same car. He wasnt even able to keep Max behind in a far quicker Mercedes 9 out of 10 times.

Sevach
Sevach
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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DChemTech wrote:
17 Dec 2024, 15:53

They had no issue with a rookie pairing, but did retain Max, who was obviously hauled as the next big thing, for 1.5 years before promoting him (and even then via an - uncommon - mid-season swap). They took the time for him to develop before moving up. They did not do so for Albon (due to lack of alternatives perhaps) and it did not turn out great. But here they do have the alternative. Nobody would be surprised if the more experienced VCARB driver would be promoted first. Noone would be surprised if RB choses not to promote a driver that has far less than a full season of mileage. There is the alternative with multiple seasons under his belt, and there is the option to still promote Lawson after 1.5 year if Yuki does not deliver in 2025, while giving Liam the chance to hone his skills outside of the full spotlight. It should not be insulting to Lawson to promote Yuki over him either, considering all this. So really, in my view there seems to be very, very little reason to give Lawson priority.
Agreed, it's a much different situation to what it looked like for Sainz in 2016, or for Gasly when he got demoted.
Sainz was a rookie at the same time as Verstappen(while being older) and Max won the promotion, with Max and Ricciardo RBR looked locked up for the forseeable future, his promotion opportunities looked bleak, so he wanted out from the program.

The Lawson situation is different because he would "losing" to a guy who is way more experienced than himself.
And this guy may not be able to stick at the big team for very long, Lawson's path would still be clear and simple, stomp rookie team mate, wait for Yuki to be moved or Max fall for Toto's "seduction".

ifilipic17
ifilipic17
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comme ... race_pace/

Interesting to see results prior Spain 2023 and after.

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Vettel165
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Its a shame we didnt get Bottas really. The most underrated driver on the grid.

Seanspeed
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Wouter wrote:
17 Dec 2024, 17:33
Seanspeed wrote:
17 Dec 2024, 16:09
Wouter wrote:
17 Dec 2024, 11:48
Just another stupid decision. Yuki deserves the seat and rookie Liam isn't ready yet for a top team.
I really dont think it matters that much. I dont think either of these guys are all that good.
And I think Tsunoda has become a bit bizarrely rated for some reason.
Gasly was clearly better than him in both their seasons together,and after that, who has Tsunoda beaten?
,
Gasly already had 64 GP's (3,5 year F1) more experience when he got rookie Yuki as his teammate!! #-o

And before that:

- 2 years Eurocup Formula Renault 2.0/Formula Renault 2.0 NEC and Formula Renault 2.0 Alps.

- 1 year Formula Renault 3.5 Series

- 3 years GP2 Series

- 2 races in Formula E

- 1 year in the Super Formula in Japan!!!

Yuki only drove 1 year in F3 and 1 year in F2 and you want to compare them as teammates?! :roll:
I'm sorry, but if after two seasons, a guy is still struggling to compete with even a fairly mediocre driver like Gasly(who already had washed out of Red Bull, let's not forget), I definitely do not think that is 'top team' material. And F1 is not typically a sport where drivers need many years to get up to speed. You tend to either have it or you dont in terms of raw competitiveness.

Maybe y'all have some low standards given Perez's year, but Tsunoda would hardly be some inspiring pick for what is one of the highest profile seats on the grid.

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Wouter
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Image

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The Power of Dreams!

DChemTech
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Seanspeed wrote:
18 Dec 2024, 15:21
Wouter wrote:
17 Dec 2024, 17:33
Seanspeed wrote:
17 Dec 2024, 16:09

I really dont think it matters that much. I dont think either of these guys are all that good.
And I think Tsunoda has become a bit bizarrely rated for some reason.
Gasly was clearly better than him in both their seasons together,and after that, who has Tsunoda beaten?
,
Gasly already had 64 GP's (3,5 year F1) more experience when he got rookie Yuki as his teammate!! #-o

And before that:

- 2 years Eurocup Formula Renault 2.0/Formula Renault 2.0 NEC and Formula Renault 2.0 Alps.

- 1 year Formula Renault 3.5 Series

- 3 years GP2 Series

- 2 races in Formula E

- 1 year in the Super Formula in Japan!!!

Yuki only drove 1 year in F3 and 1 year in F2 and you want to compare them as teammates?! :roll:
I'm sorry, but if after two seasons, a guy is still struggling to compete with even a fairly mediocre driver like Gasly(who already had washed out of Red Bull, let's not forget), I definitely do not think that is 'top team' material. And F1 is not typically a sport where drivers need many years to get up to speed. You tend to either have it or you dont in terms of raw competitiveness.

Maybe y'all have some low standards given Perez's year, but Tsunoda would hardly be some inspiring pick for what is one of the highest profile seats on the grid.
But on what basis can we judge Yuki is as bad as you say. Sure he won't be the next Senna. But that doesn't mean he would be bad, especially if his driving style is more suited to the RB than that of those that came before. Lets keep in mind that Gasly, Albon and Perez all showed good driving skills in other teams, they just binned it in the RB and seemingly the more it was tuned towards Max' liking, the more they struggled. In that light it seems smarter to opt for a decent driver with a preference similar to Max, than for a good driver that has opposite requirements. And based on Yukis own feedback, he may just be that person.

JPower
JPower
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Seanspeed wrote:
18 Dec 2024, 15:21
Wouter wrote:
17 Dec 2024, 17:33
Seanspeed wrote:
17 Dec 2024, 16:09

I really dont think it matters that much. I dont think either of these guys are all that good.
And I think Tsunoda has become a bit bizarrely rated for some reason.
Gasly was clearly better than him in both their seasons together,and after that, who has Tsunoda beaten?
,
Gasly already had 64 GP's (3,5 year F1) more experience when he got rookie Yuki as his teammate!! #-o

And before that:

- 2 years Eurocup Formula Renault 2.0/Formula Renault 2.0 NEC and Formula Renault 2.0 Alps.

- 1 year Formula Renault 3.5 Series

- 3 years GP2 Series

- 2 races in Formula E

- 1 year in the Super Formula in Japan!!!

Yuki only drove 1 year in F3 and 1 year in F2 and you want to compare them as teammates?! :roll:
I'm sorry, but if after two seasons, a guy is still struggling to compete with even a fairly mediocre driver like Gasly(who already had washed out of Red Bull, let's not forget), I definitely do not think that is 'top team' material. And F1 is not typically a sport where drivers need many years to get up to speed. You tend to either have it or you dont in terms of raw competitiveness.

Maybe y'all have some low standards given Perez's year, but Tsunoda would hardly be some inspiring pick for what is one of the highest profile seats on the grid.
Gasly isn’t mediocre. He didn’t perform well at RBR but he’s been fairly solid since.

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langedweil
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Sergio Perez has confirmed the news that he is leaving Red Bull after four years. Both parties have reached an agreement to terminate the current contract.

Red Bull will only announce later who will be Max Verstappen's new teammate, expected to be Liam Lawson.
HuggaWugga !

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organic
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Wouter
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Last edited by Wouter on 18 Dec 2024, 19:12, edited 2 times in total.
The Power of Dreams!

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langedweil
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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langedweil wrote:
18 Dec 2024, 19:04
Hmm, original post is already been removed ..
HuggaWugga !

Italiano
Italiano
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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#Forza Michael #Forza Jules

CMSMJ1
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Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Checo did well to get the drive but this last season was poor. Good luck to him

Hope to see Yuki get a chance, but do like Lawson so I'm sure either way it'll be interesting to get some fresh blood at the top of the grid
IMPERATOR REX ANGLORUM

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Juzh
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Joined: 06 Oct 2012, 08:45

Re: 2024 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Perez had to go, but candidates for his seat are not that much better.