I would love to see a woman in F1 but...

[Hoffman900]

This is the problem for me. Power steering is one factor but how many of you want to see a woman driving an F1 car in high level with a neck like HULK as all the drivers have?

Women compete in MMA, boxing, and Roman Greco wrestling, where neck strength is as or more important than F1 drivers. This is a non issue. Everything F1 drivers do, people in those sports have been doing forever… the movements and training routines all came from there.

Leg strength is also a non-issue. Spend any amount of time around collegiate women rugby players, field hockey players, rowers, and competitive Olympic weight lifters and it’s a non issue. Hell my gym has several 30 something moms who compete in powerlifting and oly lifting competitions as hobbyists and can back squat north of 115kg, some of them run pretty decent 5k times on top of that too.

F1 drivers have fantastic endurance and quick reflexes, but this elite physical thing is a bit hype and self aggrandizing. For example, I have had friends who have raced against Bottas on bicycles as hobbyists. And while Bottas is extremely fit and fast on a bike, my friends who are serious amatuer cyclists still beat him. That’s not to say they can drive a F1 car because they can’t. Having seen Bottas in person, I would have no problem beating him in a weight room and an arm wrestling competition, and I am hardly elite. It’s just different.

Furthermore, every F1 driver who steps into Indy Car has to bulk up with muscle to handle the lack of power steering and the longer races, and women have competed there.

The thing with F1 is it takes a lot of money. I see $30mil investment floating around a kart > F2 career, and the reality is half the F1 grid brings in their own sponsors on top of that. So for F1 it’s not a problem of women can’t do it, it’s a matter of numbers. You need enough women with $30mil behind them, that one breaks through the other guys with that behind them.

Remember, a lot of the drivers come from wealthy families (Stroll, Norris), or they get support from manufacturers (Lewis, Oscar, Charles), or wealthy sugar daddies (Perez), or psuedo government backing (Albon), or whatever academy system they’re in (RB). None of these guys are solely there on their “elite athleticism”. There is some natural innate talent as wheelman and reflexes, but the rest of it is how much money they’ve had invested in them via track time, equipment, coaching, etc.

You didn't read what i wrote, i didn't express the feeling that they cannot compete, i said that they will need to be like Hulk's if they reach this level exactly as they look in the sport's that you mentioned.
I personally don't like that and i am not sexist because i don't wanna see woman's like this.

So women shouldn’t do something because you don’t think they’ll be attractive (to you)?

[bluechris]

Oh come on, im not saying that, i just point that ok you push an organism to beyond it's limits in some things and they became something else. Ok woman in F1 will not be like Body Builder's but you understand what i mean. Basically if this happens we will have in some tracks too much of the heads to be passengers in turns be going to the opposite direction of the corner as we saw clearly in some difficult races man to have this problem also in F1 but with woman's you will see it from 4-5 laps. Is that safe? to me it isn't.

[Hoffman900]

Oh come on, im not saying that, i just point that ok you push an organism to beyond it's limits in some things and they became something else. Ok woman in F1 will not be like Body Builder's but you understand what i mean. Basically if this happens we will have in some tracks too much of the heads to be passengers in turns be going to the opposite direction of the corner as we saw clearly in some difficult races man to have this problem also in F1 but with woman's you will see it from 4-5 laps. Is that safe? to me it isn't.

That’s exactly what you said though “they’ll be hulkish and I find that unattractive”. That is literally your argument.

That’s not true at all. Female skulls are generally lighter and smaller than male’s as well. I’m pretty sure peak Ronda Rousey would have zero problem being physically capable. Women like her can neck bridge for days and I wouldn’t call them hulkish or unattractive at all.

Maybe just stop while you’re ahead…

[bluechris]

Oh come on, im not saying that, i just point that ok you push an organism to beyond it's limits in some things and they became something else. Ok woman in F1 will not be like Body Builder's but you understand what i mean. Basically if this happens we will have in some tracks too much of the heads to be passengers in turns be going to the opposite direction of the corner as we saw clearly in some difficult races man to have this problem also in F1 but with woman's you will see it from 4-5 laps. Is that safe? to me it isn't.

That’s exactly what you said though “they’ll be hulkish and I find that unattractive”. That is literally your argument.

That’s not true at all. Female skulls are generally lighter and smaller than male’s as well. I’m pretty sure peak Ronda Rousey would have zero problem being physically capable. Women like her can neck bridge for days and I wouldn’t call them hulkish or unattractive at all.

Maybe just stop while you’re ahead…

Don't put words in my mouth, i never used the word unattractive but if you see logical a woman to have the neck of Alonso then i am ok with it because if it doesn't have his neck or any neck of a good F1 driver, she will be dead last and it will be dangerous after some laps. Its common sense.
We have a different definition of a woman i suppose.

[Hoffman900]

Oh come on, im not saying that, i just point that ok you push an organism to beyond it's limits in some things and they became something else. Ok woman in F1 will not be like Body Builder's but you understand what i mean. Basically if this happens we will have in some tracks too much of the heads to be passengers in turns be going to the opposite direction of the corner as we saw clearly in some difficult races man to have this problem also in F1 but with woman's you will see it from 4-5 laps. Is that safe? to me it isn't.

That’s exactly what you said though “they’ll be hulkish and I find that unattractive”. That is literally your argument.

That’s not true at all. Female skulls are generally lighter and smaller than male’s as well. I’m pretty sure peak Ronda Rousey would have zero problem being physically capable. Women like her can neck bridge for days and I wouldn’t call them hulkish or unattractive at all.

Maybe just stop while you’re ahead…

Don't put words in my mouth, i never used the word unattractive but if you see logical a woman to have the neck of Alonso then i am ok with it because if it doesn't have his neck or any neck of a good F1 driver, she will be dead last and it will be dangerous after some laps. Its common sense.
We have a different definition of a woman i suppose.

You have no idea what you’re talking about and your arguement is wrong and not based in fact.

Having seen Bottas in person, and stood near him, his neck is no thicker than the typical American who wrestles in high school. Women wrestle and compete at the highest levels in these grappling sports as well. It’s a non issue. Thousands of American high schoolers wrestlers, male and female, do this kind of neck training all the time. As do boxers, mma, judo, and jui jitsu practioners.

common sense.
We have a different definition of a woman i suppose.

I’m not sure if you have even talked to a woman with posts like these.

No wonder women don’t flock to male dominated motorsports with attitudes like this. Women shouldn’t stop doing something because they are worried it might make them not my type

[mwillems]

That’s exactly what you said though “they’ll be hulkish and I find that unattractive”. That is literally your argument.

That’s not true at all. Female skulls are generally lighter and smaller than male’s as well. I’m pretty sure peak Ronda Rousey would have zero problem being physically capable. Women like her can neck bridge for days and I wouldn’t call them hulkish or unattractive at all.

Maybe just stop while you’re ahead…

Don't put words in my mouth, i never used the word unattractive but if you see logical a woman to have the neck of Alonso then i am ok with it because if it doesn't have his neck or any neck of a good F1 driver, she will be dead last and it will be dangerous after some laps. Its common sense.
We have a different definition of a woman i suppose.

You have no idea what you’re talking about and your arguement is wrong and not based in fact.

Having seen Bottas in person, and stood near him, his neck is no thicker than the typical American who wrestles in high school. Women wrestle and compete at the highest levels in these grappling sports as well. It’s a non issue. Thousands of American high schoolers wrestlers, male and female, do this kind of neck training all the time. As do boxers, mma, judo, and jui jitsu practioners.

common sense.
We have a different definition of a woman i suppose.

I’m not sure if you have even talked to a woman with posts like these.

No wonder women don’t flock to male dominated motorsports with attitudes like this. Women shouldn’t stop doing something because they are worried it might make them not my type

I've heard your type is "with a pulse" so they may well race wanting to be your type, Hoffman . Otherwise, I agree. The remarks from bluechris did look remarkably like another bloke saying its more important what a woman looks like than what she can do, no matter what the intent was, this is how it reads. What is the relevance of that and do male drivers get the same critique? Hmm.

[Seanspeed]

Argument:
1. F1 drivers are elite athletes.

2. No other sport where competitors are described as elite athletes has women [successfully] competing against men.

Conclusion: A competitive woman in F1 is extremely unlikely.
/Argument

Again I would love a woman to be in F1, but I just can't see how. In order to counter this argument you must counter point 1, point 2, or argue that F1 is somehow an exception to this 'rule'.

The advantages men have in physicality are not really anything ultra critical to the competitiveness of F1 drivers. It helps, but it's not that case of the ultra 0.01% of men simply having that level of strength that women will never have that gives them all their competitive advantage. It's not like the men in F1 are some 'physical specimens' by any means. If you want to tell me that some woman could not be as strong as Yuki Tsunoda...

The entire reason that we dont have women in F1 is because out of like five thousand people who might get into racing at any given point, only maybe like fifty of them will be women. 4,945 of those men will never be good enough or have the circumstances to make it to F1, so it should hardly be some surprise that the 50 women have a very poor statistical chance to be good enough as well.

It's a sheer cultural and numbers thing.

[Seanspeed]

The https://www.chess.com/players rankings are a good way of squashing some politically correct notions, and the barriers to entry are not high, especially now that you can play on the internet.

This topic is every bit the unintended trap I figured it would be.

Lots of people telling on themselves.

[Greg Locock]

Shrugs, women in general don't seem attracted to all the same things as men in general. Obsessing about boardgames in this particular case. Late edit - MY COMMENT isn't about ability, it is about interest.

[V12-POWER]

why are there no women in F1 ? Here’s why:

Mexico 2018 Tatiana Calderon best time:
1m23.170s

Mexico 2018 FP2 ERICSSON best time:
1m19.322

[Ken27]

It is about ability, women undoubtedly have a physical disadvantage which is why there will never be a female F1 race winner. Stop this woke nonsense. They should race against each other and that's it

[Rodak]

It is about ability, women undoubtedly have a physical disadvantage which is why there will never be a female F1 race winner. Stop this woke nonsense. They should race against each other and that's it

Well Ken, thanks for explaining it to us so simply, but I think there should be no gender lines in motorsport; if one can drive the car then good luck. As I mentioned in a previous comment I raced against women in FF1600 and they were treated and respected exactly as the racers they were. There doesn't seem to be a gender barrier here in the U.S., Janet Guthrie springs to mind; I suspect she did way better than you ever could. From Wikipedia:

Guthrie qualified for and competed in the 1977 Indianapolis 500, in a car entered by Rolla Vollstedt, but finished 29th with engine troubles. She would compete in two more Indianapolis 500s, finishing ninth in the 1978 race while driving with a fractured wrist (injured in a charity tennis event two days earlier) she hid from race officials. Overall, she competed in 11 Indy car events with a best finish of fifth. During her unsuccessful bid to qualify for the 1976 race, many of the drivers in the male-dominated sport stated that the reason she did not qualify was mainly due to her sex. These comments angered then three-time race winner A. J. Foyt to the point he lent Guthrie a back-up car to conduct a shake-down test. Her top practice lap in Foyt's car would have been adequate to qualify for the field. She was unable to obtain funding through corporate sponsorship, and was forced into retirement.

[bluechris]

It is about ability, women undoubtedly have a physical disadvantage which is why there will never be a female F1 race winner. Stop this woke nonsense. They should race against each other and that's it

Well Ken, thanks for explaining it to us so simply, but I think there should be no gender lines in motorsport; if one can drive the car then good luck. As I mentioned in a previous comment I raced against women in FF1600 and they were treated and respected exactly as the racers they were. There doesn't seem to be a gender barrier here in the U.S., Janet Guthrie springs to mind; I suspect she did way better than you ever could. From Wikipedia:

Guthrie qualified for and competed in the 1977 Indianapolis 500, in a car entered by Rolla Vollstedt, but finished 29th with engine troubles. She would compete in two more Indianapolis 500s, finishing ninth in the 1978 race while driving with a fractured wrist (injured in a charity tennis event two days earlier) she hid from race officials. Overall, she competed in 11 Indy car events with a best finish of fifth. During her unsuccessful bid to qualify for the 1976 race, many of the drivers in the male-dominated sport stated that the reason she did not qualify was mainly due to her sex. These comments angered then three-time race winner A. J. Foyt to the point he lent Guthrie a back-up car to conduct a shake-down test. Her top practice lap in Foyt's car would have been adequate to qualify for the field. She was unable to obtain funding through corporate sponsorship, and was forced into retirement.

If it was simply as that, the counter question is why there aren't any woman's in F1? The answers are simple and crystal clear but basically their bodies need to become something else, manlike to be precise to sustain this kind of punishment. Yes they thrive in Airplane Fighters but the forces there even if they are bigger and they last longer, they are up or down basically and they have pressure suits that helps them.

[Seanspeed]

It is about ability, women undoubtedly have a physical disadvantage which is why there will never be a female F1 race winner. Stop this woke nonsense. They should race against each other and that's it

Well Ken, thanks for explaining it to us so simply, but I think there should be no gender lines in motorsport; if one can drive the car then good luck. As I mentioned in a previous comment I raced against women in FF1600 and they were treated and respected exactly as the racers they were. There doesn't seem to be a gender barrier here in the U.S., Janet Guthrie springs to mind; I suspect she did way better than you ever could. From Wikipedia:

Guthrie qualified for and competed in the 1977 Indianapolis 500, in a car entered by Rolla Vollstedt, but finished 29th with engine troubles. She would compete in two more Indianapolis 500s, finishing ninth in the 1978 race while driving with a fractured wrist (injured in a charity tennis event two days earlier) she hid from race officials. Overall, she competed in 11 Indy car events with a best finish of fifth. During her unsuccessful bid to qualify for the 1976 race, many of the drivers in the male-dominated sport stated that the reason she did not qualify was mainly due to her sex. These comments angered then three-time race winner A. J. Foyt to the point he lent Guthrie a back-up car to conduct a shake-down test. Her top practice lap in Foyt's car would have been adequate to qualify for the field. She was unable to obtain funding through corporate sponsorship, and was forced into retirement.

If it was simply as that, the counter question is why there aren't any woman's in F1? The answers are simple and crystal clear but basically their bodies need to become something else, manlike to be precise to sustain this kind of punishment. Yes they thrive in Airplane Fighters but the forces there even if they are bigger and they last longer, they are up or down basically and they have pressure suits that helps them.

That 'counter question' has been explained and answered by many of us here, including myself in past posts. You will, of course, not accept any of those explanations because you so very clearly have some extremely regressive views towards women, to put it quite favorably....

[hollus]

@bluechris.
You are welcome to have your own opinion. But flatly ignoring and dismissing what others write is not very forum-like.