Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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KimiRai
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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-wkst- wrote:
19 Jan 2025, 16:09
https://www.gpblog.com/en/news/323597/c ... -test.html

GPblog reported first that AMR and Mercedes will do a filming day 1 day before the test days in Bahrain.

-wkst-
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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Speculation from my side: Maybe AMR is "forced" to do the filming day (with Mercedes) only in Bahrain, because the car (or the Mercedes stuff of the car) simply isn't ready the week before.

Farnborough
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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-wkst- wrote:
20 Jan 2025, 08:55
Speculation from my side: Maybe AMR is "forced" to do the filming day (with Mercedes) only in Bahrain, because the car (or the Mercedes stuff of the car) simply isn't ready the week before.
Likely the filming day has more relevance (UK winter vs Bahrain) to maximise useful output.

Also, the "hard" structure/items will usually be on delivery earlier than last minute, then much harder to alter in time frame to test and race.

Aero surfaces though ... the production line will be chugging along delivering 1st car, then further initial race specs, plus spares, then updates in more or less continuous fashion throughout this period.

Risk in being late, obvious. But the timelines and risk would have been pinned down long ago.

GoranF1
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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So...how are the wind tunnel numbers?
"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication & competence."

Henk_v
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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Just a thought; it seems the consensus is focus will shift to 2026 soon and teams will sacrifice 2025 to get ahead on the new regs.

If you have a shed full of new toys to develop, I'd say they let 2026 slide in favour of 2025.

They know they have unfulfilled potential under these regs and they'd better get to grips with their new toys with stuff they are familiar with. They can be almost certain some competition will slack the second half of the season.

Remember when these regs were introduced? At least 8 teams bet on the wrong concept. The best concept took half a season to figure out and then some teams spent 3 years recovering from bad choices.

So why not focus on 2025 with certain gains instead of 2026 with a big chance on getting it wrong. Slap a car together and prepare for a mid season shift to 2027 with the ability for a full redesign if concept?

I see a real risk of them being caught (like merc was) in 2026 with ther pants down their legs; getting the concept wrong and nothing will correlate to get out of the mess.

the EDGE
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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Henk_v wrote:
25 Jan 2025, 12:28
Just a thought; it seems the consensus is focus will shift to 2026 soon and teams will sacrifice 2025 to get ahead on the new regs.

If you have a shed full of new toys to develop, I'd say they let 2026 slide in favour of 2025.

They know they have unfulfilled potential under these regs and they'd better get to grips with their new toys with stuff they are familiar with. They can be almost certain some competition will slack the second half of the season.

Remember when these regs were introduced? At least 8 teams bet on the wrong concept. The best concept took half a season to figure out and then some teams spent 3 years recovering from bad choices.

So why not focus on 2025 with certain gains instead of 2026 with a big chance on getting it wrong. Slap a car together and prepare for a mid season shift to 2027 with the ability for a full redesign if concept?

I see a real risk of them being caught (like merc was) in 2026 with their pants down their legs; getting the concept wrong and nothing will correlate to get out of the mess.
I think decisions like this are more complicated than appear. Switching focus to next year early is no guarantee of success. Teams rarely find success by accident or chance. Success in F1 comes from having a team where all members collaborate well, and more importantly, understand what makes a fast car, and how they need to develop it to be faster. What ever team is best at this, will win the championship

Change comes about by first knowing where you are, then where you want to be, and finally, then working out what you need to do to get there. For this reason, the journey will be different for each team, & teams will have different goals for both 2025 and beyond

Although on the surface there are big visual changes between 25 & 26 cars, and forgetting the PUs are a world apart, the reality is that there are still substantial similarities. They are both ground effect cars, where getting the best out of the floor and how the floor interacts with the ground and the chassis through the suspension is still going to the most important aspect.

In fact, in 2026 there is going to be even more importance given to the floor, as the percentage of downforce generated by the floor is going to increase, and the percentage obtained from wings is going to decrease

There is no point in a team switching early focus to '26 if for example, you still don't understand how to get the best out of this years car. You need to test your learning in the real world, and you can only do this by developing the 2025 car. This will then allow you transfer this learning over to 2026 later in the year

The thing is, Aston Martin may be in a slightly unique position here, with Newey & Cardile joining the team, they may well feel they have the knowledge to build a fast car already and just need time to do this. They may therefore feel it's better to start work early on 2026, if 2025 success is out of reach when they start

-wkst-
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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All executives of AMR say that they won't sacrifice neither 2025 nor 2026.

I still believe that 2025 could be a fun year because all teams should be closer together (like 2012). And I wouldn't be astonished for example if Ferrari fans are disappointed once again, because the sensational rumours turns out to be false.

f1316
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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Henk_v wrote:
25 Jan 2025, 12:28
Just a thought; it seems the consensus is focus will shift to 2026 soon and teams will sacrifice 2025 to get ahead on the new regs.

If you have a shed full of new toys to develop, I'd say they let 2026 slide in favour of 2025.

They know they have unfulfilled potential under these regs and they'd better get to grips with their new toys with stuff they are familiar with. They can be almost certain some competition will slack the second half of the season.

Remember when these regs were introduced? At least 8 teams bet on the wrong concept. The best concept took half a season to figure out and then some teams spent 3 years recovering from bad choices.

So why not focus on 2025 with certain gains instead of 2026 with a big chance on getting it wrong. Slap a car together and prepare for a mid season shift to 2027 with the ability for a full redesign if concept?

I see a real risk of them being caught (like merc was) in 2026 with ther pants down their legs; getting the concept wrong and nothing will correlate to get out of the mess.
I actually think the real risk is the Honda power unit, just because it will be such a big factor and is just an unknown. They could deliver a Newey special chassis and still be off the pace, so throwing everything at 2026 is an issue because so much of the potential performance is out of their control.

I do think the decision on how much to focus on 2026 will be made quite early though. If they start in the no man’s land behind the top four and ahead of the rest (or, indeed, worse than that) there’s little point trying to develop heavily in-season. At best they’ll match the top teams’ rate of development and to what end? Unless it’s winning races, it’s somewhat pointless, when a bigger potential opportunity (albeit one fraught with risks due to the size of the impact from the new PUs) is just round the corner.

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danypons8
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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2026 is so much risk to want to be a champion.
But i think we have a final beautiful story between Alonso and Honda

f1rules
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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It doesnt matter, they dont corelate anyway :D ill find my way out

GoranF1 wrote:
24 Jan 2025, 19:44
So...how are the wind tunnel numbers?

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ispano6
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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Looking forward to Adrian Newey and Akio Haga working together with the Sakura engineers from Honda. It's always welcome when you have designers from the car side who know the Japanese way of working who won't create an uncomfortable work environment because of a language barrier like some of the folk at McLaren did.

With HPD/HRC America know how from Indy and LMP and HRC Japan's know how from Super Formula and Super GT, Honda has everything it needs to build the best PU package necessary for the next chassis regulation. What will be the wildcard is the fuel development, tyre understanding and driver synergy with the car. Alonso could be the next Senna and Verstappen for Honda, but he is starting to show signs of his age. Lawrence needs to really consider his driver options and poach the driver capable of beating the #1 driver of the top teams. Contracts are meant to be broken in F1 and going after Leclerc or Bearman might be a move Lawrence is willing to take. There is a remote chance they produce a package that is inherently better than the rest that gives Alonso and Stroll a chance to fight for drivers and constructors championships given Newey's and Honda's track record. They've both have been part of F1s golden ages and perhaps could have had won the championship with Mansell and Button had they stayed in F1 longer with each of the drivers winning the crown after Honda's departure.

Farnborough
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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Given that it's a very interesting change to Honda engine, the importance of personnel involved AND a change in rules .... shouldn't there be a dedicated thread for Aston Martin Honda speculation to encompass so fundamental a difference to this years AMR25 topic ?

It's a significant milestone, making separation from this years car with Mercedes-Benz PU & gearbox architecture all the more important.

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hollus
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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Car (well, speculation) thread over here. Please remember to separate car threads form team threads. Thanks.

BTW, feel free to open that AM-H thread. A gnetle reminder tu all users that everyone can open new threads (New topic button).
In most cases, the majority is below the average.

KimiRai
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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Aston/Mercedes?


Vappy
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Re: Aston Martin AMR25 Speculation Thread

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KimiRai wrote:
09 Feb 2025, 23:53
Aston/Mercedes?

Context.. ?