Is KERS going to be around next year?

[ISLAMATRON]

And now FErrari wants to supply a standard KERS... because that is the basis of the "technical DNA" of F1

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/n ... 4324.shtml

disregard the title since the FIA is not once mentioned in the story

[flynfrog]

And now FErrari wants to supply a standard KERS... because that is the basis of the "technical DNA" of F1

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/n ... 4324.shtml

disregard the title since the FIA is not once mentioned in the story

Hmm I see no where in that article where anybody but the FIA wants KERS.

Next year, KERS is again allowed, but the Formula One Teams’ Association have agreed a gentleman's pact to ignore those relevant sections of the technical regulations. However, according to Auto Motor und Sport, the apparent KERS snub might be short-lived.

The publication reports that Ferrari's KERS component suppliers MTS and Saft are being lined up to supply a standard system in 2011 for a fee of €2m per team.

[ISLAMATRON]

Mosley has publicly stated that he does not favor standard KERS, it has been FErrari that has led the way against KERS.

You think FErrari has no claim to wether the KERS systems it helped develope get used?

[flynfrog]

Mosley has publicly stated that he does not favor standard KERS, it has been FErrari that has led the way against KERS.

You think FErrari has no claim to wether the KERS systems it helped develope get used?

The same way the Merc ECU is being used?
Last I checked Ferrari were in the front of the line to dump KERS.

[WhiteBlue]

Fota is discussing KERS again for 2011. I think they will do the dumb thing and go for a spec system by Magneti Marelli or the Williams system. KERS needs to be a performance discriminator in my view.

[autogyro]

Fota is discussing KERS again for 2011. I think they will do the dumb thing and go for a spec system by Magneti Marelli or the Williams system. KERS needs to be a performance discriminator in my view.

If they do go for a standard system they will be destroying both the basic concept of Kers and also the potentialy high level and rapid development of hybrid technology for road vehicles and the resulting benefits for ordinary road users including the eventual huge reduction in everyones transport costs!!!!
It would be a typical self serving narrow minded corrupt decision motivated by the manufacturers of gas guzzling environmentaly damaging and ancient concepts.

[WhiteBlue]

I think there would be much concern that Mercedes and Ferrari would get away with hiding huge development costs in their road car departments and that the teams themselves would not have the human resources to compete in the field. Complicated supply rules will have to be set up to insure that teams will have a suitable system by Cosworth or an independant supplier at reasonable cost and competitiveness. I sympathize to a certain degree with such concerns but I believe they will have to sort it out some way. If they wait until a new propulsion formula comes up they will have even more problems.

Williams/Cosworth could also profit from close cooperation but I understand they are pro competition and against a spec system which is understandable.

[Just_a_fan]

Fota is discussing KERS again for 2011. I think they will do the dumb thing and go for a spec system by Magneti Marelli or the Williams system. KERS needs to be a performance discriminator in my view.

If they use Ferrari's system next year, it will be a discriminator. Well, based on the reliability of the system it will certainly add an element of randomness to the races...

If they use a standard system it should be the only decent one out there - the Merc/McL one.

[Giblet]

I disagree. The Williams system is now commercially available, and can run a whole season with no rebuilds needed.

It also doesn't require turfing the batteries after one or two races, as it has none. Smaller team who would use a system from Macca or Ferrari might not be able to afford constant garbaging of batteries, and would suffer.

[autogyro]

Fota is discussing KERS again for 2011. I think they will do the dumb thing and go for a spec system by Magneti Marelli or the Williams system. KERS needs to be a performance discriminator in my view.

If they use Ferrari's system next year, it will be a discriminator. Well, based on the reliability of the system it will certainly add an element of randomness to the races...

If they use a standard system it should be the only decent one out there - the Merc/McL one.

The Merc McLaren one is still only a basic first generation Kers bolted to a conventional power train.
That concept is at least 12 Months out of date.

[xpensive]

I guess some of you know by now what I think on this matter, but even I can be reasonable, why I think the FIA need to specify the technical condition carefully before KERS is brought back. 400 kJ or as much as you can get?

I think even WB agrees with me on this?

[WhiteBlue]

Limiting KERS makes as much sense as --- for virginity.

[Edis]

Fota is discussing KERS again for 2011. I think they will do the dumb thing and go for a spec system by Magneti Marelli or the Williams system. KERS needs to be a performance discriminator in my view.

If they use Ferrari's system next year, it will be a discriminator. Well, based on the reliability of the system it will certainly add an element of randomness to the races...

If they use a standard system it should be the only decent one out there - the Merc/McL one.

The Merc McLaren one is still only a basic first generation Kers bolted to a conventional power train.
That concept is at least 12 Months out of date.

Like usual you talk more than you understand!

Mercedes system has a motorgenerator bolted to the front of the engine just like all other KERS systems, and that is not going to change as it is ideal from a packing standpoint. The system is basically classified as a parallel hybrid (engine power + motor power), so where the motorgenerator is placed in the drivetrain doesn’t really matter. So for weight and weight distribution it’s placed at the front of the engine. That way the weight distribution will be as much forward as is possible, and the heavy wiring will be short compared to if we placed the motor in the gearbox.

Mercedes had the battery pack in the sidepod, which was aircooled. Other teams had their battery pack placed on different places; Renault had a liquid cooled pack in the fuel cell area for instance.

The weight of the system was approximately 25 kg; 5 kg for the motor generator, 5 kg for the KERS controller and 15 kg for the battery pack.

[pipex]

If the system is to be green batteries shouldn't be used, or a specific minimum race duration should be specified, along a recycling programme for each of the used batteries. Using and dumping batteries the "F1 way" shouldn't be allowed!.
I need to say that I don't know any specifics about how the teams handled the issue of used batteries last year and would be glad to accept any correction about this.

[autogyro]

Like usual you talk more than you understand!

Mercedes system has a motorgenerator bolted to the front of the engine just like all other KERS systems, and that is not going to change as it is ideal from a packing standpoint. The system is basically classified as a parallel hybrid (engine power + motor power), so where the motorgenerator is placed in the drivetrain doesn’t really matter. So for weight and weight distribution it’s placed at the front of the engine. That way the weight distribution will be as much forward as is possible, and the heavy wiring will be short compared to if we placed the motor in the gearbox.

Mercedes had the battery pack in the sidepod, which was aircooled. Other teams had their battery pack placed on different places; Renault had a liquid cooled pack in the fuel cell area for instance.

The weight of the system was approximately 25 kg; 5 kg for the motor generator, 5 kg for the KERS controller and 15 kg for the battery pack.

Sorry but I do have a system available that does not have a seperate motor/generator. It is part of the gearbox and 12cm shorter than the current unit.
Packaging is much better and the weight much lower. The patent is applied for and will be complete when I can be bothered to finish the draft asked for by the patent office. PM me and I will send a copy.