The team had a modified rear wing with revised fasteners and a new main plane with a larger central slot . The wing was quite similar to the one used in Hungary but not identical as the fasteners were repositioned .
BARGEBOARDS - JAPAN
McLaren introduced a new small front bargeboard (red arrow, below which you can see the previous version) in front of the sidepod. The upper edge of the previous version was flat for the bulk of its length, only dropping away towards the rear. Now the upper edge is peaked, with a tabletop mountain-like profile. (credit www.f1.com )
Hi just had to join to thank bar555 for this effort.
This is something that I have often thought about doing, but never had the will power to do it! So thank you again.
McLaren started the year behind because some teams bent the rules a little too fat in my opinion, but McLaren showed that they are technically the best by developing their 08 car into the winning car it is today.
bar555, you have catalogued this rise by McLaren brilliantly and I will bookmark this page and read through it a few times.
I hate to end this on a bad note, but Brawn's championship is a hollow one, as is many of his with Schumacher. He and the other 2 teams to use a double diffuser at the start of the season got away with is because the powers that be could see a fairy tale story in the making. Like another poster said in a previous page, I have no doubt that if McLaren had been at the fore of using a double diffuser, it would have been banned and McLaren fined or sanctioned.
But moving on to 2010 and McLaren will once again be a force to be reckoned with.
Jaymz wrote:He and the other 2 teams to use a double diffuser at the start of the season got away with is because the powers that be could see a fairy tale story in the making. Like another poster said in a previous page, I have no doubt that if McLaren had been at the fore of using a double diffuser, it would have been banned and McLaren fined or sanctioned.
I'm sorry, but that is total rubbish. McLaren came to Melbourne with a highly underdeveloped car, with the wrong weight distribution and missing some of the key advantages of the regulations. It wasn't a sympathy vote for Brawn - Williams and Toyota had done it too. Indeed, Honda have had technology banned in the past such as the torque transfer device on the front wheels.
Nevertheless, I'd thoroughly agree that McLaren have done an amazing "catch up job". Should there be no more hidden gems to be found in the regulations, I'm sure they'll resource themselves back to the top again.
"Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words." - Chuang Tzu
McLaaren came to Oz with an underdeveloped car because they did not pour 2 years into designing their car from a loophole in the rules. Also they put a lot into KERS, which has shown to be an exciting system and will go down as another mess by the FIA, if it indeed is banned next year.
It's already bad enough talking about the start of this season in hindsight, so lets not go back to what Honda had banned, or we will be talking forever about who got what banned.
I think unless you are a McLaren designer, you really don't know what was up with their car, yes it had underdeveloped aero, which they have said was because they hit a brick wall in their development, because they never developed a DD. Yes they had bad balance because of that and dealing with KERS.
McLaren also had a championship to fight for, so some development of 09 car would have been taken away from.
The bottom line is; If any team leaves a car, doesn't develop it but races it, like Honda did. Concentrate on a car for an extra year, concentrating on a loophole in the rules. While other teams are still developing their current car, e.g, most of the field. Even BMW were developing their 08 car well into the second half of the season, only to be questioned about giving up to concentrate on their 09 car. Even like we see on the Williams and Toyota, with their DD, they were close to Brawn, but not close enough, because Brawn/Honda had been developing for longer than them. MUCH LONGER remember.
So in a way Honda can be blamed for the demise of BMW, because, and I will reiterate, when you develop a car for over a year longer, using a loophole in the rules, while others are still fighting for points and winds and championships, it is a big head start. The big teams can't risk this loophole chasing anymore, there is too much at stake. We expect from the big teams, we didn't expect from Brawn or even Honda anymore, so they could take the risk and FOM and the FIA loved the fairytale of the big teams getting beaten. Especially after all the falling out with FOTA. Toyota ans Williams could afford to take the risk of developing a DD. Williams can survive in F1 wherever they are finishing, so the risk of it being banned was a calculated one. And Toyota need to take a risk. They have been seen to do it before, in rallying they were excluded from the championship all together. So BMW were finishing in a position that they did not see they would, they would and should have been in front of Brawn/Honda, Williams, Toyota and if that was the case they would have stayed in F1. They would probably still be fighting with McLaren and Ferrari and Red Bull, I don't know if the development race would have been the same, but I doubt if McLaren would have pushed as much as they did this year, when you have something to prove, I think teams work faster.
Strange how McLaren have gained more respect this year that the championship winning team, and how Kimi has gained more respect that Button. Not really strange. Kimi has shown his raw speed once again, with Ferrari stopping heavy development, it's just his pace keeping Ferrari up there, where as McLaren still relied upon heavy upgrades.
The FIA also wanted big change, what better way to back that up with the "farytale", because the rule changes certainly didn't work for what they were intended for. Smart thinking, but no clarity. Very sneaky, just like the FIA always are.
And Red Bull? Why did they do so well? They have a brilliant designer, a manageable engine, in size and torque (Newey got Renault engines at his request), an engine that was allowed to go through a process of "equalisation." Also, a smart idea from Newey for the rear of the 09 Red Bull, the front as well, just a beast of a car. Probably the most consistent of the front runners, bar their failures, but it wouldn't be Newey design without that, he pushed the boundaries with his aero that other elements are stretched, but not so much with the Red Bull as the engine combination was so good.
McLaren made a fundamental design _mistake_ with their car.
They had made a mistake with weight distribution, which they thought was an aero problem. This is why they were using that crazy green paint, to no avail, as they were looking in the wrong place.
As soon as it was found and fixed, the drivers suddenly liked driving the car (doesn't matter how quick it is if it's not balanced, drivers will not be confident) and results started being achieved.
EDIT: Tangent. I am having too much fun in iRacing right now.
I love BAR555 too much to consciously make mess on his thread.
Last edited by Giblet on 27 Oct 2009, 05:16, edited 2 times in total.
Before I do anything I ask myself “Would an idiot do that?” And if the answer is yes, I do not do that thing. - Dwight Schrute
Pleeze, this thread is for two things only: to say that Formula One spotter extraordinaire Bar555 rules and to talk about the technical characteristics of the car.
You are this close to post in our most coveted thread (Fanboy Ying Yang), but I won't move the posts becauses goony, Jaymz and horse are relatively new in town.
Et tu, Giblet, my son?
So, I don't want to hear any excuses of why McLaren had a bad year: limit yourselves to descriptions of the actual car, not of what could have been.
For example, Ferrari fans lived with... what? 20 years of crappy cars? They didn't complain. I used to be a fan of Copersucar, for the love of Pete, and I took it like a man.
I literally cried over this car, I can dig your pain.
Giblet wrote:McLaren made a fundamental design _mistake_ with their car.
They had made a mistake with weight distribution, which they thought was an aero problem. This is why they were using that crazy green paint, to no avail, as they were looking in the wrong place.
As soon as it was found and fixed, the drivers suddenly liked driving the car (doesn't matter how quick it is if it's not balanced, drivers will not be confident) and results started being achieved.
EDIT: Tangent. I am having too much fun in iRacing right now.
I love BAR555 too much to consciously make mess on his thread.
I beg to differ that the green paint was to no avail. It was for real time confirmation of what the CFD and wind tunnel was telling them, which was that they had an underdeveloped diffuser.
Of course they had weight distribution problems, I already said that they had KERS which is obviously going to cause weight distribution problems.
Please pay attention.It's not a competition for pointing out the obvious, or for contradicting another persons post, I'm merely trying to delve deeper into the seasons design process and produce a conclusion for the end of the season.
And yeah I'm a McLaren fan, but I don't let that get in the way of my judgment.
