autogyro's Transmission Concept

[bazanaius]

NB there are methods for measurement forces on wheels without using a dyno or a rolling road...

http://www.kistler.com/GB_en-gb/311_Whe ... ement.html

Also - I agree that the guys who work in your lifeboat or wherever desrve a lot of credit becuase it's hard. I don't think we should take away from the guys who did the maths so that the engines would also work in that environment tho. It's like saying the code breakers during the war didn't do as much as the guys flying the planes - it's a team effort.

[Krispy]

Also - I agree that the guys who work in your lifeboat or wherever desrve a lot of credit becuase it's hard. I don't think we should take away from the guys who did the maths so that the engines would also work in that environment tho. It's like saying the code breakers during the war didn't do as much as the guys flying the planes - it's a team effort.

Well said.

[RH1300S]

This thread is very strange - many people here seem determined to shoot down autogyro (and I can understand the frustration).

TBH it is fascinating, but frustrating in equal measure because there is actually very little to talk about.

So, it makes me wonder why is it talked about so much?

Autogyro - I do wish you wouldn't keep hi-jacking other threads to bring your ideas into play. When hoping to learn about current F1 technology it's just a distraction having you talking about something that isn't in use yet and you can't talk about it (but you do).

I genuinely hope you have a great idea tucked away and that it becomes public knowledge soon.

I do have a question - as I understand it, existing gearboxes are actually quite efficient. Perhaps this fundamental efficiency is one reason they haven't changed so much? A case of diminishing returns when more performance is found elsewhere in the vehicle? I know that F1 teams seemingly pursue microscopic gains - and I doubt it's lack of imagination that prevents them looking at alternative transmissions.

So - in terms of real numbers can you share with us your transmission's efficiency compared to a conventional gearbox? I mean literally take a typical F1 engine - how much thrust gets to the road with a conventional 'box and what is the increase with your concept? Tell us in meaningful numbers that even a chump like me can understand - like convert the extra power available to a theoretical drop in laptime at a particular circuit, or even a simple run through the gears from standstill to top speed.

It must be possible to do - if an existing gearbox has a finite amount of time between each gearchange - then there must be a measuarable amount of time while there is no drive over the five increments between the gears in a 7 speed 'box added to the difference in power available by the improved efficiency.

Also, balancing the gains - how much power would the system need to run itself (assuming it's using electrical energy somewhere).

[autogyro]

I will just say that in direct top gear seventh, my seven speed stepped gearbox is supported at one end by the crank shaft which is driving that one shaft. Non of the gearsets in the gearbox are moving relative to one another, non of them are creating oil drag and the output is supported on one bearing. This is as good as damit the most efficient transfer of torque from the engine to the gearbox output yet available.

[F1_eng]

Where is it available?

I literally have hundereds of ideas waiting to be developed, most of them will never see the light of day.

Tell me how many gears will be in mesh at one time and a rough idea of the size of gears you will be using. I'll see how the numbers look after a few calculations. Dynamic loads will be very high in my oppinion, I think all of know its not possible.

We simply can't load the crank bearings any more than what 18,000rpm does. Material limitations means that reducing recipocating weight is increasingly difficult.

Give me more info about this so we can see if you could ge anywhere with it or stop mentioning it is my oppinion.

I could simply say I have an engine design that doubles engine torque and is legal for formula 1 but I won't give you any details except it's painted grey.
You talk too much.

What is the output shaft support bearing size? Im sure you'd find it difficult to find a bearing that fits well in your stipulated size able to deal with the speed, not to mention the forces.

[xxChrisxx]

I could simply say I have an engine design that doubles engine torque and is legal for formula 1 but I won't give you any details except it's painted grey.
You talk too much.

I'm ashamed to admit it but that made me giggle.

Check your PM please.

[autogyro]

'We simply can't load the crank bearings any more than what 18,000rpm does. Material limitations means that reducing recipocating weight is increasingly difficult'.

So what do you mount the clutch to?
My unit has NO clutch by the way.

[autogyro]

If I said 35 or more gears in mesh at all times it would not mean much would it.
I am sorry if by answering questions I am annoying you.
For me it is great, the more you ask the more chance there is of positive criticism that may uncover something I have missed.
Nothing as yet has made me less certain of the feasibility of the system.

[xxChrisxx]

If I said 35 or more gears in mesh at all times it would not mean much would it.
I am sorry if by answering questions I am annoying you.
For me it is great, the more you ask the more chance there is of positive criticism that may uncover something I have missed.
Nothing as yet has made me less certain of the feasibility of the system.

The following question you have refused to answer.

So - in terms of real numbers can you share with us your transmission's efficiency compared to a conventional gearbox?

For example, do you have at hand a graphic (sorry, I'm pretty visual) that explains how efficiency varies and where is the "gap" your invention exploits?

It has been asked numerous times before so I shall make it a clear cut question.


Why is your gearbox more efficient than a conventional gearbox, in COLD HARD FACTS AND FIGURES?

n.b. This means I and many others want a quantative answer. NOT qualatitive. It also does not mean bash current ideas. Give a direct comparison, and state in clear sentences why you think your idea is better.

To answer you dont even how to say HOW your gearbos achieves this, just an estimate of efficiency gains. I would also like to see how you calculated current efficiencies.


EDIT: BTW don't ever get put off by my harshish tone in posts such as the above. I just find being slightly grumpy seems to get the internet working, as polite posts tend to get ignored.

tl,dr version
Figures please.
I'm not a grumpy bastard really its all for show.

[010010011010]

more you ask the more chance there is of positive criticism that may uncover something I have missed.

We cant find anything wrong because you refuse to share any of the actual DETAILS!

Nothing as yet has made me less certain of the feasibility of the system.

Of course not because we cant question it properly!! Its turning into a game of 20 questions here, only you wont even say yes or no to the important questions

[flynfrog]

[flynfrog]

http://www.carcraft.com/techarticles/cc ... sions.html

[xxChrisxx]

Interesting little set up that.

Are all drag cars manuals? I thought they had a viscous clutch/ torque converter set to hook up at just right point for peak acceleration.

[F1_eng]

Where do you think we mount the clutch?

What sort of separation forces do you expect to see on the shaft involved with the crankshaft coupling and the distance from its line of action to the crankshaft connection centre? Say for an input torque of 200Nm

These are standard simple questions which you won't answer. They won't give any big secrets away about your "design."
Or in a separate case, tell me about the casing and how it houses the gears. I find the size of the unit you describe and the magnitude of the forces I know about impossible.

Its a load of crap, I give-up after this unless you give more info.

Sell the idea to someone, there are thousands of us 10x smarter than you with the best equipment in the world and it's still very very difficult to make significant developments.

[xxChrisxx]

These are standard simple questions which you won't answer. They won't give any big secrets away about your "design."
Or in a separate case, tell me about the casing and how it houses the gears. I find the size of the unit you describe and the magnitude of the forces I know about impossible.

Its a load of crap, I give-up after this unless you give more info.

Sell the idea to someone, there are thousands of us 10x smarter than you with the best equipment in the world and it's still very very difficult to make significant developments.

But that would totally give the game away wouldnt it. It's easy to plug hopes and aspirations, a bit more difficult when you are nailed down to specifics.