USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post here all non technical related topics about Formula One. This includes race results, discussions, testing analysis etc. TV coverage and other personal questions should be in Off topic chat.
Mystery Steve
Mystery Steve
3
Joined: 25 Sep 2009, 07:04
Location: Cincinnati, OH, USA

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

WilliamsF1 wrote:
Falcon was nothing more than a ploy to keep Roger Penske from building his own car as he did in CART for many years. The theory has it that when the IRL announced they would allow three chassis manufacturers for the next generation car – Roger Penske submitted a bid to be one of the three manufacturers, assuming of course that he would provide equal chassis to some of his competitors.

The IRL didn’t care for the potential conflict of interest, said the conspiracy dwellers. The IRL would only need to point out that the cars that Penske had provided to Tony Bettenhausen for years in CART were no match for the same chassis out of the Penske stable. The IRL feared that Penske would not provide all of the necessary support for other cars other than those carrying Penske colors. So when Penske submitted a bid to be a supplier, the IRL needed an alternative – even if the car only existed on paper – to award the last slot to anyone other than Penske. Enter the Falcon. Some would say that the IRL and Kranefuss knew that the Falcon would never race, but it had performed as expected – it kept Penske Cars of Poole, England on the sidelines.

enske’s arrival in 2002 as the beginning of the end of their existence. Although the presence of Marlboro Team Penske brought a whole new level of credibility to the league, it also meant the stakes – and the cost of doing business just got higher. They thought the presence of the CART juggernaut would instantly create an unlevel playing field and they felt threatened by anything the man did.
Source:

http://oilpressure.wordpress.com/2009/1 ... n-chassis/

The quote above is a selective snippet of the article framed in a certain light, which is hardly responsible. The author of those words himself even says it's a far-fetched theory.

xpensive
xpensive
214
Joined: 22 Nov 2008, 18:06
Location: Somewhere in Scandinavia

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

Either way, I have some understanding for customers being reluctant to buy a chassis based on a regulation loophole,
let alone one that never been tested?
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

segedunum
segedunum
0
Joined: 03 Apr 2007, 13:49

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

Interesting smoke and mirros surrounding Falcon. I guess we'll never know what really happened, but you can certainly see why many Indy teams would have been rather ----scared of a very credible team like Penske coming in and eating their lunch. On the other hand, you can see why the teams and engine manufacturers just wouldn't want to have supported another chassis, but then again, if it could have given them a massive leapfrog then why not? Competition always tends to make someone jump.

As an aside, if Penske was announcing that they were entering Formula 1 then you certainly wouldn't have seen the kind of scepticism and jibes being levelled at US F1. Penske are a credible operation with a lot of history and they have people who have designed and built chassis that have actually tested, raced and even won.

segedunum
segedunum
0
Joined: 03 Apr 2007, 13:49

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

pipex wrote:I have read about some rumours in Argentina that USF1 will contract ex-F1 engineer Enrique Scalabroni....
With all due respect, it's far, far, far, far, far too late now to be bringing in someone else alongside Ken Anderson. In fact, apart from Ken I don't know of anyone else technical with any sort of credible background that they have.

madtown77
madtown77
0
Joined: 06 Dec 2009, 23:26
Location: Detriot, MI USA

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

segedunum wrote: With all due respect, it's far, far, far, far, far too late now to be bringing in someone else alongside Ken Anderson. In fact, apart from Ken I don't know of anyone else technical with any sort of credible background that they have.
On the other hand, they may be thinking more towards in season developments, in which case it probably helps to have a fresh set of eyes.
University of Wisconsin - Madison
Formula SAE: '06, '07, '08, '09

2007 Formula SAE World Champions
2008 Formula SAE at VIR Champions
2009 We switched engines and learned a lot...the hard way

User avatar
FW17
169
Joined: 06 Jan 2010, 10:56

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

Mystery Steve wrote:
WilliamsF1 wrote:
Falcon was nothing more than a ploy to keep Roger Penske from building his own car as he did in CART for many years. The theory has it that when the IRL announced they would allow three chassis manufacturers for the next generation car – Roger Penske submitted a bid to be one of the three manufacturers, assuming of course that he would provide equal chassis to some of his competitors.

The IRL didn’t care for the potential conflict of interest, said the conspiracy dwellers. The IRL would only need to point out that the cars that Penske had provided to Tony Bettenhausen for years in CART were no match for the same chassis out of the Penske stable. The IRL feared that Penske would not provide all of the necessary support for other cars other than those carrying Penske colors. So when Penske submitted a bid to be a supplier, the IRL needed an alternative – even if the car only existed on paper – to award the last slot to anyone other than Penske. Enter the Falcon. Some would say that the IRL and Kranefuss knew that the Falcon would never race, but it had performed as expected – it kept Penske Cars of Poole, England on the sidelines.

enske’s arrival in 2002 as the beginning of the end of their existence. Although the presence of Marlboro Team Penske brought a whole new level of credibility to the league, it also meant the stakes – and the cost of doing business just got higher. They thought the presence of the CART juggernaut would instantly create an unlevel playing field and they felt threatened by anything the man did.
Source:

http://oilpressure.wordpress.com/2009/1 ... n-chassis/

The quote above is a selective snippet of the article framed in a certain light, which is hardly responsible. The author of those words himself even says it's a far-fetched theory.
Very true, snippets were taken to the context of this thread (ie: bashing USF1)

segedunum wrote: As an aside, if Penske was announcing that they were entering Formula 1 then you certainly wouldn't have seen the kind of scepticism and jibes being levelled at US F1. Penske are a credible operation with a lot of history and they have people who have designed and built chassis that have actually tested, raced and even won.
Penske would have a lot more crediblity, but to me USF1 is more refreshing. There setup is more casual (still i hope they have a strong season) compared to the tight setups of the other teams. This team kind of has a more personal feel to it as it looks like a group of guys doing what they love rather than a job.

scarbs
scarbs
393
Joined: 08 Oct 2003, 09:47
Location: Hertfordshire, UK

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

New article by Racecar engineering, a recent visitor to USF1 with the car now called the ‘type1’

http://bit.ly/8XtZzY

Here's a full car CAD picture http://bit.ly/8i68KC & the rear end in CAD http://bit.ly/4pC0sx

Note: the McLaren style roll hoop, double diffuser, pod wings on the sidepods and forward exhaust outlets.

But no rear crash structure?

madtown77
madtown77
0
Joined: 06 Dec 2009, 23:26
Location: Detriot, MI USA

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

Interesting.

Is it just me or is the driver VERY far forward in that car? I undertand that with the large fuel tank, something has to give. Making sure the tank is at or near the CG of the can will be crucial.
University of Wisconsin - Madison
Formula SAE: '06, '07, '08, '09

2007 Formula SAE World Champions
2008 Formula SAE at VIR Champions
2009 We switched engines and learned a lot...the hard way

xpensive
xpensive
214
Joined: 22 Nov 2008, 18:06
Location: Somewhere in Scandinavia

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

Neat images, most of them seen before I think, but do you know if the author actually saw a car on his visit, scarbs?
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

madtown77
madtown77
0
Joined: 06 Dec 2009, 23:26
Location: Detriot, MI USA

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

Author said they saw "tubs" and that some components were being made outside of house due to time constraints.

So, no. I think they visited before christmas based on their earlier article. They just saw the first monocoques being layed up.
University of Wisconsin - Madison
Formula SAE: '06, '07, '08, '09

2007 Formula SAE World Champions
2008 Formula SAE at VIR Champions
2009 We switched engines and learned a lot...the hard way

pipex
pipex
6
Joined: 31 Jul 2008, 09:27
Location: The net

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

Looks McLaren-esque, at least the front and rear wings. I want to see the car running NOW! :lol:
Thanks scarbs
"We will have to wait and see".

madtown77
madtown77
0
Joined: 06 Dec 2009, 23:26
Location: Detriot, MI USA

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

A picture on facebook just showed up of some delivered tubs. With a whole lot of boxes of carbon fiber in the background (hey, better than boxes of other non racing components, lol) and a freezer.
University of Wisconsin - Madison
Formula SAE: '06, '07, '08, '09

2007 Formula SAE World Champions
2008 Formula SAE at VIR Champions
2009 We switched engines and learned a lot...the hard way

User avatar
ringo
230
Joined: 29 Mar 2009, 10:57

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

oil tank is in front the engine it seems.

http://www.racecar-engineering.com/imag ... led-10.jpg

Image
For Sure!!

segedunum
segedunum
0
Joined: 03 Apr 2007, 13:49

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

There's quite a few pictures of exactly the same nose structure and general cockpit/tub structure that we've seen before (that appears yet again in that article) but nary a sign of any other significant chassis part.

I await the first test session with bated breath because we won't know that they have anything until it actually happens.

User avatar
PlatinumZealot
559
Joined: 12 Jun 2008, 03:45

Re: USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

Post

Never underestimate the Americans! They really know how to get things done! That's one thing I've observed over the years.
🖐️✌️☝️👀👌✍️🐎🏆🙏

Racing Green in 2028