Reducing the drag of a two element wing through stall

[Pup]

You have to love the fact that this thing is still being debated a month after we were told exactly what it is and how it works.

[Scania]

maybe the driver can put up their hangs to increase drag during braking

[Shaddock]

Can a mod move this thread back to the MP4/25 section where it now BELONGS!

[manchild]

Can a mod move this thread back to the MP4/25 section where it now BELONGS!

I second that. So many different topics about same car, device, event etc. It's getting out of control.

[forty-two]

Got some link to that video? I'd love to see it.

I wish!! I was referring to the image Raceman posted in the Bahrain thread

Haha! Love that shot!

Jenson and Lewis don't seem to be too bothered though.... Perhaps the snorkel was an elaborate rouse all along?

Seriously enjoyed this thread, and all who have contributed to it!

[bonjon1979]

Hi all, what about this - instead of knee use foot. When is on full trotle you can "rest" your feet on some support, just like in normal car. But in this one is hole and you control the air from snokrel.

Note: This isnt my idea, I read about his somewhere and I only draw this picture. But for me is this the most possible way.

BTW: sorry my english

This is exactly what I was thinking. The snorkel inlet is right by where the suspension joins. It would seem the simplest solution. The problem with having it around the knee is that the amount the legs move when going around a corner, the g force could push the leg up against it and cause the wing to stall meaning a loss of downforce at a critical moment.

[joowon49]

Greetings, first time poster here, I've been lurking in these forums for a couple years now, ever since I got into F1. First off, thank you for all of the wonderful information regarding F1 which is just not readily discussable over here in the states. Any mention of F1 in a conversation is usually reciprocated with a blank stare.

On the topic at had, I apologize, I read earlier this should probably be in the separate aero thread for this, I would be most inclined to agree with Mr. G and am amazed this wasn't brought up earlier considering how analogous this hypothetical foot engaged arrangement of the stall control is to a previously surprising McLaren innovation:

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2007/05/24/b ... ake-pedal/

[forty-two]

Hi all, what about this - instead of knee use foot. When is on full trotle you can "rest" your feet on some support, just like in normal car. But in this one is hole and you control the air from snokrel.

Note: This isnt my idea, I read about his somewhere and I only draw this picture. But for me is this the most possible way.

BTW: sorry my english

This is exactly what I was thinking. The snorkel inlet is right by where the suspension joins. It would seem the simplest solution. The problem with having it around the knee is that the amount the legs move when going around a corner, the g force could push the leg up against it and cause the wing to stall meaning a loss of downforce at a critical moment.

Surely, whether using "knee" or "Foot", there would be a considerable amount of leakage from the body part (boot or trouser-leg) being pressed against the outlet. I guess we'll have to see if they wear a smooth patch on their overalls/sole of boot, perhaps with a rubber gasket built into it?

[Pup]

Can a mod move this thread back to the MP4/25 section where it now BELONGS!

I second that. So many different topics about same car, device, event etc. It's getting out of control.

I won't be satisfied until we each have individual McLaren threads.

Actually, looking through the posts, I guess that's effectively what we've had all along.

[twostring]

This whole thing is ridiculous.

the driver activates a system that changes the cars rear wing aerodynamics. It's illegal, pure and simple.

The ducted air is used for a purpose other than cooling, the moving air is used to disrupt the flow (apparently) therefore that air stream is a movable device and is illegal.

This whole thing is ridiculous.

the driver activates a system that changes the cars rear wing aerodynamics. It's illegal, pure and simple.

The ducted air is used for a purpose other than cooling, the moving air is used to disrupt the flow (apparently) therefore that air stream is a movable device and is illegal.

I'm curious where the line would be drawn then. I know the subject is driver activated aero, but what about other dual use items? Teams have adapted mirror mounts into aero devices, so should there be some kind of homologated mirror mount that every team is forced to use? The same could be said for the wheel design on this season's Ferrari (the odd doughnut things on the wheel that apparently aid brake cooling).

Open cockpit means the driver is always in the air stream. Ferrari (as well as other teams) use helmets that channel air into the airbox, and until drivers are forced to wear neck braces and have their helmets secured to the chassis so no movement is allowed, I'd say that the helmet is technically a movable aero device.

Not trying to start an argument, I'd just really like to get your opinion on where you would draw the line since you seem so opposed to the McLaren setup. I can see this opening up an endless stream of regulations that would most likely result in a load of standardized aero parts that would be forced on all teams.

[RacingManiac]

From a fail safe point of view the foot arrangement is more ideal...the driver will go on the brake, so the foot will be moved and the rear wing will make proper amount of downforce for braking......

[hollus]

This whole thing is ridiculous.

the driver activates a system that changes the cars rear wing aerodynamics. It's illegal, pure and simple.

The ducted air is used for a purpose other than cooling, the moving air is used to disrupt the flow (apparently) therefore that air stream is a movable device and is illegal.

I agree with you, Raptor. It SHOULD be illegal. By the spirit of the rules.
Now, can you please bring the offending part to my desk for inspection?

[enkidu]

Well the system is legal then! I must admit I have been reading this thread for quite some time and can quite honestly say I thought the knee/foot control of that aero device was too radical for me to believe it were true. I read an artical on itv-f1 and they mention the same and other teams are extremely annoyed with the FIA LOL. Apparently they can't change there cars due to a freeze in the design as the FIA has homologated teams monocoques. so they would need another solution to achieve the same.

=D> Well done Mclaren

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?id=47921

[forty-two]

Well the system is legal then! I must admit I have been reading this thread for quite some time and can quite honestly say I thought the knee/foot control of that aero device was too radical for me to believe it were true. I read an artical on itv-f1 and they mention the same and other teams are extremely annoyed with the FIA LOL. Apparently they can't change there cars due to a freeze in the design as the FIA has homologated teams monocoques. so they would need another solution to achieve the same.

=D> Well done Mclaren

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?id=47921

What concerns me a little is that although it's been declared "legal", the same has been the case in the past but when the big-boys start complaining, this decision could be overturned. I expect this will mean that this Sunday's result will be classed as "provisional" for a while yet!

DDD all over again!

[djones]

for cost cutting alone this should have been banned.

Like th elotus bloke said - it now just opens te door to a load of development in that area and you have to do it or you will be left behind.