Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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zgred
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Joined: 16 Mar 2009, 13:02

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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zgred wrote:Image

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Added 2nd deck element.

marcush.
marcush.
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Joined: 09 Mar 2004, 16:55

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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well i do not get the problem with their tank...
the 12 litre issue is really minor compared to the fuel surge they experience with less than 15 litres on board..
effectively this drops their capacity by almost 30 litres...right?
But additionally it slows them down in qualy by say at least half a second... so this
is really hurting them on how they look compared to lotus and Hispano.. (if those did ever do a low fuel run...).
so reality check for Wirth.. my feeeling is for once do not need a bigger tank ,but one that goes empty without hickup.
and a rework of the gearbox...and the rear suspension...

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WhiteBlue
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Joined: 14 Apr 2008, 20:58
Location: WhiteBlue Country

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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Nick Wirth confirmed that his company will pay the bill for new chassis parts that will cure the two problems Virgin has with fuel. They cannot get the fuel out sufficiently for qualifying and they fuel tank is too small for an F1 race distance at full speed.

NIck Wirth wrote:The chassis supplier is us. Nothing to do with engine supplier or fuel supplier. What that means is that we are fixing it for the team. We are not charging the team. It's our responsibility to provide cars that can finish a grand prix. It's down to us.

We are not doing a very good job at the moment, particularly in qualifying, of picking up all the fuel. We are at liberty to carry on doing that [using heavy fuel loads]. That doesn't affect the volume of fuel. But what we are saying is that even if we could pick up every last drop, which we can't at the moment, we've got an issue.
Formula One's fundamental ethos is about success coming to those with the most ingenious engineering and best .............................. organization, not to those with the biggest budget. (Dave Richards)

marcush.
marcush.
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Joined: 09 Mar 2004, 16:55

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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well it is wirth is speaking for Wirth technologies in this ,whereas Branson or booth are using the word- we - as Virgin Racing.
nothing spectacular there .
Wirth is admitting to mistakes and is aware of the fact that his company obviously underestimated some tasks .
It seems rather odd they did their acura Lmp1 design with cornering ability in abundance and still underestimating fuel pickup issues with their F1 design..
same goes for the hydraulic issues they seem to have booked for this season.
I wonder just why noone of the teams put that damn gearbox on a rig and tested the hell out of it and its hydraulic systemn in those last 6 months.. or demanded proof from X-trac what theyy have done to approve it..
Of course you have to follow in detail what your suppliers are doing as your possibilities are restricted at best to pinpoint design or other weaknesses ,so to wait for the parts and then for them to fail..endless discussions who is at fault and why..and the season already in full swing .. I had thought that wirth is above all this from the word go..obviously not.

RacingManiac
RacingManiac
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Joined: 22 Nov 2004, 02:29

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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Autosport has a good article by Adam Cooper on Virgin and Wirth. Its on the subscriber section on the site by I cut and paste the relevant part here:
The team still has to put up with its capacity problem for this weekend. Wirth is adamant that there are good reasons why he got it wrong, and his explanation make for fascinating listening.


"Essentially, there are four things that control the size of the fuel tank. There's the technical regulations, the sporting regulations, the fuel density, and the engine consumption. Since we designed the car – we locked the monocoque down on June 22, the day after my anniversary! – all but one of them has changed.

"The one that hasn't changed since the beginning has been Cosworth's numbers. They have been remarkably consistent. They'd been giving us numbers on their race mixtures, and they had also intended to provide a high density fuel, with the engine, as a package. So we took their numbers, and we basically designed the car.

"Because we were a small team, we knew we were going to have to build these cars cheaply. Each of these complete cars that we sell to Virgin Racing is way cheaper than a Bugatti Veyron! This car was designed for the €45m budget cap, and it is cheaper than the Acura sportscar.

"The one parameter we were very concerned with was weight, and therefore [chassis] length. The F1 rules say you can get to a certain width on the fuel tank and you can't go any wider, and practically speaking you get to a certain height and you can't get any higher. So all you can do is go longer.

"I was really worried, having built a long car in the past – the Benetton B199, which wasn't desperately successful – I was not keen to make the car any longer than it should have been.

"Anyway, when we designed the car, we were designing it with high density fuel, a certain set of technical regulations, a certain set of assumed sporting regulations, and an engine consumption. We assumed wrongly, because the sporting regs weren't published at the time, that we would be able to top the car up when we got to the grid. So in our calculations we got that wrong.

"In October the FIA introduced a new crash test with the fuel tank full of water, basically to make sure that the seat back didn't burst with the heavy loads. We had to be sure that there weren't any issues there. We were about three weeks away from our test – in fact I think we were the first people to pass that test of any team. And basically we had to eat a little bit into our fuel volume to make sure we were going to be okay for that test. We couldn't fail it, we couldn't afford to lose a monocoque.

"But the thing that really screwed us was we lost the high density fuel. At the Brazilian GP last year we were told by Cosworth that we were not going to get high density fuel. Again we were three weeks away from the crash test.

"Cosworth at the time were saying we're still working on fuel consumption. So you think, what do we do? We've got people investing in the team, what if we turn round and say we've got the fuel tank wrong? We had to gamble, hoping that Cosworth were going to do better, but they didn't.

"Even with our fuel pick-up problem – it doesn't rain it pours! – we showed we could get to the end in Sepang. Basically with our tank we've been unable to run below 20kgs, so we've been running 20kgs heavy in qualifying the whole time. We did the whole Sepang race from the start to the end on 100 and something kilos – I won't tell you how many – but it was unbelievable. We should have another 20kgs available for this race, so I'm quite excited about that!"

Interesting part on the cost of the car too...

autogyro
autogyro
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Joined: 04 Oct 2009, 15:03

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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Very interesting on cost.
I think I will get a couple of friends to sell their sports cars and put in an entry.

RacingManiac
RacingManiac
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Joined: 22 Nov 2004, 02:29

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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Just to be clear, the "Acura sportscar" is this:

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Shrek
Shrek
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Joined: 05 Jun 2009, 02:11
Location: right here

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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Did the front wing do the same thing as it did in winter testing Jerez or was it something else?
Spencer

Belatti
Belatti
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Joined: 10 Jul 2007, 21:48
Location: Argentina

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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The cost thing is fine for a team that wants to start and step on their own feet, to gain experience blablablahhh.... But you never going to reach the top with that approach.

You have do to at least what Renault did in 2005 to be succesful: dont spend in stupid things and let it all to development. Cash/Technical efficiency for all.

However, if they managed to have a 4 secs slower car and similar to the other newbies for cheaper, task 1 is completed.
"You need great passion, because everything you do with great pleasure, you do well." -Juan Manuel Fangio

"I have no idols. I admire work, dedication and competence." -Ayrton Senna

imightbewrong
imightbewrong
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Joined: 07 Aug 2008, 16:18

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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Image

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zgred
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Joined: 16 Mar 2009, 13:02

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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Image

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raymondu999
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Joined: 04 Feb 2010, 07:31

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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imightbewrong wrote:Image
Looks like they're ready to attach that sharkfin to the rearwing a la RB5/6
失败者找理由,成功者找方法

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zgred
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Joined: 16 Mar 2009, 13:02

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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Image

Newey should loss "most fragile car designer" title to Wirth.

gibells
gibells
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Joined: 08 Apr 2009, 16:23
Location: Andalucia, Spain

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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I'm guessing his 'safety factor' is very close to 1.

firefly
firefly
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Joined: 21 Apr 2009, 06:15

Re: Virgin Racing VR-01 Cosworth

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gibells wrote:I'm guessing his 'safety factor' is very close to 1.
Very true. :D