Is Vettel overrated? What do you think

[ringo]

4 tenths is somewhat of a thrashing too.
The idea that Webber is inconsistent is true, but these last races, he seemed to have found the right mindset to keep himself focused. Hope i haven't spoken too soon but things are looking good. I rate Vettel, but i am honestly thinking that he is not that fast as people think.
Consitency doesn't matter as well if we are talking about outright raw pace. Speed is speed.
He has been outpaced fair and square twice.
I say he is faster than Webber when the track has more flowing turns and the car is perfect.
However on raw speed, they are about equal. A truly outright faster driver should never be out qualified without a technical excuse.
Button has never been faster than Hamilton outright, neither has Massa over Alonso, Luizi over sutil etc.
Now we have a situation, where we can't really say Vettel is out and out the faster in the redbull team.

[ringo]

Also we have to consider that last year Webber could not be as senstitive as he wanted to be on the throttle pedal. I think an F1 driver is required to have 10 levels of sensitivity on the gas pedal. Webber's injury was holding him back from having this. I think this year now he is back to the speed he had in the old days.

[raymondu999]

I always thought that it was setup where Webber nailed Vettel. Could this be the case here too?

[ringo]

Could be, the setup is what limits the drivers.
But i have been hearing recently that Vettel's weakness is chicanes. I don't know how true that is. I remember last year during practice, i don't remember which track, the Mp4 24 of lewis was going through a chicane much faster than Vettel's rb5. It was a ghost overlayed replay with both cars. But Vettel's approach was his problem.

Maybe he is losing out to webber in the chicanes.

[raymondu999]

Nurburgring that would be

[Giblet]

I have yet to see a driver in modern F1 who is consistently consistent.

[D'Leh]

As an answer to the poll: yes he is overrated ... by some people.

The people I'm referring to are those who always are fast to claim how he "destroyed" Webber and stuff like that. In reality the two have been almost equally fast in the vast majority of events they have been teamed up. It dates back to 2007 even, when they were still driving for sister teams. Both of them appeared at the front during the same event (Fuji). They did that again in Monza 08. That can't be coincidence. The two are probably the closest teammates in terms of speed, car preferences and weather skills we have seen in F1 for a loooong time.

Imho they're virtually equally good. Hence everyone rating one of them higher than the other one is indeed overrating. Yet, I rate them as the best driver combination any team currently being in F1 has.

[Mysticf1]

+1 They are extremely close

[WhiteBlue]

Both of them appeared at the front during the same event (Fuji). They did that again in Monza 08. That can't be coincidence.

2008 Vettel was driving a Toro Rosso and won. Webber was 6 tenths behind on P3 in the Red Bull.

[D'Leh]

I know. Hence the sentence before the ones you quoted...

[raymondu999]

I'd think the Toro Rosso was probably not as competitive though...

[D'Leh]

I'd think the Toro Rosso was probably not as competitive though...

It was closer to Red Bull than todays Toro Rosso is. Even Bourdais managed to put it in the front rows, didn't he?

Anyways, you're missing my point. Neither of the cars was a contender for wins usually. Still in the only races where one of the two guys showed up at the front the other one was there too. You see what I mean?

[raymondu999]

Except for Monza 2008 However in all fairness to your comment I believe you were more on tackling the "Webber is underrated" part of the equation. It may seem that all this time I have been guilty of that as well. But then again, Vettel, Hamilton, Alonso, Kimi were people that once you saw them, you immediately thought, this guy has at least 1 championship in him. I don't think there are that many people who go on to look at Webber and say, "This guy's a future champion." A winner maybe, but a champion, I would never have bought it.

Another driver who can't win without a great car, I guess? (like Button, Hill etc... Mansell too I believe)

I do remember though that either Hill or Mansell said that their Newey cars could be driven by a monkey as it was just so planted and easy to drive. I don't think that anyone who has driven a Newey car (on its peak) has ever not won a race. Bar 2009 Toro Rosso. I could be wrong on that fact though.

the comment on chicanes is quite interesting though... But then again Vettel won in Abu Dhabi, as well as Monza. But half the time at Monza he was slicing straight through anyways.

[manchild]

I think it is the opposite - he is underrated. What he has shown so far, equals what Senna was showing in his first couple of seasons. Win with Torro Rosso on wet race = Senna's win in Monaco with Toleman. He is just too young to be expected to have consistency of a mature driver, but when it matters all factors - he is simply brilliant.

[ISLAMATRON]

Senna did not win at Monaco with Toleman... he finished second because that asshole Balestre favoring his countryman. But he did start 13th and fight thru the field and was catching Prost at an incredible rate in the rain.

Vettle's win at Monza was nowhere nearly as good, he started P1 because of an upside down qualifying and really had no competition as the best drivers in the best cars were mired in the back. Put LH, or Kimi, or Alonso in P2 Heikki's seat and all of them would have taken the win over Vettel.

I dont care if Vettle is over or under rated but please dont compare him to Senna when he has been seriously outshown by his teammate for the 2nd straight week... something that Senna never suffered by any of his teammates, even a WDC like Prost.

And Senna 1984 Monaco is so much better than Vettle 2008 Monza it is rediculous.