F1 Carbon Footprint

[Richard]

I see FOTA have pronounced on reducing F1 carbon footprint by 12.4% in 3 years.

The actual F1 cars only use less than 1% of the total. However, they are now talking about plans for giving each car a fixed amount of fuel for a race to encourage most effective uses of the energy.

Hopefully, that will lead to exciting new drivetrain technologies, and a significant premium on drag.

http://www.teamsassociation.org/press-r ... -programme

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/science_and_ ... 456984.stm (claims a 15% reduction)

ps - no talk about climate change please! Think of it as effective use of resources to save money and to avoid the need for more "Deepwater Horizon" incidents

[scarbs]

May be they want to reduce the hundreds of vehicles the teams use to transport their equipment and huge PR palaces to races in. not to mention one off flyaway races such as Canada. I think that would reduce costs and carbon emissions in quicker order than an f1 car over the course of a race weekend.

[tommylommykins]

How much do you want to bet that the pollutive effect of running the cars is significantly less than a single percent of the entire industry?

What about 0.01% or even 0.001%?

Would the fact that engines are particularly expensive, and race engines have strict reliability requirements already mean that teams are doing their best to run F1 cars as little as possible, and are therefore tiny polluters?

[Jersey Tom]

Marketing ploy / waste of time IMO

[donskar]

Good PR, but pathetic in terms of actually improving the environment.

[autogyro]

Nobody gets it do they?
Of course the carbon reductions in F1 will not make even a slight difference to dealing with the over all eco problems the world is facing.
It is the fact that F1 is the banner carrier for the top technology in the world that is the point.
If F1 does not show itself to be undertaking relevent development on energy efficiency it will die the death of all the other fossil fuel exploiting technologies and their leeches in the global markets.
FOTA has woken up to the fact that the writing is on the wall.
Well done them for a change.

[Richard]

Any business reducing its energy use by 15% is to be welcomed.

The important bit for racing is that the idea of a fuel allowance for a race. That will have a bearing on aero as well as drivetrain

[tommylommykins]

richard_leeds:

I think the laughable thing about this is that Formula One is all about waste. Completely blasting it off the face of the earth would reduce Formula One's emissions by a whopping 100% and there'd hardly be any significant shock or problems because of it.

So claiming you want to reduce the emissions of F1 by 12.5% because you 'care about the environment' is a joke. If you actually cared about the environment and not just having a wallet wider than you penis is long, there are better, easier, more effective things that you can do.

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On a slightly different note, is F1 still considered a driver for roadcar technologies? This tends to be touted as the sport's reedeeming quality, but who's to say that there isn't enough demand from normal people to drive companies into developing their own better-for-the-environment cars, without F1 being the driver for it

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Did the advertising for the Toyota Prius have any links to Toyota F1? Can I assume no? If so, would the plan of the current measures be a true project to make actual technological links between F1 and eco-car projects?

Or is it just a trick to put tangetially related ecotechnologies in both F1 machines and ecocars, so that these companies can claim that F1 is good without any truth in the statement?

[autogyro]

Or is it just a trick to put tangetially related ecotechnologies in both F1 machines and ecocars, so that these companies can claim that F1 is good without any truth in the statement?

Very good question.
It will depend on what FOTA and the FIA Commision actualy does with the structure of new regulations.
If F1 continues to be a 'control' formula that restricts technology and allows DF to dominate, then the recent FOTA statement will be seen to be just a smoke screen.
On the other hand, if it becomes a fuel limit controlled formula with more open technology aimed at fuel efficiency designed to encourage new ideas in alternate energy use, then FI may just have a future.

[flynfrog]

Im sure they will change the light bulbs in there rolling palaces and cut the fuel for less than 1% of the pollution producing race cars. Greenines will get all hot between the legs ect ect. As JT said publicity stunt

[flynfrog]

Or is it just a trick to put tangetially related ecotechnologies in both F1 machines and ecocars, so that these companies can claim that F1 is good without any truth in the statement?

Very good question.
It will depend on what FOTA and the FIA Commision actualy does with the structure of new regulations.
If F1 continues to be a 'control' formula that restricts technology and allows DF to dominate, then the recent FOTA statement will be seen to be just a smoke screen.
On the other hand, if it becomes a fuel limit controlled formula with more open technology aimed at fuel efficiency designed to encourage new ideas in alternate energy use, then FI may just have a future.

I am not sure what you want to see reduction in aero drag is probably the biggest jump that can be made it passenger cars.

[autogyro]

I do not understand your post flynfrog.
The excess DF issue is an F1 issue. DF has little relevence to road technology and has been used for many years to seperate any technical connection between the two, effectively stagnating road car development for the benefit of the big car makers.
The cars we all drive are at least ten years behind technicaly to what they could be.
If you read the latest press release from FOTA, you will see that the F1 teams are asking for a closer connection between F1 technology and its effects on road cars. DF has only a tiny place in this new incentive. For progress to continue DF must become limited to sensible levels.

[tommylommykins]

But there are many things that are common between F1 machines and normal cars.. If not wings and silly aerodynamics, then engines, wheels, tyres, pipes, etc? Do these become irrelevent because aerodynamics is so overriding?

If the connection between F1 and actual road cars is not in name only, then presumably it is a Good Thing to encourage more links between the two? It'd be better value for money for all involved?

[Richard]

FOTA said in there press release that sponsors are demanding relevance. The limited fuel idea is probably in response to that. Also, limited fuel opens up a new frontier for technology and design development.

That infers that effectiveness and efficiency will become more important. Teams will aim for less drag, and innovation in the mechanics.

As for the reduction in transportation, I imagine they have an eye on future carbon taxes and trading. Reducing energy use by 12.5% reduces your tax bill, as well as trimming costs to match reducing budgets and fewer staff.

[autogyro]

But there are many things that are common between F1 machines and normal cars.. If not wings and silly aerodynamics, then engines, wheels, tyres, pipes, etc? Do these become irrelevent because aerodynamics is so overriding?

If the connection between F1 and actual road cars is not in name only, then presumably it is a Good Thing to encourage more links between the two? It'd be better value for money for all involved?

It is essential to encourage technical links between F1 and road cars.
Without it F1 will have a limited future in the rapidly changing energy environment.
There is of course a close similarity between the basic mechanical components in F1 and the parts that make up a road car.
However, at present they are two distinct areas of development because FI has been artificialy controlled and limited technicaly for many decades,thus making sure that road car technology could also be limited for the benefit of the big car makers.
Downforce has been allowed to dominate so as to blank out most of the other technical areas of potential development within F1 and to form a convenient smoke screen to delude the less technicaly minded.
IMO road car technology in general is at least ten years behind because of this, without even looking to modern technology like hybrid and full electric.
The geni is now out of the bottle and FOTA has recognised the dangers for F1 of missing the technical boat.