Or they are fine-tuning it to make it even better . . .Whoa...hold on, they were using flow viz on the blown wing, surely something is fundamentally wrong with their design then..
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Team: Christian Horner (TP), Adrian Newey (CTO), Peter Prodromou (HA), Rob Marshall (CD)
Drivers: Sebastian Vettel (5), Mark Webber (6)
Or they are fine-tuning it to make it even better . . .Whoa...hold on, they were using flow viz on the blown wing, surely something is fundamentally wrong with their design then..
He was quoting back to segedunum pre-season.donskar wrote:Or they are fine-tuning it to make it even better . . .Whoa...hold on, they were using flow viz on the blown wing, surely something is fundamentally wrong with their design then..
Yes they were - when they already knew the car was fast and already knew they had the downforce they needed to make the F-duct truly an advantage, rather than spending months tuning something that wouldn't give them much by itself. It's now worth more to Red Bull than McLaren because they've done the donkey work.Vasco wrote:Whoa...hold on, they were using flow viz on the blown wing, surely something is fundamentally wrong with their design then..
I saw them, too. Sadly I only found the Sutton watermark pics:roost89 wrote:Red Bull, I believe, have 2 small wings between the struts on the front wing. Behind the main plain.
Don't know of any image sites, however, those that do. Can you look out for this? I saw it on TV
Hold on, you've been bleating on all season long about how the f-duct was giving McLaren half a second a lap, and now you say it's not giving them much by itself!? How on Earth do you square that one up?segedunum wrote:Yes they were - when they already knew the car was fast and already knew they had the downforce they needed to make the F-duct truly an advantage, rather than spending months tuning something that wouldn't give them much by itself. It's now worth more to Red Bull than McLaren because they've done the donkey work.Vasco wrote:Whoa...hold on, they were using flow viz on the blown wing, surely something is fundamentally wrong with their design then..
It's a case of getting your development priorities right. Just because Red Bull used flow viz to analyse what was happening on a component they'd added it doesn't mean that McLaren were right to spend the time they did on it I'm afraid.
It's giving them up to half a second per lap relative to other teams - or at least it was - and that was completely circuit dependant and based purely on a straight line speed advantage, as was explained if you'd paid attention. That advantage has all gone now, so no, it doesn't give much of an advantage by itself.myurr wrote:Hold on, you've been bleating on all season long about how the f-duct was giving McLaren half a second a lap, and now you say it's not giving them much by itself!? How on Earth do you square that one up?
Well that's conclusive then, I should pay far more attention to you and you should be a chief designer as you and Newey are clearly the only people who know how to develop a car. I bow down to your supreme knowledge.segedunum wrote:It's giving them up to half a second per lap relative to other teams - or at least it was - and that was completely circuit dependant and based purely on a straight line speed advantage, as was explained if you'd paid attention. That advantage has all gone now, so no, it doesn't give much of an advantage by itself.myurr wrote:Hold on, you've been bleating on all season long about how the f-duct was giving McLaren half a second a lap, and now you say it's not giving them much by itself!? How on Earth do you square that one up?
You compare that to the best part of a second that Red Bull added with their exhaust system and other things added at Barcelona that actually added downforce and increased cornering speed and there is no contest. The real advantage in the F-duct was being able to reduce drag for the amount of downforce generated, something that will now aid Red Bull greatly now that they have a downforce advantage.
This was explained over many pages on other threads, but few if any seemed to get it because they saw what they wanted to see. I'm not too keen on debating and doing soul searching on how McLaren have mucked up their priorities here though, merely how Red Bull got theirs right with respect to the car they have. I said this was going to happen and it has.
These kinds of posts are getting pulled by the mods for a reason, and we've already gone off-topic here enough. The original root of this was Red Bull's application of the F-duct, somewhere.myurr wrote:I would write a proper reply to you but each time I do the thread gets pulled by the mods leaving your inflamatory and exaggerated comments unanswered.
When I saw them on TV, they quickly reminded me of the Audi R15's front "non-wing". It's surprising how nobody's done it earlier.Just_a_fan wrote:Those Red Bull 'camera pod' locations are taking the p#ss. Presumably they're legal but are yet another example of the rules being full of loop holes that defeat the purpose of those rules.
Good luck to them but I'm amazed the other teams haven't queried it with Charlie.
Do you have a source for that? I didn't follow the after-talk of the qualifying but at least during the Qualifying the commentators kept explaining then Vettel either drove with a repaired or old wing while webber still had his new one.strad wrote: Red Bull only had two of the new nose/wings and so they gave your boy preferential treatment (again) in giving him the other one..
Very widely quoted in the media, including direct quotes from Horner trying to justify it. There were two wings, one fitted to each car - Vettel's suffered a failure so they pulled Webber's off his car and gave it to Vettel. That is not disputed.Mandrake wrote:Do you have a source for that? I didn't follow the after-talk of the qualifying but at least during the Qualifying the commentators kept explaining then Vettel either drove with a repaired or old wing while webber still had his new one.strad wrote: Red Bull only had two of the new nose/wings and so they gave your boy preferential treatment (again) in giving him the other one..
I don't believe that is the case - the teams have often only had two or even one part of the latest spec. Presumably this is covered under Parc Ferme under the FIA's discretion?Confused_Andy wrote:Dont teams have to have a minimum of two of the same front wings for a race (for one car), if the one on Vettel's car gets damaged they dont have the same type to replace it with meaning its a changed peice of bodywork right? Parc Ferme and all that.